Red Reposter - Irene passes; bullpen crashes; Votto bashes
- Reds outlast Nationals, finish sweep
Yesterday, Joey Votto hit a walk-off to end a 14-inning marathon and a bad week for Washington. The Reds won their third one-run game of the week against one such loss to flatten some of the tilt on the season's one-run imbalance. The Reds' staff struck out 19, which ties the club record. - The Reds now host the Phillies for four games before heading to St. Louis on Friday. Homer squares off tonight against Cole Hamels, who's fresh off the DL from a "dead arm." You can catch the game on ESPN. The Reds may be catching a break with the Phillies' rotation off schedule due to this weekend's weather.
- There's some buzz in today's game recap about Yonder Alonso starting at 3B today, but I haven't seen confirmation of that yet. I've linked this Grant Brisbee piece before on the rarity of switching to the hot corner. Still, there's precedent for big, bat-first corner guys to start off at third before moving to a less demanding position - Harmon Killebrew, Tony Perez, Jim Thome, Edgar Martinez. It's August 29; we may as well try now.
-
The Yonder profiles
Hal McCoy and the Palm Beach Post both recently sat down with the budding thirdbaseman (?). The Post asked Alonso about his recent HR in Miami, his adopted hometown: "I was so just crazy I didn't know what to expect. I just saw the pitch and just swung and before you know it, it's over the wall, and I'm like, 'What just happened?' I'm in the dugout and all the guys are throwing up the 'U' and doing all that crazy stuff."
Hal digs a little deeper and asks Yonder about growing up in a modest household. I'm a sucker for bootstrapping stories about the immigrant experience, but this is a really good read. You should check it out. "So, we got the plane from my grandfather who was there at the time, said goodbye to everybody, kept it a secret and the next thing you know, I'm in Miami. We were by ourselves - no family, no friends, no cousins, uncles, aunts, grandparents. The office cleaning was money to pay the rent. And because of all that, I never take anything for granted. Nothing." - DDN - Reds’ lack of transactions costly
Bold commentary from the Dayton Daily News, both for its criticism of the front office and for quoting a Dickinson: If Emily Dickinson was right about fortune befriending the bold, it would go a long way toward explaining the Cincinnati Reds. The Reds’ approach to the offseason and the regular season seemed more relegated toward Nyquil than boldness. If Denis Leary taught me anything, it's that the "q" in NyQyil is capitalized. Anyways, I agree with the sentiment, but the Reds are looking up at a 13-game deficit right now. A pre-season tweak in LF or having Zack Cozart up all year wasn't going to even approach making up that gap. Absolutely everything would have had to have gone right for the Reds to be in the lead right now, and that never happens.
- Rolen rehabbing well after shoulder surgery
Scott Rolen underwent shoulder surgery to remove bone spurs and fragments on August 3. The team originally said Scotty Ballgame would be out for four to six weeks, and it sounds like his return will be closer to the shorter end of the range: "It’s been a big difference for me, and it was the right decision. I give Dr. (Tim) Kremcheck a lot of credit, he did a good job. I was in no-man’s land there. I couldn’t be happier. I’m unbelievably healthier than before I went into the surgery." Rolen has been taking a few grounders and hitting off a tee. - Meanwhile, Chris Heisey started a rehab assignment in Louisville this weekend. Heisey went on the disabled list on August 7 with a strained left oblique, and should rejoin the Reds when rosters expand on September 1.
- Ryan Hanigan caught Cueto for the first time in 2011 yesterday. Ramon Hernandez sat out with a sore forearm resulting from a foul ball striking it this past week.
- "The Fall of Austin Kearns and Adam Dunn"
And this piece shall be my punching bag for today. You know how talk radio hosts, lazy writers, and perpetually angry fans like to blame a bad team's best players for the team's struggles? Here's the latest example, a purported obituary of the Dunn-Kearns years:
In the parlance of politics, Dunn and Kearns were identifiable icons, simple guys without a trace of the complexities and insight of players like Votto, who can often come off as an unknowable man. Watching the Reds during their tenure often felt like peering in on a rec softball game in central Illinois. A ticket bought you multiple home runs, lost fly balls, missed cut-off men with a modicum of fun. All that was missing was the keg at home plate.... Soon enough, it became clear that Adam Dunn and Austin Kearns were not Frank Robinson and Vada Pinson reborn. Far, far from it. The stars of the future had come to represent a god-awful present.... With this seemingly joint fall, those who follow the Reds are left to ask what to make of the Dunn-Kearns era. Having seen what they’ve become, Dunn and Kearns are no longer bantered about as "What ifs." They are simply the symbols of a great era that never was.
Anyone who hoped for a "great era" with that pitching staff was either kidding themselves or not paying attention. But as long as you're reducing the lost decade to a couple of players instead of the shortcomings of the front office and ownership, you start and stop with Ken Griffey and Eric Milton. The former unfortunately fell to injuries after arriving in the team's most significant trade since Tom Seaver came to town, and the latter represented the organization's collosal misjudgment of pitching talent. Both accounted for crushing portions of the team's payroll. Meanwhile, Dunn was a consistently dangerous power threat and, yes, a run producer. Kearns never fully realized his potential after an early injury, but played well enough when on the field. Trying to draw parallels between Adam/Austin and two other home-grown pairs - Robinson/Pinson and Votto/Bruce - is sorely misguided.
- The fifth most poular boss in baseball is our own Johnnie Baker
SI polled almost 300 players to find out which skippers are the true player managers. First was Tampa's Joe Madden, who's also won the most sabr-friendly manager designation for his hoodie and glasses. I'm surprised to see TLR finish 8th, but he does seem to gain the trust and loyalty of most of his roster. - Waiver wire musings
It would cost too much money and disrupt team chemistry, but what if David Wright was in the 3B mix for next year? Wright surprisingly cleared waivers last week, most likely because of his contract. He is owed $15M next year and has a player option for $16M in 2013 if he's dealt. He hasn't been the same hitter since the Mets moved into Citi, but still. All-Star 3B don't exactly grow on trees. - As mentioned around here, the Reds withdrew Ramon Hernandez from the wire after some unconfirmed team claimed him. Hal and Dusty speculate that the mystery team is San Francisco. Hal notes that "surprise, surprise, a San Francisco scout was at Friday’s game." No word on whether the Reds tried to make a deal with the Giants. As I've mentioned several times, I'll fail to understand what the team is thinking if they don't offer arbitration to Ramon. Redleg Nation shares in my confusion.
- The Europhiliac OverseasRedsFan investigates the roots of Hova's family name
The De Bruys (later De Bruce) were an influential Norman family in Scottish affairs in the early Middle Ages. De Bruys was one of the followers of William the Conqueror, and fought at the battle of Hastings in 1066. The tale of the most famous member of the Bruce family, Robert "the Bruce", King of Scotland in the 14th Century, who watched and learned the value of perseverance from a spider repeatedly climbing up again after being knocked down, has become a part of the world’s folklore. This great man achieved independence from England and became the King of Scotland in 1306. - With the Nats in town this weekend,
Davey Johnson returned to the Reds' home park for the first time since GABP opened. On the differences between Riverfront and the new stadium: "Yeah, there's grass and no dog poop." Marge Schott likely retorted from I-don't-wanna-know-where that "Davey was good in the beginning, but he went too far." Yesterday's home plate umpire agreed, ejecting Johnson from the game after he pressed his point about a supposed HBP too far. - Finally: someone keep Jim Day away from the Giants.
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The spirit of Zuri lives through him.
Born Small... Now Huge... Winning... Bring it..!
by BomerHailey on Aug 29, 2011 11:15 AM EDT up reply actions
Give me an excuse to post this again
#NeverForget

Dayman, Fighter of the Nightman, Champion of the Sun
I know this has been an ongoing joke for awhile
But I never caught what set it off.
What’s the deal with Jim Day and giraffes? What did I miss?
"This is the St. Louis Cardinals we're talking about. They suck. Screw them. With a shovel. The sharp metal end. And then set them on fire." - crolfer
by rorschach1979 on Aug 29, 2011 4:13 PM EDT up reply actions
He made a video for Cincinnati USA at the Cincy Zoo where he fed giraffes.
Hours later, one of the giraffes he presumably fed died.
When confronted about this, he took it as an unfunny joke and called ’coop and others “idiots.”
Ah, thank you very much
He’s got to expect some blowback from that, even if (as is most likely) he had nothing to do with it.
Still, nice to keep the memory alive from the determined posters here. He’ll never live it down, so long as there are a few dedicated souls to constantly badger him with it!!
"This is the St. Louis Cardinals we're talking about. They suck. Screw them. With a shovel. The sharp metal end. And then set them on fire." - crolfer
by rorschach1979 on Aug 29, 2011 5:20 PM EDT up reply actions
Here you go
http://twitter.com/#!/JimDayTV/status/87582119420895234
http://twitter.com/#!/JimDayTV/status/88683123956645888
Dayman, Fighter of the Nightman, Champion of the Sun
>>>

Those panda hats are cute on tots and something else when you see them on adults. Now giraffes? Of course the stupidest looking are the wedges of cheese.
"Prince Fielder is too fat even for the Oakland A’s" - Billy Beane
Wait,
Fans are allowed to love their players, not consistently deride them? Announcers can gently rib top prospects and not hope they fail? Get outta here!
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
by Cy Schourek on Aug 29, 2011 1:13 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
her placenta falls to the floor
Let a man come in and do the Popcorn.
by -ManBearPig on Aug 29, 2011 12:01 PM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
Nice.
That band invokes a near-Creed level of hatred for me.
Wear something sexy to my funeral.
by Pops Daniels on Aug 29, 2011 12:17 PM EDT up reply actions
I'll admit
I secretly wanted the shaved-head-rat-tail look from “I Alone.”
I did, for like 3 weeks. Then I was really glad I didn’t go for it.
Tequila and pancakes, anyone?
by Kevin Mitchell is Batman on Aug 29, 2011 12:20 PM EDT up reply actions
That fucker's cameo in Fight Club
is like being told that Kate Beckinsale has herpes.
Wear something sexy to my funeral.
by Pops Daniels on Aug 29, 2011 12:22 PM EDT up reply actions
well
I had no idea he was in there. Now I gotsta watch it again.
I like Live, so nyah.
A Ongreed the Deserving
-coviner's lawful neutral Paladin / Debutante character
by supergrover on Aug 29, 2011 12:40 PM EDT up reply actions
I remember they had a show
With Carbon Leaf a few years back. A buncha folks from college went up to see it. The audience musta looked like a Hitler Youth rally.
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
by Cy Schourek on Aug 29, 2011 1:09 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
I went to a Carbon Leaf show a few weeks ago at the 20th Century
I’m 33 and I might have been the youngest guy there, except a bunch of Hyde Park yups brought their kids.
That's a big 10-4
A dope trailer is no place for a kitty.
by GlennBraggsSwingAndMissBrokenBat on Aug 29, 2011 12:52 PM EDT up reply actions
I don't care if Alonso plays shortstop
Get that chubby Cuban some at bats.
by Supreme Olajuwon on Aug 29, 2011 11:26 AM EDT reply actions
Can't wait to see Scotty start the last 25 games of the season!!!
/shoots self
We're all mad. I'm mad. You're mad. Otherwise, you wouldn't have come here.
All-Star third baseman don't grow on trees
by Brendanukkah on Aug 29, 2011 11:31 AM EDT up reply actions
If the following scenario could play out perfectly, which it won't... I'd be OK with it.
Rolen knocks the cover off the ball while being in the cushy lineup position of between Votto and Bruce which leads people to believe this surgery is the fountain of youth.
Over the offseason, Alonso plays winter ball and learns to play a slightly-below-average 3B, while continuing to be Joey Votto Jr at the plate.
The Reds are able to dump Rolen to the Nationals (where all Reds go to die) and get a couple of B-level prospects and the salary dump, where Rolen rapidly falls apart again.
The Reds then make a trade for David Price, magically turn Chapman into an effective starter, re-sign Cordero at below his option, and platoon Hanigan and Mesoraco.
The Reds Starting 5: Cueto, Price, Chapman, Leake, Arroyo.
Closer: Cordero
Setup: Masset/Ondrusek
Rest of the Gang: LeCure, Bray, Wood, Bailey, Volquez
(Note at least one of the above pitchers will be injured/ineffective at any given time, so subtract one from the total to reach total roster of 25).
1B: Votto
2B: BP
3B: Alonso
SS: Cozart
Utility: Cairo, Janish
C: Mesoraco/Hanigan
LF: Frazier
CF: Stubbs
RF: Bruce
4th OF: Heisey
5th OF: Sappelt
The only wrench in my plans is I’m not sure what it would take to get a 1-year rental of Price? I think you reject out of hand any request for Mesoraco or Grandal. Would Billy Hamilton + AAAA Pitcher do it?
Besides the fact that Walt would rather date Dusty's daughter than trade Rolen
I’m pretty sure he has a no-trade clause, so he ain’t going anywhere.
It feels so nice to be back to normal
Right, which means that all this Alonso at third talk is meaningless as long as Rolen is around.
If Scotty is healthy he’ll play next year, good of the team be damned. Yonder is blocked at 1st, 3rd, and has been ruled out of LF permanently.
I don’t know what will end up happening, but I’m pretty sure RR is gonna hate it.
We're all mad. I'm mad. You're mad. Otherwise, you wouldn't have come here.
Red Reporter: Whatever ends up happening, we're gonna hate it.
Born Small... Now Huge... Winning... Bring it..!
by BomerHailey on Aug 29, 2011 11:59 AM EDT up reply actions 5 recs
Red Reporter: Unfortunately, the team.
"Red Reporter - An elitist clique full of like-minded douchebags." - BK
maybe we need a nerdy and ineffectual "bad ass" tagline
such as the ones that used to appear on the Gaming Zone:
Red Reporter: They play, we don’t
How about:
Red Reporter: We live to kick the carp out of the Cardinals.
"If you intended to debate this, you need to take a side." - johnu1
by PeteyHendrix on Aug 29, 2011 6:01 PM EDT up reply actions
Scotty isn't going anywhere
The only reason we have him is because he wanted to be near his family in Indiana, and wouldn’t go anywhere but Cincinnati.
But…he’s clearly a part-time player now. And he’s only a Red for one more year. It’s not too early for tryouts for third baseman of the future to begin.
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
Haha, yeah, you're probably right.
I feel like they know Scotty can only play a max of 120 games, but it’ll likely be a lot less. So if they’ll commit to Alonso as Rolen’s backup, and give him a few starts at 1B, he’d get 50-60 starts next season. I’d be ok with that.
The problem with this is Cairo, who will keep at least one of Frazier/Alonso/Sappelt off the roster next year.
It feels so nice to be back to normal
Don't worry.
Rolen won’t be healthy.
Wear something sexy to my funeral.
by Pops Daniels on Aug 29, 2011 12:19 PM EDT up reply actions
This is my hope, and very likely
"Wait, you think I'm being mean to the pretend orangutan?" -- battlekow
Yeah, I can't see him playing more than 80 games next year, maybe fewer.
Hopefully the team makes plans for this beyond Miguel Cairo. And again, it’s not that I don’t like Cairo, but he’s not going to OPS .760 forever, and beyond next year, he’s clearly not the answer, so they might as well put a plan in place now.
It feels so nice to be back to normal
As long as they don't resign Renteria to fill in at 3B I'll be happy
He’s useless in the field and clueless at the plate.
"Wait, you think I'm being mean to the pretend orangutan?" -- battlekow
No way. This team really needs his veteran presence and his baldness.
I think he’s the best option to start at SS next year. Not just in the system, but league wide. I’d rather have Renteria than Jose Reyes.
It feels so nice to be back to normal
by nycredsfan on Aug 29, 2011 12:28 PM EDT up reply actions 7 recs
No he's not. He's a great player. How many other players on the Reds were the WS MVP last year?!?
It feels so nice to be back to normal
Why do you hate the Reds? You really think Paul Janish is an all-star?
It feels so nice to be back to normal
I am just wondering how long this is going to continue to be so fun
Part of me thinks it will wear off after a while, but nyc is doing a brilliant job playing his part…
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
Rest assured, jch will keep it going long after it has stopped being fun for anyone.
It feels so nice to be back to normal
Nah, jch may take some relish in this (OK a lot of relish)
but he isn’t spiteful
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
I'm sorry but if you don't find that funny, you have no soul
"Wait, you think I'm being mean to the pretend orangutan?" -- battlekow
'credsfan is a ginger?
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Aug 30, 2011 11:14 PM EDT up reply actions
Isn't it strange that we hope for Rolen to be unhealthy?
I find it strange, because it’s a reasonable thing to hope, which makes it stranger.
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
Totally
I love Scotty but the Reds would probably be better off if he missed significant time in 2012.
"Wait, you think I'm being mean to the pretend orangutan?" -- battlekow
Sad, but true.
The best option is probably for Scotty to retire this offseason.
Let a man come in and do the Popcorn.
by -ManBearPig on Aug 29, 2011 12:30 PM EDT up reply actions
when rolen is healthy & plays, the reds win
seems like the best option is a healthy rolen & using our spare parts to trade for people that fill positions of need
it didn't seem likely at the point the reds traded for him
but it happened.
maybe it can happen again
That best option is probably a dream
And even if Rolen gets healthy, he just isn’t that great, honestly.
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
His bat is not very good at all anymore.
The surprising thing to me is how good his defense still is.
Let a man come in and do the Popcorn.
I'm not giving up on his bat yet
He still had decent power this year even with the shoulder problems. A lot more doubles than HRs, but he still had a .150 ISO. He also had a babip about 40 points lower than his career norm. I can see him reprising something like his 2010 if he gets plenty of rest (100 starts), which Dusty is mindful of.
simple guys without a trace of the complexities and insight of players like Votto
A ticket bought you multiple home runs, lost fly balls, missed cut-off men
Lazy almost doesn’t even describe this kind of writing.
Also, just what in the heck is Jocketty doing with the CMM situation? Why did he even put him on waivers at all? There must be something I am missing.
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
Yeah, I actually know the author of that piece
I’ve watched Reds games in his house before. He’s an astute guy, but this was trying way too hard to force a storyline that didn’t really exist.
by Brendanukkah on Aug 29, 2011 12:10 PM EDT up reply actions
I just wonder why so many people really yearn for this storyline to be true
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
Same reason Rick Perry is leading the GOP polls:
because people are fucking stupid.
Wear something sexy to my funeral.
by Pops Daniels on Aug 29, 2011 12:29 PM EDT up reply actions
Ain't that the truth...

Tequila and pancakes, anyone?
by Kevin Mitchell is Batman on Aug 29, 2011 12:35 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
I've been wondering if he knows that CMM wants to retire after this year...
Tequila and pancakes, anyone?
by Kevin Mitchell is Batman on Aug 29, 2011 12:24 PM EDT up reply actions
A couple random observations:
Austin Kearns never rose, so it would be hard to make a case that he “fell.” High expectations always and a certain complementarity with Dunn because they appeared at the same time, but he never took off. Besides, he only played for four years for Cincinnati. I remember lots of hopes but don’t believe the team ever rested on his shoulders.
The “Dunn is dumb” storyline is lazy and ignorant. Just because he is a bigger guy and slow on the base paths, that doesn’t make him uncomplex. He has been remarkably good natured about what he is going through now. We are lucky to have Votto, who is very thoughtful, but I don’t recall Dunn being a bad interviewee. Regardless, why paint him as lacking intelligence?
by Cuetotally Amazing on Aug 29, 2011 2:57 PM EDT up reply actions
We love you, you giant fucking Q.
Does anyone know where I can get some whale skin hub caps?
I saw an interview last night with Alonso, and he stated he was playing third tonight
It was on FSOH after the game. He was apparently told by Dusty, so I think we can take it to the bank.
Molecular gastronomy can take a hike as far as I'm concerned.
by RoastBeefKazenzakis on Aug 29, 2011 12:00 PM EDT reply actions
Doc Ram said the same
You two better not be lyin’!
Seems a little weird that Dusty would start him against a lefty, but maybe he thinks Hamels is the weak link, coming back from the DL and all.
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
I think he thinks this game will be a loss, so why not?
Hamels vs. Arroyo isn’t exactly a fair competition.
It’s not like Cole’s coming off of surgery. Guy missed one start due to having a dead arm.
It's Hamels vs. Bailey, but your point stands
Like I said in the recap thread, none of the long-time Reds have hit Hamels worth a damn, so they might as well give some new guys a shot.
It feels so nice to be back to normal
Dusty with his knifey-spoony tedendancies
Just seems like tomorrrow’s more his speed.
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
I think he wants to get Alonso some time with a fly-ball pitcher on the mound
That means Homer. I guess that is more important than who is on the mound for the other team.
by Charlie Scrabbles on Aug 29, 2011 3:09 PM EDT up reply actions
Don't you think Raymoan would accept if offered arb?
I would think that he’d win a salary higher than what the market was willing to pay, and would be more than happy to be on this team again.
"I slyde my boehner into sexsalad...."
Sounds like a johnu1 production. --jch24
I don't, but it's a close call
Ramon has a decent shot of getting a two-year deal, even at his age. But there’s still a decent chance that he accepts, which will probably scare the front office into not offering arb.
If he answered, he'd lose his bargaining position, which is the same as cash.
"If you intended to debate this, you need to take a side." - johnu1
by PeteyHendrix on Aug 29, 2011 6:05 PM EDT up reply actions
A 90-day extention WOULD take us past arbitration...
"If you intended to debate this, you need to take a side." - johnu1
by PeteyHendrix on Aug 29, 2011 6:07 PM EDT up reply actions
I think the DDN has a good point about the lack of action by the Front Office
In retrospect, the NL Central was won in the offseason – Milwaukee was aggressive and massively upgraded their rotation, the Reds decided to stand pat (more or less).
Marcum and Greinke (plus a bit of a lucky season from Wolf) have been the difference between the two teams. The Brewers basically pushed all their chips to the center of the table, and it is paying off.
Perhaps the Reds were right not to go all in this year – but at some point soon (prior to a Votto FA) they have to go for it.
Molecular gastronomy can take a hike as far as I'm concerned.
by RoastBeefKazenzakis on Aug 29, 2011 12:12 PM EDT reply actions
They were also aggressive at the trade deadline
Their hot streak started somewhat before that (like around the series where Coco blew all those saves before the All-Star Break), but they haven’t cooled down because of the moves they made, that’s for sure.
by Brendanukkah on Aug 29, 2011 12:14 PM EDT up reply actions
Kind of agree
Obviously it’s true that the Brewers were super aggressive and the Reds did basically nothing. But if Pythagorean records were legit, the Reds would be 2 games back. I know you can’t just do that, but the point is the Brewers have had a ton of 1 run game fortune, and even if the Reds had done something aggressive, they still probably wouldn’t be in it.
Still, the takeaway is that this division will be there for the taking next year, especially if Prince goes elsewhere. So this offseason will be crucial.
It feels so nice to be back to normal
I wouldn't mind the Reds going all in for next year, either.
Poaching Shields and one of Haren/Price/othergoodpitcherwith1yearleft wouldn’t be a bad start.
Tequila and pancakes, anyone?
by Kevin Mitchell is Batman on Aug 29, 2011 12:26 PM EDT up reply actions
Does anyone think pythagorean records are legit? There are also factors outside of random variation that affect close games.
"Prince Fielder is too fat even for the Oakland A’s" - Billy Beane
Of course, but pythag is a good reference point
There’s a reason most franchises don’t consistently outperform Pythag year after year (LAA excepted).
oh hey Soshball
Where have I heard that recently?
"Prince Fielder is too fat even for the Oakland A’s" - Billy Beane
Exactly.
If the Brewers are 13 games over in 1 run games, and outperforming their pythag by 7 wins again next year, I’ll run naked through the streets.
It feels so nice to be back to normal
People probably do that kinda weirdo stuff all the time in New York though
don’t they, Mr. Hollywood?
by Charlie Scrabbles on Aug 29, 2011 2:51 PM EDT up reply actions
I'd be careful with making such statements
Your record on wagers has not been good so far this year :)
"This is the St. Louis Cardinals we're talking about. They suck. Screw them. With a shovel. The sharp metal end. And then set them on fire." - crolfer
by rorschach1979 on Aug 29, 2011 3:12 PM EDT up reply actions
Due to look like a dumbass again!
"Wait, you think I'm being mean to the pretend orangutan?" -- battlekow
Via mlbtraderumors
Heyman’s sources suggest that “there has been some difference of opinion over playing time between Reds GM Walt Jocketty and manager Dusty Baker.” It was Jocketty, however, who chose not to trade veteran catcher Ramon Hernandez.
Well, duh.
I really don’t think it was Walt’s intentions to bring up Alonso just so he could ride the bench and have access to catered meals for three weeks.
Roster for next year
1B – Votto
2B – BP
SS – Cozart
3B – Yonder/Rolen platoon
RF – Bruuuce
CF – Stubby
LF – somebody outside the organization
C – Meso
Bench
Heisey or Sappelt
Frazier
Cairo
Hanigan
Pitching
An ace via trade
Cueto
Chapman
Leake
Arroyo
Bullpen
Lecure
Bray
Masset
Arredondo
Ondrusek
FA or Boxy
Cordero (at reduced rate)
sorry about the length (TWHS)
but this leaves Heisey or Sappelt, Wood, Volquez, Homer, Grandal as the main pieces to bring us the ace and or LF
I like tits better than anything you have to offer
"Wait, you think I'm being mean to the pretend orangutan?" -- battlekow
More Tits?
There was something in the air that night, the stars were bright, Arredondo. They were shining there for you and me, for liberty, Arredondo.
Unfortunately I'm not buying Yonder at 3B
I love this kid, but his only spot is 1B unless you can stand a butcher in the field.
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
Apart from the longer throws, how is 3B drastically different from 1B?
It feels so nice to be back to normal
People expect a modicum of defense there
People tolerate statues at 1B, but not at 3B. Also, 3B requires some athleticism to field slow choppers and bunts, which 1B really doesn’t.
And a lot more hard line drives go to 3B than 1B, I imagine, since there are so many more RH hitters.
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
Oh, and you can bobble grounders and the like at 1B and still recover
You have to have good hands because you can’t bobble plays at 3B or the guy is safe.
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
Necesaarily quick reactions
From the plethora of righty hitters.
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
by Cy Schourek on Aug 29, 2011 1:16 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions 1 recs
i dont think so
wouldn’t 1B get a chance for every ball fielded by the infield and thrown to first? or am i completely wrong?
There's more, but it's close
In the NL this year, 1B and 3B have caught about the same number of pop-ups/line drives (1000). 3B have about 3900 assists, compared to 1500 for 1B. But if we count the unassisted 1B putouts the 1B number goes to 3100. If you figure that 3B are quicker and more likely to be positioned better (since 1B have to guard the bag if there’s a runner on), the gap between the balls in the 3B zone verus 1B zone are probably very close.
Sure, but if a guy has sure hands at 1B, he isn't going to suddenly lose them at 3B
and it’s not like 3B is closer to home plate, or that balls get hit necessarily harder there.
It feels so nice to be back to normal
i wasn't operating under the impression that yonder was particularly good defensively at 1b
maybe he’s better than i’ve been giving him credit for?
He's not particularly good. He's probably a tick below average
And I’m saying that he’d probably be below average but passable at 3B. And I’ll take that, given the alternatives.
It feels so nice to be back to normal
I mean if you don't think 3B is much more difficult to field adequately than 1B, I don't know how to convince you
Prince Fielder, Ryan Howard, Paul Konerko, Carlos Lee….these guys would be outright terrible fielders at 3B (do you disagree?), but people generally just accept them at 1B.
Also (underappreciated factor) 1B get to use a ginormous glove, 3B don’t. BTW, I’ve never understood why 1B are allowed to do that…
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
I think it depends on the player.
And FWIW, those guys (save maybe Howard) are all pretty terrible at 1B too.
It feels so nice to be back to normal
3B is at a strange intersection on many rosters
Plenty of guys are drafted and develop to play third. But you also see middle infielders move down the spectrum to 3B if their bat allows them (Polanco), former outfielders that move in (Headley), players that switch between first and third due to team need (Youkilis, Sandoval), and even catchers trying to save their knees (Mauer?). The only requirement is that you throw right-handed, which eliminates a lot of big boppers.
Right, and I just think about guys like Pablo Sandoval
There have been a number of guys like him over the years who aren’t good athletes but handle it OK.
I mean, for goodness sake, if END gets to stick at 3B, we should at least try Yonder there.
It feels so nice to be back to normal
very good point about END
they can’t be that much different athletically, but with the bat
Yonder >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> END
Let a man come in and do the Popcorn.
I'd wager END is much more athletic than Yonder
But it is a good point about END. He’s pretty awful at 3B, yet the team seems all about him.
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
How does the team seem "all about" END?
He’s rotting in AAA while we start folks like Edgar, Janish, Sappelt, and Cairo.
"If you intended to debate this, you need to take a side." - johnu1
by PeteyHendrix on Aug 29, 2011 6:14 PM EDT up reply actions
Throw right handed you say?
Votto to 3B!
"Wait, you think I'm being mean to the pretend orangutan?" -- battlekow
They're allowed to have bigger gloves because they handle the second most throws on the team
And because it’s part of the game’s history™!
"Wait, you think I'm being mean to the pretend orangutan?" -- battlekow
and because of the longer throws 3B tend to play on the infield grass a lot more to be in better position for bunts and slow rollers.
1B can usually hang back and play a few steps in from the outfield grass and still be in good defensive position. 3B don’t have that luxury.
"I slyde my boehner into sexsalad...."
Sounds like a johnu1 production. --jch24
It seems to me....
That back when I was a kid, a lot of third basemen were sluggers who played in front of the bag and took care of slow choppers and bunts, while the SS was in the outfield grass and handled everything from 2nd base to 3rd except those. Outfielders who grew too slow to handle it but could still swing a bat were moved to third.
Am I misrembering?
June 30, 2010
Let a man come in and do the Popcorn.
by -ManBearPig on Aug 29, 2011 12:58 PM EDT up reply actions
Bruce saved us that game
and he saved us from a perfecto in the playoffs. Bruce will lead us to victory Tuesday!
His walk was probably the highlight of the Reds' 2011 Postseason.
That or BP’s leadoff homer in Game 2.
Born Small... Now Huge... Winning... Bring it..!
*2010. You get the idea.
Born Small... Now Huge... Winning... Bring it..!
by BomerHailey on Aug 29, 2011 1:30 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
I think you just jinxed this team
right into the playoffs. Brewers 20 game losing streak begins now!
pretty sure it was Rolen
who drew the lone base on balls
by Howie Feltersnatch on Aug 29, 2011 1:49 PM EDT up reply actions
I remember now why I thought it was Rolen
A borderline full count pitch that should’ve been ball 4, but was called strike 3.
by Howie Feltersnatch on Aug 29, 2011 1:54 PM EDT up reply actions
one of the other things I remember about that game
was Votto taking a couple of timeouts in an at bat, trying to throw off Halladay. IT was very un Votto and he actually said he apologized to Roy for it. In my opinion, you have to do everything that is legal in your power to break up a perfect game
it was an all veteran week ... dusty would be proud
Game 128: Reds 8-6 DTFH91
Game 129: Marlins 6-5 chesirecat
Game 130: Reds 3-2 MatthewH (2)
Game 131: Reds 4-3 Don (2)
Game 132: Reds 6-3 Joshuar9476, pack_fan
Game 133: Reds 5-4 Kcgard2, DocRam
14 Joshuar9476
13 Crolfer
10 Ram27
9 pack_fan
8 Don
8 MatthewH
7 Vottomatic
6 Ritalin
6 ManBearPig
6 Ewok / obc2
6 chesirecat
6 DTFH91
5 TheC
5 Heeringa
5 kcgard2
4 RoastBeefKazenzakis
4 Coviner
4 jch24
4 DocRam
3 Charlie Scrabbles
3 Sexsalad
3 Yossarian22
3 OkieChase
3 KSE
3 mdccclxix
3 Badenjr
3 BomerHailey
2 Wishfuldrifter
2 Grahamophone
2 Madville
2 the finest muffins
2 BiggerRedMachines
2 Jack Armstrong
1 JSL413
1 3 Fast 3 Furious
1 than
1 ThePensive
1 sociopath
1 BigStein
1 btcoop71
1 KD1
1 Kevin Mitchell
1 Danny Graves
1 Corky’s Stache
1 FSUBENGAL
1 DevilsAdvocate
Individuality: Always remember that you are unique. Just like everybody else.
Am I a veteran?
I registered for Red Reporter on Sept. 1, 2010. I think I’m eligible for Rookie of the Year.
by Don, the Rebel without a Blog on Aug 29, 2011 4:11 PM EDT up reply actions
yeah, you're eligible
but edinson volquez has the award wrapped up
by 'tHan on Aug 29, 2011 4:13 PM EDT up reply actions 3 recs
Andre Ethier is not happy in LA, it seems.
He has one year of team control left and needs knee surgery in the offseason. He could theoretically come pretty cheap in terms of prospects. Would you guys like to see Ethier manning LF next year, and at what price?
Let a man come in and do the Popcorn.
I'd be fine with it for a relatively cheap price
I’d give them Boxberger, I guess.
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
I'd definitely take him. He'll be pretty expensive in dollars, though.
He’d probably blow the budget.
It feels so nice to be back to normal
I cant find his salary for next year, he's making just shy of $10 million this year.
BR has him signed through 2011. Does that mean he’s arb eligible next year? Do player salaries ever decrease in arb?
Let a man come in and do the Popcorn.
He's arb eligible next year, it's his last year.
He’ll make more than 10 mil next season unless he’s non-tendered, which won’t happen.
It feels so nice to be back to normal
Yep, looks like hes arb eligible.
And while they can decrease, I think its only by 20%
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
by Cy Schourek on Aug 29, 2011 2:56 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
ethier manning?
is he the other brother?
Individuality: Always remember that you are unique. Just like everybody else.
by joshuar9476 on Aug 29, 2011 3:34 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
I was looking at batter vs pitcher stats
and our guys really struggle against Hamels. Bruce is one of the few regulars with decent numbers.
I’m hoping that changes this series
also ESPN's Ramon file
When I accessed it, it said Ramon was born in 1950 and had an ERA of 3.03—???
Its pretty impressive that a 60 year old former pitcher can have this kind of season as a catcher.
Let a man come in and do the Popcorn.
Real conversation at work:
“Beyonce and Jay-Z’s baby is going to be the most famous baby. Whose baby is more famous than Beyonce and Jay-Z’s? Angelina Jolie and Brad Pitt’s babies don’t even matter!”
by Charlie Scrabbles on Aug 29, 2011 3:05 PM EDT reply actions
Cause they're adopted or because they're...
Bart: "Dad, what's a Muppet?"
Homer: "Well, it's not quite a mop, not quite a puppet, but man... (laughs, then pauses) So, to answer you question, I don't know."
Glad I'm not able to watch the game tonight.
Over/under on Halladay no hitter references, 20
Let a man come in and do the Popcorn.
Game's on ESPN
I’d take the over
Bart: "Dad, what's a Muppet?"
Homer: "Well, it's not quite a mop, not quite a puppet, but man... (laughs, then pauses) So, to answer you question, I don't know."
Well, it's official
Phillips 2B
Sappelt LF
Votto 1B
Bruce RF
Alonso 3B
Stubbs CF
Renteria SS
Hanigan C
Bailey P
It feels so nice to be back to normal
This really isn't complaining, but Dusty cracks me up.
He starts my favorite player Renteria with Alonso….
And after years of not wanting to hit lefties back to back, he starts three in a row…..against a lefty.
Oh, Dusty.
It feels so nice to be back to normal
So, he can prove that there's not a place for Alonso on this team...
If this lineup wins a few games, Dusty will lose his mind!
Please stop. If you have any decency in your cold, cold heart, please stop.
And he’s not awful, I’m just surprised MLB allows such a ridiculously good hitting duo to occupy the same side of the infield at once.
This is like Heyday Jeter/ARod type stuff….only better!
It feels so nice to be back to normal
It's hard for him to be overrated since everyone seems to hate him. I think people must hate winning.
It feels so nice to be back to normal
People don't hate winning
People hate toilets that are inexplicably put in the infield between second base and third base. I think it’s time we give Dumperia the flush!
by Charlie Scrabbles on Aug 29, 2011 3:58 PM EDT up reply actions
That's pretty much the definition of complaining even though you got what you wanted
"Wait, you think I'm being mean to the pretend orangutan?" -- battlekow
No it's not. I'm happy with this lineup. It's just funny because he's kind of a hypocrite.
It feels so nice to be back to normal
Lineup
Phillips 4, Sappelt 7, Votto 3, Bruce 9, Alonso 5, Stubbs 8, Renteria 7, Hanigan 2, Bailey 1
That’s a pretty fun heart of the order! If somehow this can stick and we get a little lucky on pitching, we could be good…like really good.
Agreed. I'd like to see Frazier in LF long term in this scenario with Sappelt as the 4th OF, but this is a nice lineup.
But like I said above, it cracks me up that Dusty does this against a LHP. I hope he tries it again against a righty.
It feels so nice to be back to normal
Speaking of Sappelt,
I was at the marathon game yesterday and the game on Saturday and it seemed like Sappelt just isn’t ready for primetime. I hate being that guy, but he seemed to make a lot of baserunning mistakes and wasn’t hustling. I don’t know how he profiled in AAA, but he doesn’t seem like a #2 hitter either. Ideally, if Hanigan wasn’t a catcher, he seems like he should bat second given his ability to make contact and decent ability to not make outs.
you aren't the only one
If you read the game thread and the recap, a lot of people made similar observations.
He’s still a work in progress, obviously. Which is what Dusty said last week. He said Sappelt was still raw, particularly with respect to baserunning.
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
I understand getting caught on your heels while leading off the base...
And I can understand over-thinking whether a ball is going to drop or not and getting caught in no-man’s land.
I don’t understand how you don’t run out a sac-bunt, because with his speed, he could occasionally leg out a bunt-hit there. Even more so, I cannot begin to comprehend not running out a triple at full-speed.
I hate saying this, because I usually hear it from the annoying, drunk, backwoods know-it-all, but it feels like it’s more of a under the rib-cage, rather than a between-the-ears thing for him.
Which is odd, because one thing everyone said about him was he almost plays the game too hard
Like, he’s too aggressive and such.
It feels so nice to be back to normal
It's probably a little different when you go up and play with the big boys
That reckless abandon can shrivel up.
"Wait, you think I'm being mean to the pretend orangutan?" -- battlekow
someone said in one of the other threads
That he gets away with it in AAA. That the pace and intensity of the game at the big league level is what he’s not used to. In AAA, you have the likes of Kris Negron playing CF, because there’s nobody else. It just doesn’t prepare you to face the likes of Rick Ankiel.
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
This
When I was living in Columbus and would watch a lot of Reds games on TV and see a decent amount of Clippers games, it felt at times like you were watching little league games. A lot of mistakes that fall just short of errors.
yeah
And it’s even worse in the lower levels.
Also, what I’ve noticed about Louisville in particular…the baserunning is terrible. Maybe I’ve just had bad luck, but it seems like whenever I went to games, I saw Valaika, Cozart, Frazier, etc. picked off or caught stealing – sometimes multiple times in the same game. It wasn’t that they weren’t trying to fix it – they always got a lecture from Rick Sweet afterwards – but it just seemed like something that was very difficult for them.
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
I remember seeing Drew Sutton make several lackluster plays when the Bats played the Clippers.
And that making it pretty clear to me that Drew Sutton would never be the answer to any question other than, “Who would be a AAA player who would never go on to be an everyday big-league player?”
I think Dusty probably kept Frazier out of the lineup on purpose...
So he can bring him in for 3B if Alonso fails in epic fashion.
I think Dusty just doesn't like Frazier much.
He has Cairo for the 3B fill-in if need be.
It feels so nice to be back to normal
I think Frazier has green eyes

Or maybe hazel?
Valaika has blue eyes, I think.
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
I know
My dad’s a big Sinatra fan.
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
Oh you got blue eyes, oh you got green eyes, oh you got grey eyes
Up, down, turn around. Please don’t let me hit the ground. Tonight I think I’ll walk alone. I’ll find my soul as I go home.
by Brendanukkah on Aug 29, 2011 6:09 PM EDT up reply actions
I don't really see Frazier being more than a 4th OF/Super Utility guy.
Our internal LF options are a lot like our SP options; a lot of depth, not a lot of star power.
Let a man come in and do the Popcorn.
If the following holds true:
-Votto does not go on the DL for an extended period of time.
-BP stays put or only slightly declines.
-Cozart gets healthy and plays at least league-average offensively for SS
-Yonder and Rolen split time and spots Votto occasionally; Rolen falls somewhere between 2009/early 2010 and late 2010/2011 numbers.
-Bruce stays put or slightly improves.
-Stubbs stays put or slightly improves.
-Hanigan stays put or gets closer to his 2010 numbers and Mesoraco can be at least league-average for C.
I’m willing to accept a Sappelt/Heisey/Frazier platoon/utility role, because that’s a pretty impressive lineup.
As has been said here many times, this team’s biggest need to get to (and then win) in the postseason is a #1/#2 starter.
You could be right, but I'll be shocked if Frazier doesn't end up a much better hitter than Sappelt.
It feels so nice to be back to normal
Much better
I will go so far as to say he could potentially be as good a hitter as BP or Drew Stubbs, maybe even a little better.
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
Dusty's not playing his usual small sample size game today
Ramon is 3 for 6 with a home run against Hamels, while Hanigan’s 0-fer. Cairo is 2 for 4, Janish is 3 for 10, Lewis is 3 for 9.
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
He took a nasty foul tip off the left shoulder a couple of games ago and is probably still sore
"Wait, you think I'm being mean to the pretend orangutan?" -- battlekow
wait wha...?
there was a herkin’ jerkin’ reference on a platter and jch responded without mentioning it?
what the fuck is it, opposite day ?
Tequila and pancakes, anyone?
by Kevin Mitchell is Batman on Aug 29, 2011 4:39 PM EDT up reply actions
Maybe making 'creds say good things about Renteria
has warped the space-time continuum around RR and consequently rendered jch incapable of making sexually-based jokes.
Great Scott!
by Charlie Scrabbles on Aug 29, 2011 5:02 PM EDT up reply actions
Inconceivable!

Tequila and pancakes, anyone?
by Kevin Mitchell is Batman on Aug 29, 2011 5:20 PM EDT up reply actions
ha!
Blade Runner is such an awesome movie!
by 'tHan on Aug 29, 2011 5:38 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Ordinary fucking people.
(Just watched the first episode of Party Down.)
by Brendanukkah on Aug 29, 2011 6:11 PM EDT up reply actions
That show is amazing.
I hope you enjoy all two seasons of it.
by the finest muffins on Aug 29, 2011 7:48 PM EDT up reply actions
This post was the snax.
rec’d for “went too far.”
"If you intended to debate this, you need to take a side." - johnu1

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