OMG Mat Latos
by JinAZ on Dec 17, 2011 4:04 PM EST
in News
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PrintThe Reds just picked up one of the top pitchers in baseball!
I'm so out of it I don't think I can give a detailed analysis of this trade in my typical style. I'm not entirely convinced that stuff is meaningful anymore anyway. So here's my very brief opinion:
What they gave up: Grandal is a nice talent to give up, but the rest were in my opinion fairly marginal prospects. Boxberger's a relief pitcher, so whatever. Volquez is now someone else's problem, and Alonso is a low defense, low/moderate power 1B. Obviously the Padres (and a lot of other people) disagree with me, or they wouldn't have given up Latos.
What the Reds got in return: a top notch pitcher. Cameron breaks it down well. But even without PETCO, Latos should be successful. He is a power pitcher, with a fairly hard four-seamer for a starting pitcher (93 mph) and a badass slider (23% whiff % vs. 14% MLB average), as well as a two-seamer, curve, and change. It's pretty freaking exciting to see the Reds making a move like this after what seems like YEARS since they went all in on a trade. This is better than the Marcum deal, and on par with the Greinke deal of last offseason in terms of the quality of the pitcher they acquired.
And then there's the contract. He has two years of service time. This means that the Reds control him for FOUR MORE SEASONS (I think). This is enormous. Even if he walks at the end of that time, the deal is fabulous for the Reds. A player like this is extremely hard to acquire, so major kudos to the Reds for getting it done. This is arguably the most valuable pitcher acquisition in recent years.
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The Reds have no money and are talking to no one else!
johnfaymanJohn Fay
Asked Jocketty if it’s fair to say they don’t have money to sign someone to Willingham-like deal. “Very fair to say.” #reds
No Beltran.
Both teams win. Reds get 24-year-old pitcher for guys that were blocked (or in Volquez’s case, bad/not welcome back). Padres get lots of good, young depth in the form of 3 top 100 prospects (which means not much for the Reds, they were never going to play here) and rotation filler with upside.
Big question is Latos’ health. And if his HR/FB increases at GABP (it will), it’ll be 2-4 more home runs this year.
The Twitters are all calling it a fleecing for Padres.
They’re not really mentioning that Latos is 24, costs 400k this year and is team controlled for 3 years, and the Reds gave up only blocked players. Boxy is a reliever, low value. Grandal is unproven/in AA and had just one good year. Yonder can clearly hit, but he was never going to play here. Both teams won.
I respect walt having cojones to pull the trigger
If grandal becomes Ted Simmons and Yonder becomes Cecil Cooper this may look meh in retrospect.
Glad to have Latos on the roster.
Buy RED: My Uncensored Life in Rock by Sammy Hagar, today
by obc2 on Dec 17, 2011 4:40 PM EST via iPhone app up reply actions
yep
it would suck if Latos has TJS in March and Grandel wins Rookie of the year. But that is what happens when you trade for a pitcher.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
it's an interesting argument:
do you judge a trade at the time it’s made or in retrospect? There’s 5 different "could"s in this trade…
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
by Cy Schourek on Dec 17, 2011 10:48 PM EST up reply actions
The only time to judge a trade.....
is at the time it’s made. Unfortunately (or, more accurately, quite fortunately), Baseball GM’s have a ton more information on which to evaluate a trade than us fans do. But, even with that, nobody can accurately predict the future. Most guys in AA traded at the deadline don’t turn into Jeff Bagwell, but that doesn’t make it a bad trade to give an AA prospect away for a guy who gives you a 1.23 ERA down the stretch and helps bring you a division title.
"Bitch slap your goldfish folks, we're all screwed."
-KevinMitchellisBatman
Questioning a trade after it's made is about as useful as questioning a draft pick after it's made.
You can always take a different path, and sometimes the outcome is drastically better, and sometimes it is drastically worse. That’s why it is more than idiotic for analysts to say the Reds lost or even won the trade. They filled a hole that needed to be filled, and for a team like the Reds their assets are players, not dollars. The rest is up to Jesus, Bud Selig, and Dusty “The Prophet” Baker.
by Cuetotally Amazing on Dec 17, 2011 11:19 PM EST up reply actions
I look at it this way
How many times have any of us been faced with a decision in life? Is it fair to beat yourself up over it after the fact, knowing that you made the wrong choice based on the information available and your mindeset at the time? Of course not.
"Wait, you think I'm being mean to the pretend orangutan?" -- battlekow
Not all of the decisions I've made in my life have sucked, you rec whore :)
"Wait, you think I'm being mean to the pretend orangutan?" -- battlekow
And what do you judge it on?
If Latos is a stud and brings us two NL Central crowns in the next two years, but the total WAR over their careers is higher for the bunch sent to SD, who won the trade?
"The USA despite its flaws and corruption and overall messiness is still a great and powerful instrument of freedom and hope for the entire world." - Madville
Even if Latos throws only one pitch for the Reds
and all four of the other guys go onto to Hall of Famer careers, this is a good trade. I know that sounds strange, but Like BLee said, you can only judge the trade based on the information available when it was made. No one can predict the future. But today, Walt took surplus and leveraged it to get a great talent to fill an area of need. That’s a good trade.
by Charlie Scrabbles on Dec 18, 2011 6:48 AM EST up reply actions 4 recs
I understand this POV
but doesn’t watching it pan out affect how we perceive it?
For instance, watching what I’ve watched the past 3 years, I’m not so sure I’d have traded Hamilton for Volquez (even if Volquez did help get us Latos.)
"Red Reporter - An elitist clique full of like-minded douchebags." - BK
Of course it affects how we perceive it
but in terms of evaluation, future developments aren’t useful in terms of the original move. How it turns out will certainly inform future trades and talent evaluations, but it really isn’t useful in evaluating the original move. It’s not like you can go back and change anything.
The Hobbs trade didn’t work out for us. But that was a completely unprecedented situation to begin with. What are you supposed to do with a young, talented player with a history of extreme instability? And you just fired his babysitter’s brother.
It’s possible the Reds could have taken a big chance on him and banked on the hope that he’d stay sober (he didn’t) and healthy (he didn’t) and the Narron situation would blow over (we can’t know how that one would turn out, though) and he would hit like an MVP (he did). Or they could have leveraged his promising talent into a less volatile talent. They chose the safer route and got burned pretty bad. But at the time, it was impossible to know how things would play out.
by Charlie Scrabbles on Dec 18, 2011 7:10 AM EST up reply actions
Right
You judge a trade at the time it’s made, knowing the uncertainties that exist. Whether it works out is another story, but it’s an issue of process vs. luck. Strive for good process, let the luck fall as it may. You can’t control luck anyway.
I think this looks like a good trade for the Reds, as it fills a major need and is paid for largely by blocked prospects. The Padres also think they did well in this trade or they would not have done it. This is how trades work—both parties get something that they need, and do it via a price that they consider acceptable.
There is uncertainty on how Latos will perform (because he’s a pitcher and can get hurt more than anything else). But there’s also a lot of uncertainty about the prospects we’re giving up. You don’t give up that many prospects for nothing, but Latos is a young, very good pitcher entering just his third MLB season and thus with a very good contract. He’s worth a ton, and the Reds got him for what seems like a reasonable cost to me. The Padres get a lot of future help, potentially, but again I think there is reason to be skeptical about how much value some of the players will actually provide above replacement. The bar is pretty high for a 1B in terms of offensive production, and I’m not even sure that Alonso’s above average defensively at that position.
-j
I write at:
Red Reporter | Basement-Dwellers.com | Twitter: @jinazreds
Kyle Blanks put up .229/.300/.406 last year
and his offense was credited as above league average weighted for park. I am confident Alonso is at least an average hitter if park adjustments can do that for him.
I’m happy about the trade. A lot of people are questioning Alonso’s abilities now, and others are overrating them. But I’d say the majority are selling him short.
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
yeah, he'll be Grace/Casey esque. Which is damn good.
None of the Reds’ corner prospects have an OBP worth a damn. I’m still a little concerned about that, as well as Heisey getting 500 PAs and Stubbs not getting back up to speed. There’s plenty to freak out about and plenty of time to do it.
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
by Cy Schourek on Dec 18, 2011 12:16 PM EST up reply actions
I could see Alonso winning a batting title.
I think he’ll turn in at least two .420+ OBP seasons.
A hot dog at the ballgame beats roast beef at the Ritz. ~Humphrey Bogart
by PeteyHendrix on Dec 18, 2011 3:27 PM EST up reply actions
I think that's very, very generous.
For a guy with a .370 career minors OBP, he’ll need to develop major power in order to be feared enough to get walked that much. Which I don’t think will happen.
It feels so nice to be back to normal
I think he'll hit for more power than Grace/Casey but otherwise agree
"Wait, you think I'm being mean to the pretend orangutan?" -- battlekow
you have to judge a trade based on how players perform after it
otherwise you can’t really judge a trade.
if you judge based only on what you know now, you are judging it on nothing but value. everything else is hypothetical.
looking back on trades is how you determine the winners & to be a good gm, you have to win the trades.
you can’t excuse away a bad trade by saying it was good at the time, because that really doesn’t matter. all that matters are the results
So if Latos gets injured tomorrow
the Reds lose the trade. Meaning the Reds should never have made the trade because Latos got injured. Yes, the Reds will have lost objectively, but you can’t evaluate the trade that way. Unpredictable things happen, and trades can be good moves even if you don’t win them.
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
that's wrong. all you're doing is giving a built in excuse
if latos gets injured tomorrow & never pitches for the reds, of course the reds lost the trade
That makes it an unlucky trade not a bad trade
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
by Yossarian22 on Dec 18, 2011 12:39 PM EST up reply actions
as we all know
luck is for losers™
baseball is no different than any other business. you are evaluated on your results, not what could have happened
Yeah but
that is like saying that if the Reds traded Joey Votto to Minnesota for pitcher Kevin Slowey tomorrow, and Votto for some reason loses the ability to hit and never OPS’s over .800 again, and some how Kevin Slowey makes a Cliff Lee like transformation becomes a regular contender for the Cy Young, that the Reds made a good trade.
The Reds still made a bad trade, because they could have gotten Slowey for much less than Votto, and they could have received much better players for Votto in a trade at the time.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
by Yossarian22 on Dec 18, 2011 12:48 PM EST up reply actions
there would be no evaluating of that trade
because the gm would be fired for suggesting it to ownership.
Reagins not only suggested the Naopli trade
he executed it 9and was then rightly fired, but too late).
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
that's wrong. All you're doing is giving a built-in excuse.
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
by Cy Schourek on Dec 18, 2011 12:53 PM EST up reply actions
shouldn't you be off blending a kelp shake or something?
by 'tHan on Dec 18, 2011 12:58 PM EST up reply actions 3 recs
ha.
I started this by asking “What’s the right way to judge a trade?” and I really don’t know what the right answer is/if there is a right answer.
If Latos wins 20 games and the Reds win the WS, do they win the trade? If Alonso hits 40 homers in 2013 and the Padres win the WS then, do they win the trade?
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
That's a real Catch-22 you have there
"Wait, you think I'm being mean to the pretend orangutan?" -- battlekow
What if......
Reds and Padres are Latos started game 7 of the NLCS, because he took the ace crown from Cueto mid season, and on 3 days rest is going for a CG shutout. 3-0 Redlegs. One strike left and Alonso is up at the plate and hits a grand slam with his ‘average/moderate’ power.
Good trade or bad trade?
I BLEED RED
There are two different things going on here
Pretty much every trade has a winner and a loser, and that can only be determined years later after everything has played out.
But this “analysis” does nothing at all to tell you whether the trade was a good idea at the time or not. To decide that, you have to use the information available at the time.
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
you are correct
the trade has to make sense when it’s made.
but it also matters what happens after the trade is made.
both are important in judging a trade
It depends on what kind of judgment you are making
I don’t think anyone is saying that right now as of this moment, the Reds (or the Padres) have already won or lost this trade. Just whether the trade is a good idea or not. So we basically agree?
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
'tHan is right to a degree
if the aftermath a GM wins a ton of what were head scratching trades at the time, he probably does a better job of evaluating talent than his peers.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
Fair point
but has any GM consistently done that?
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
the problem is
you can’t argue either side too far.
I will never blame the Reds for making this trade, but GM’s are fired when trades like this go wrong.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
It will take a good while before we can say this trade definitely "went wrong"
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
Billy Beane?
A hot dog at the ballgame beats roast beef at the Ritz. ~Humphrey Bogart
by PeteyHendrix on Dec 18, 2011 3:28 PM EST up reply actions
I was gonna say Beane
or Friedman. AA might be that kinda GM, too.
"Good luck, National League managers – I have no idea how you’re supposed to get this guy out." - Dave Cameron on Joey Votto
by Grahamophone on Dec 18, 2011 3:29 PM EST up reply actions
Beane has missed on a number of trades
he let go of Carlos Gonzalez and Huston Street for half a season of Matt Holliday. The Brett Wallace trade is a bit early to call I guess. Traded Scutaro for nothing. Didn’t really get anything for Blanton or Guadin and Rich Harden.
I thought someone would bring up Beane, but even he doesn’t come out ahead on his trades that consistently.
Friedman and AA are doing a great job so far, but haven’t been at it that long yet.
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
for the record
i think this is a good trade for the reds & i would have made it if i were in walt’s shoes.
Good trade with votto and mesoraco under contract
But not as good as the Carson Palmer trade
Buy RED: My Uncensored Life in Rock by Sammy Hagar, today
No, that's Fundamentals
Fundamentals are for losers.
"Bitch slap your goldfish folks, we're all screwed."
-KevinMitchellisBatman
by BLee2525 on Dec 18, 2011 1:01 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
This, I agree with
Needs to be an evaluation of a group of moves and not one single move, but yeah.
"Wait, you think I'm being mean to the pretend orangutan?" -- battlekow
Yes, I admitted the reds will have lost the trade
but it doesn’t give you any kind of feedback about whether this is a trade the reds should have made.
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
But
You also have the judge it based on the market at the time.
The Reds needed an ace, and paid the market rate to get it. What happens after that won’t change the market today. If Latos goes down with shoulder surgery in March and never throws a pitcher faster than 89 MPH for the Reds, and Volquez becomes a solid mid rotation starter, Grandel wins Rookie of the Year, Alonso goes into the Hall of Fame, and Boxberger is an All Star closer, that doesn’t change the fact that the Reds paid market rate today.
Also if none of the players San Diego get develop, and Latos Wins a Cy Young for the Reds it doesn’t change anything either.
The only thing that changes anything would be if we find out that Walt got an iffy medical review from Kremchek and went ahead and threw caution to the wind.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
by Yossarian22 on Dec 18, 2011 12:35 PM EST up reply actions
Decisions and outcomes
The problem here is that “evaluating the trade” is imprecise language.
I worked as a business consultant for a while, and one thing we constantly stressed is the difference between evaluating the Decision and evaluating the Outcome.
Walt made a good Decision. Knowing what he knew, given his assets and needs, he has made a good decision. That will not ever change, no matter what happens in the players’ performance.
It remains to be seen if that decision resulted in a good Outcome. The outcome depends on the decision, sure, but also depends on luck and a host of other factors.
Looking back, I’d say that Hamilton for Volquez was a good decision, given all the peripheral stuff that we’ve been reminded of in other comments. The outcome for the Reds was not so good.
"The USA despite its flaws and corruption and overall messiness is still a great and powerful instrument of freedom and hope for the entire world." - Madville
by bbjones on Dec 18, 2011 2:59 PM EST up reply actions 6 recs
This is very helpful, though there is always a dizzying amount of what ifs in any analysis.
Perhaps Hamilton would have been the same player in Cincinnati that he became in Texas, but we can’t know that. And maybe Volquez would have been a three-time Cy Young winner if he had stayed in Texas. That’s why, in a sense, they only moment you can evaluate is what you call the decision, and everything else unfolds in drastically different contexts.
by Cuetotally Amazing on Dec 18, 2011 3:23 PM EST up reply actions
I'm so happy the Reds gave up on Volquez
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 18, 2011 6:26 PM EST up reply actions
Hamilton might have torn his hamstring off the bone rounding third, you never know about these things.
"Wait, you think I'm being mean to the pretend orangutan?" -- battlekow
I beleive
That Hamilton would not have been as good if he stayed here. Maybe his crack dealer lived in Covington.
I BLEED RED
Say what you will about Hamilton, but he's been clean since he's returned*
Dude gets tested every week
*Well, except for jello shots.
And the trade had something to do with that
Ask any hard drug addict, Change is the only way out of relapsing.
Just don’t go get a drink with them afterwards.
I BLEED RED
This post is excellent
Very well said. Much deserved greening.
"This is the St. Louis Cardinals we're talking about. They suck. Screw them. With a shovel. The sharp metal end. And then set them on fire." - crolfer
by rorschach1979 on Dec 18, 2011 3:43 PM EST up reply actions
I disagree on your last point:
The only thing that changes anything would be if we find out that Walt got an iffy medical review…
If a GM over-values or under-values the player (even as they are now, without further development being a factor), either by “trusting his eyes” in the face of disastrous peripherals, illogically using selective statistics (such as selective end points), or by slotting them into counter-productive, ignoring better scouts’ reports in favor of lesser talent-evaluators on your front office team, old-school roles that have shown to be folly (such as a low-OBP Willy Taveras as a lead-off hitter), AND THIS IS LATER SHOWN TO BE TRUE BY OUTCOME, then we can still label this as a bad trade…even though we don’t know it’s a bad trade yet.
A hot dog at the ballgame beats roast beef at the Ritz. ~Humphrey Bogart
by PeteyHendrix on Dec 18, 2011 3:44 PM EST up reply actions
But everything else we can judge now
we can judge the talent, sorta judge the market. The only thing we do not know is what Latos’s MRI looks like.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
Johnnypronto knows.
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
by Cy Schourek on Dec 18, 2011 4:00 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
Mr. Peabody, you got the wayback machine working!
"Wait, you think I'm being mean to the pretend orangutan?" -- battlekow
The issue with the Hamilton trade is that it HAD to happen
Did the Reds lose that trade? Sure. But ultimately a piece they acquired in that trade helped them down the road by being part of a package that brought in exactly what the team needed at the time.
"Wait, you think I'm being mean to the pretend orangutan?" -- battlekow
the guy had a needle sticking out of his forehead
If the bats offered me Corky Miller in return, I’d take it!
I BLEED RED
Look at players as stocks, since that's essentially what they are
We bought low and had the opportunity to sell high (arms like Volquez’s don’t come along very often and Hamilton cost the Reds $50K), do you do it? Especially knowing there’s the very real possibility of shit going bad due to internal strife within the “company”?
More simply put – Do you think people who bought into Microsoft early on should feel bad for turning a 150% profit even though the price skyrocketed after they sold? Especially if they used the money they made to buy Google stock?
"Wait, you think I'm being mean to the pretend orangutan?" -- battlekow
the reds didn't buy google stock
they bought enron stock
by 'tHan on Dec 18, 2011 5:36 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Now you're just talking out of your ass
"Wait, you think I'm being mean to the pretend orangutan?" -- battlekow
were you referring to volquez or latos?
volquez had to be packaged with THREE first round picks to bring back value.
he was essentially a throw in in this deal. more of an effort for the reds to get rid of him than anything else
Lato is Google, Hamilton is Microsoft
"Wait, you think I'm being mean to the pretend orangutan?" -- battlekow
So that makes Chapman Petramco Corp
out of…uh…Springfield. They are about to introduce some sort of robot butcher. If you wanna get in, there’s very little time.
by Charlie Scrabbles on Dec 18, 2011 5:44 PM EST up reply actions
Oh thank god, it's Red Reporter's voice of reason to the rescue
"Wait, you think I'm being mean to the pretend orangutan?" -- battlekow
by jch24 on Dec 18, 2011 5:42 PM EST up reply actions 4 recs
Personal attack!
Pop him up! Groupthink!
by Charlie Scrabbles on Dec 18, 2011 5:45 PM EST up reply actions
it's always great when you show up in a thread chuck
by 'tHan on Dec 18, 2011 5:48 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Blogfight!
Fuck the high road, everyone take Snark Blvd!
Buy RED: My Uncensored Life in Rock by Sammy Hagar, today
by obc2 on Dec 18, 2011 5:55 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
If Red Reporter has a voice of reason, it's
kcgard, ken, Gray, or someone like that
"Good luck, National League managers – I have no idea how you’re supposed to get this guy out." - Dave Cameron on Joey Votto
by Grahamophone on Dec 18, 2011 5:43 PM EST up reply actions
gray can be a bit of an asshole
kcgard is like the nicest person on the internet. I bet he strangles kittens.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
Yeah, but Gray doesn't seem to ever lose his head.
"Good luck, National League managers – I have no idea how you’re supposed to get this guy out." - Dave Cameron on Joey Votto
by Grahamophone on Dec 18, 2011 5:45 PM EST up reply actions
i think i've pushed him over the edge a couple of times
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
hmmm well
kcgard and ken are still contenders.
I made a totally baseless remark without a second’s thought yesterday, and kcgard assertively corrected me all while making it sound like I was doing him a favor. He really is a great guy.
"Good luck, National League managers – I have no idea how you’re supposed to get this guy out." - Dave Cameron on Joey Votto
by Grahamophone on Dec 18, 2011 5:48 PM EST up reply actions
Oh man, you've fallen for it too?
‘gard is history’s greatest monster.
by ken on Dec 19, 2011 3:51 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
I think you guys are forgetting about me!
"Red Reporter - An elitist clique full of like-minded douchebags." - BK
You're just upset because I'm right
/reason’d
"Red Reporter - An elitist clique full of like-minded douchebags." - BK
Definitely one of the nicest RRs I've met
and Wa-a-a-a-a-a-acky Paul agrees!
by Charlie Scrabbles on Dec 21, 2011 12:31 AM EST up reply actions
I often sit and reflect on that day.
That was a good day.
"Red Reporter - An elitist clique full of like-minded douchebags." - BK
Oh, I love me some JinAZ, but I just haven't had much
interaction with him on these threads.
"Good luck, National League managers – I have no idea how you’re supposed to get this guy out." - Dave Cameron on Joey Votto
by Grahamophone on Dec 18, 2011 5:48 PM EST up reply actions
I didn't really start posting until after Slyde moved on to FSOH
"Good luck, National League managers – I have no idea how you’re supposed to get this guy out." - Dave Cameron on Joey Votto
by Grahamophone on Dec 18, 2011 5:49 PM EST up reply actions
I did want to rob him.
It all makes sense now.
Wear something sexy to my funeral.
by Pops Daniels on Dec 18, 2011 5:52 PM EST up reply actions
Did you antagonize him about stats?
"Good luck, National League managers – I have no idea how you’re supposed to get this guy out." - Dave Cameron on Joey Votto
by Grahamophone on Dec 18, 2011 5:50 PM EST up reply actions
hmm, then what happened?
"Good luck, National League managers – I have no idea how you’re supposed to get this guy out." - Dave Cameron on Joey Votto
by Grahamophone on Dec 18, 2011 5:51 PM EST up reply actions
He's far better than all of us
Like, an actual grown-up.
by Charlie Scrabbles on Dec 18, 2011 5:51 PM EST up reply actions
Not yet, should I be?
"Good luck, National League managers – I have no idea how you’re supposed to get this guy out." - Dave Cameron on Joey Votto
by Grahamophone on Dec 18, 2011 5:52 PM EST up reply actions
I have nothing to say
I never even have statuses for Facebook
"Good luck, National League managers – I have no idea how you’re supposed to get this guy out." - Dave Cameron on Joey Votto
by Grahamophone on Dec 18, 2011 5:54 PM EST up reply actions
What I'm asking is, what would I tweet about?
"Good luck, National League managers – I have no idea how you’re supposed to get this guy out." - Dave Cameron on Joey Votto
by Grahamophone on Dec 18, 2011 5:55 PM EST up reply actions
I might have to look into it
"Good luck, National League managers – I have no idea how you’re supposed to get this guy out." - Dave Cameron on Joey Votto
by Grahamophone on Dec 18, 2011 5:56 PM EST up reply actions
Fucking nonsense.
Just like everyone else. It is irony’s demise.
Wear something sexy to my funeral.
by Pops Daniels on Dec 18, 2011 5:56 PM EST up reply actions
I do remember 'tHan ripping me on his twitter
when I said I didn’t think Norm MacDonald is that funny.
"Good luck, National League managers – I have no idea how you’re supposed to get this guy out." - Dave Cameron on Joey Votto
by Grahamophone on Dec 18, 2011 5:59 PM EST up reply actions
We've gone over this before
"Good luck, National League managers – I have no idea how you’re supposed to get this guy out." - Dave Cameron on Joey Votto
by Grahamophone on Dec 18, 2011 6:00 PM EST up reply actions
My bad
"Good luck, National League managers – I have no idea how you’re supposed to get this guy out." - Dave Cameron on Joey Votto
by Grahamophone on Dec 18, 2011 6:01 PM EST up reply actions
Probably so
"Good luck, National League managers – I have no idea how you’re supposed to get this guy out." - Dave Cameron on Joey Votto
by Grahamophone on Dec 18, 2011 6:01 PM EST up reply actions
are you sure that it wasn't
’tHan saying he was “one of them” in a really creepy ostracizing way during the height of the funsucker suckage?
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
Norm wasn't bad on SNL or anything
but from what little I’ve heard of his standup it’s not like he’s Richard Pryor or something.
"Good luck, National League managers – I have no idea how you’re supposed to get this guy out." - Dave Cameron on Joey Votto
by Grahamophone on Dec 18, 2011 6:07 PM EST up reply actions
I might be more inclined to like him if
he wasn’t in such shitty movies
"Good luck, National League managers – I have no idea how you’re supposed to get this guy out." - Dave Cameron on Joey Votto
by Grahamophone on Dec 18, 2011 6:08 PM EST up reply actions
dirty work is the funniest movie of all time
and screwed isn’t far behind.
billy madison was also very funny.
Billy Madison sucks huge balls
"Good luck, National League managers – I have no idea how you’re supposed to get this guy out." - Dave Cameron on Joey Votto
by Grahamophone on Dec 18, 2011 6:10 PM EST up reply actions
Adam Sandler
minus Funny People and Punch Drunk Love sucks balls.
Wear something sexy to my funeral.
by Pops Daniels on Dec 18, 2011 6:11 PM EST up reply actions
Happy Gilmore is a little better
because Happy is more benign and at least his objective is noble. Billy Madison is a rich, spoiled twat who has pissed his life away, and is saved from being the most terrible person in the movie by the completely cartoonish and unrealistic Eric.
"Good luck, National League managers – I have no idea how you’re supposed to get this guy out." - Dave Cameron on Joey Votto
by Grahamophone on Dec 18, 2011 6:15 PM EST up reply actions
spoiler alert!
i think sandler’s movies have obviously gotten worse as he’s gotten older.
however, his first 2 cd were hilarious and click was a surprisingly good movie
I liked his opera man character
on SNL for what it’s worth.
And before everyone thinks I’m some dude with a stick up my ass, I do think terrible people can be funny. However, Billy Madison is only a good movie if you want Billy to succeed and I don’t see how anyone can pull for that character.
Another example is It’s Always Sunny is funny because the characters are so terrible that shit always comes back to bite them in the ass.
"Good luck, National League managers – I have no idea how you’re supposed to get this guy out." - Dave Cameron on Joey Votto
by Grahamophone on Dec 18, 2011 6:19 PM EST up reply actions
Excuse the terrible English
"Good luck, National League managers – I have no idea how you’re supposed to get this guy out." - Dave Cameron on Joey Votto
by Grahamophone on Dec 18, 2011 6:20 PM EST up reply actions
click was turrible
and very depressing
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 18, 2011 6:33 PM EST up reply actions
I'm glad I'm not the only one
I cried at the end of it
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 18, 2011 7:15 PM EST up reply actions
How do you manage to post with all those balls in your mouth?
"Wait, you think I'm being mean to the pretend orangutan?" -- battlekow
easy
my hands know the keyboard and i can type by feel
so all those balls in my mouth don’t bother me, i can focus on everything that i’m doing
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 18, 2011 7:24 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
And, he's just....
not funny. He’s seems a smart fella in real life. Just a bad modern interpretation of Jerry Lewis.
Wear something sexy to my funeral.
by Pops Daniels on Dec 18, 2011 6:17 PM EST up reply actions
you are reading WAY too much into Billy Madison
"Wait, you think I'm being mean to the pretend orangutan?" -- battlekow
This is true
but he’s still right. Billy Madison is a thoroughly unlikeable character.
But yeah, the key is not to think about it too much. He’s talking to the swan in the bathtub! That’s hilarious!
by Charlie Scrabbles on Dec 18, 2011 7:19 PM EST up reply actions
Exactly
it isn’t a movie that lends itself to any kind of reflection. If you think about it at all, you see he’s a terrible human being at worst, and a completely unrealistic character at best. So the point is to not over-think it, and just laugh when all the kids pee their pants.
by Charlie Scrabbles on Dec 18, 2011 7:31 PM EST up reply actions
You don't have to think about
Dodgeball and I like that movie.
"Good luck, National League managers – I have no idea how you’re supposed to get this guy out." - Dave Cameron on Joey Votto
by Grahamophone on Dec 18, 2011 9:17 PM EST up reply actions
Man
You are all over the map. That’s one of the worst movies I’ve ever seen.
by Charlie Scrabbles on Dec 18, 2011 9:23 PM EST up reply actions
I didn't say it was a masterpiece.
It’s a 2.5 star movie or so
"Good luck, National League managers – I have no idea how you’re supposed to get this guy out." - Dave Cameron on Joey Votto
by Grahamophone on Dec 18, 2011 9:25 PM EST up reply actions
Thank you, Pops
Adam Sandler always plays some completely unsympathetic, cruel, idiotic douchebag character with a speech impediment.
"Good luck, National League managers – I have no idea how you’re supposed to get this guy out." - Dave Cameron on Joey Votto
by Grahamophone on Dec 18, 2011 6:12 PM EST up reply actions
Or at least,
Sandler is just not funny. On purpose it seems. And that’s somehow supposed to be funny.
Wear something sexy to my funeral.
by Pops Daniels on Dec 18, 2011 6:13 PM EST up reply actions
I could be wrong here,
so I apologize if I am. And it looks like I could be.
[mods now feel free to delete as see fit etc.]
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
This is a very un-RR
post. For shame.
Wear something sexy to my funeral.
by Pops Daniels on Dec 18, 2011 6:10 PM EST up reply actions
Let's just stay over here.
It’s a lovely schizophrenic conversation.
Wear something sexy to my funeral.
by Pops Daniels on Dec 18, 2011 6:12 PM EST up reply actions
No, I will pee on that kitty cat.
Just not at dinner.
Wear something sexy to my funeral.
by Pops Daniels on Dec 18, 2011 6:22 PM EST up reply actions
Troll claim!
Snarkville dead ahead!
Buy RED: My Uncensored Life in Rock by Sammy Hagar, today
by obc2 on Dec 18, 2011 5:56 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
'tHan's moronic and wrongheaded arguments about Hamilton/Volquez no longer bait me to show him what a fucking moron he is
and you are more mature than i am, so you should stop this as well.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
hold the phone
how is ’tHan a fucking moron when it comes to the Hamilton / Volquez shitshow of a trade?
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 18, 2011 6:35 PM EST up reply actions
everyone just chill out
and watch a puppy playing with a baby.
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
use the up function next to reply and it jumps to the comment it was a reply to
when someone pointed it out to me awhile back, I just laughed at myself for it being right in front of me on the countless comments I’ve read on here and I never noticed it enough to figure out what it was.
EXACTLY.
A trade is like a ‘prospect’….you don’t know how its going to work out until it has played at least a year of MLB. AS ’tHan says: ALL THAT MATTERS ARE THE RESULTS
Boss “Say I just reviewed the projected sales figures from those two new guys you hired…those guys are nowhere near where you projected them to be!!”
General Sales Mgr: " Yeah well they were both excellent hires, great track records, good guys…plus we were able to let go of Mr. Blow-me, the guy that was only starting to make us a lot sales but was eventually going to cost us too much money..so how was I to know?
Boss "You’re fired…moron
Scott Roland should retire tomorrow.
c'mon Mads
you’re never this short-sighted
We got rid of Volquez and his salary
We were going to have to trade either Mesoraco or Grandal to get any top notch pitcher. I’m pro Grandal, but given that Latos was our return I’m ok with Grandal, but I’ll miss him. Had we found a way to make the trade be Mesoraco, Volquez, and Boxberger, IMO that’s a better deal, but I think they wanted Alosno as well.
Alonso’s bat would have played well for us in LF, if DustBrain actually would have played him, and we don’t know that he would have. We just can’t make that assumption.
And Boxberger was a reliever prospect throw in that no one should lose sleep over trading.
So I understand if you think giving up Alonso and Grandal was too much, however, Grandal’s behind Mesoraco and Hanigan (as a back up), and they’d never carry both Grandal and Mesoraco on the roster unless Grandal switches to a 1B.
Bottomline, this was a great trade for the Reds, and yeah, we’ll see the results, but the Reds needed pitching, and Grandal’s at least 1.5 seasons away, and who knows how Alonso will do this year? He could very well end up like a Sean Casey-lite, who knows?
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 18, 2011 11:31 PM EST up reply actions
If you say so...
I canna help but think this is a short-sighted trade.
Anyway the good part is definitely dumping Volquez.
Scott Roland should retire tomorrow.
now if we could just dump Pop's boy
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 19, 2011 9:33 PM EST up reply actions
Of course
but you don’t know what else Hamilton could have gotten us in 2007, Volquez might have been the best talent available.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
by Yossarian22 on Dec 18, 2011 11:27 AM EST up reply actions
looking at that Rangers team, wow, they turned themselves around quickly.
The outfield involved Kenny Lofton, Sammy Sosa, and Frank Catalanatto.
I’m not sure who you’d rather have on that pitching staff. Sure, Brandon McCarthy and CJ Wilson turned out great, but I don’t think anyone would’ve guessed that.
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
by Cy Schourek on Dec 18, 2011 11:31 AM EST up reply actions
I think he meant league-wide
Maybe the Dodgers would have given us Clay Kershaw.
by Charlie Scrabbles on Dec 18, 2011 11:34 AM EST up reply actions
The Tex trade with Atlanta helped quite a bit there
Go look at it, it’s crazy.
"Wait, you think I'm being mean to the pretend orangutan?" -- battlekow
It's eerily worst-case scenario for the Reds
A top-shelf bullpen arm, an ace, a catcher, and an infielder. Alonso can easily be as useful as Andrus, and Grandal could be better than Salty.
But still, that was for half a season of Tex, this is 4 seasons of Latos.
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
1.5 seasons of Tex
He was flipped about a year afterwards for just Casey Kotchman.
And the Braves are still awesome. Fuck them.
by Charlie Scrabbles on Dec 18, 2011 5:17 PM EST up reply actions
they let the Cards come from behind and take the wild card
They suck.
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
the years of team control make all the difference here
"Wait, you think I'm being mean to the pretend orangutan?" -- battlekow
at the time we never knew we'd turn Hamilton into Latos
nor did we know Volquez would have 1 awesome 1/2 season and be worthless after that
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 18, 2011 11:57 AM EST up reply actions
We turned Hamilton into 1/4 of the players turned into Latos
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
by Yossarian22 on Dec 18, 2011 12:24 PM EST up reply actions
But if we hadn't turned Hamilton into 1/4 first
we could have kept at least two of those four rather than have to include them for Latos.
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
i was agreeing with you
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
by Yossarian22 on Dec 18, 2011 12:36 PM EST up reply actions
and which ones would we have kept?
we wouldn’t need Alonso b/c we’d still have Hamilton.
We’d still have surplus of catching prospects
I guess Boxberger really was a big piece of this
and I have a feeling they’d still want an arm going to them, which wouldn’t have been Volquez b/c we’d still have hamilton.
So who do we keep?
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 18, 2011 1:32 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
when you put it like that
we could have kept them and use them for another trade. Walt still wants another pitcher.
Not that I think Walt seriously over paid.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
I think Walt paid just right
Grandal’s the only one I’ll miss
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 18, 2011 2:11 PM EST up reply actions
Who gets more playing time this year?
Hanigan or Mesoraco?
Either way, there was no room.
I BLEED RED
Meso had better get 70%+ unless he falls flat on his face
"Wait, you think I'm being mean to the pretend orangutan?" -- battlekow
'tHan, your realism is just too real
"Good luck, National League managers – I have no idea how you’re supposed to get this guy out." - Dave Cameron on Joey Votto
by Grahamophone on Dec 18, 2011 5:44 PM EST up reply actions
Eh, it all depends on if Dusty likes you
and Dusty seems to really like Meso. And it’s not like he’s been in love with Hanny.
Plus, neither speak Spanish fluently, so it’s not like he can use that excuse with Cueto and (hopefully) Chapman.
It feels so nice to be back to normal
this trade would really sting
if Latos gets hurt, Meso busts, and Grandal is one of the best catchers in baseball over the next decade.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
then we would just be cursed
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
The scary thing with Grandal
I keep thinking of when Bench said “He’s athletic, even if you can’t play him at catcher you can stick him at 1B”.
"Wait, you think I'm being mean to the pretend orangutan?" -- battlekow
which made Alonso all the more expendible
but, we can always find a replacement 1B..
Hopefully Walt will listen to me and bring back Dunn when the Reds can’t afford to keep Votto
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 18, 2011 6:38 PM EST up reply actions
no thanks
"Good luck, National League managers – I have no idea how you’re supposed to get this guy out." - Dave Cameron on Joey Votto
by Grahamophone on Dec 18, 2011 6:40 PM EST up reply actions
Doesn't make a ton of sense
If he’s that athletic you stick him at third or the OF. He’d better rake if you move him to first.
by ken on Dec 19, 2011 4:01 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
that's a big if about Mesoraco
I still think Grandal will be better
but we’re dancin’ with Mesoraco now, so let’s push all those chips to the middle of the table
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 18, 2011 6:36 PM EST up reply actions
exactly.
In a vacuum, its likely that the four of ‘em have more combined WAR then Latos. But it’s a whole heck of a lot less likely that they’ll have more combined WAR than Votto, Haniraco, Latos, and [last bullpen arm]. So it’s a good trade.
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
by Cy Schourek on Dec 18, 2011 10:20 AM EST up reply actions
Walt was on WLW
and he said this free’s up “quite a bit of money” to talk to use for 2011.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
via teh fay
Volquez was arbitration-eligible and due to make $2.5 million or so. Alonso was due to make $600,000. Latos will make about $500,000 this year.
"We save some in this deals that we’ll be able to apply to other needs we have," Jocketty said. "That was definitely a consideration."
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
also Walt said that Coco is back on the table
What would be approriate money for Coco? Is 8 years and $2M too much?
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
below minimum wage
Perhaps all fans would be diverted past a donation jar on the way out of Great American. Tip your closer generously, folks!
by DevilsAdvocate on Dec 17, 2011 5:57 PM EST up reply actions
switch that to 2 years and $8m...
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
justin strikes again
Individuality: Always remember that you are unique. Just like everybody else.
by joshuar9476 on Dec 18, 2011 9:35 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
That's impressivve, even for you buddy
"Wait, you think I'm being mean to the pretend orangutan?" -- battlekow
I disagree that Volquez is bad
He’s a lot like Zambrano in my opinion. Great stuff and dominating at times, but an absolute headcase.
"Wait, you think I'm being mean to the pretend orangutan?" -- battlekow
Yeah
Volquez has been an awful pitcher but he is plenty talented and has the physical stuff to turn it around, whom I wouldn’t mind having in my organization.
Where as somebody like Josh Fogg is a bad pitcher who I would never want to waste my time with.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
he's like zambrano without all the years of very good performance
by 'tHan on Dec 18, 2011 4:33 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I mean he's like Zambrano in that you never really know what you're going to get and that you can see the wheels coming off before it happens
"Wait, you think I'm being mean to the pretend orangutan?" -- battlekow
he's like victor zambrano
You were just a rich girl only having fun. Your worn out dresses brought stares from everyone. Hey little rich girl, where did you go wrong?
Go Mat Latos!
He’s my favorite acquisition this off season!
by thevole on Dec 17, 2011 3:55 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
heh
A hot dog at the ballgame beats roast beef at the Ritz. ~Humphrey Bogart
by PeteyHendrix on Dec 18, 2011 5:08 AM EST up reply actions
I'm not as in love with it as you seem to be
But it’s definitely solid. Sad to see Alonso go, and it’s possible that Grandal turns out better than Meso, but in the short to medium term, this is phenomenal.
(I think you meant to include ‘relief’ in the assessment of Boxy, also. Relief prospects <<< Starter prospects and all that)
Biggest need really looks to be filled now, which is excellent. I’m a bit worried the salary relief coming from this goes to Cordero, but that wouldn’t be the end of the world.
just like zack Stewart!
Buy RED: My Uncensored Life in Rock by Sammy Hagar, today
by obc2 on Dec 17, 2011 4:41 PM EST via iPhone app up reply actions 7 recs
dougdirt'd
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 18, 2011 12:03 PM EST up reply actions
Where is Zack these days? I vaguely remember him having a really good start that we all chuckled about
"Wait, you think I'm being mean to the pretend orangutan?" -- battlekow
He was part of the big deal with Rasmus
and ended up with the White Sox.
by Charlie Scrabbles on Dec 18, 2011 5:18 PM EST up reply actions
Looks like we were working in parallel
Consider mine the announcement/poll thread. This can be the SABR/overflow/smoother-running thread.
Mgr., Red Reporter
"Bootsy, you're a superstar right?"
"Twinkle, twinkle, babble."
by RijoSaboCaseyWKRP on Dec 17, 2011 4:11 PM EST reply actions
That seems like a long way to say "RR thread"
Mgr., Red Reporter
"Bootsy, you're a superstar right?"
"Twinkle, twinkle, babble."
by RijoSaboCaseyWKRP on Dec 17, 2011 4:31 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
.gifs are the worst thing ever
They need their own cage in which to reside
Buy RED: My Uncensored Life in Rock by Sammy Hagar, today
by obc2 on Dec 17, 2011 5:03 PM EST via iPhone app up reply actions
Boy, if I ever get a farm one day
I’m just gonna let .gifs run around free to play and roam.
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
by Cy Schourek on Dec 17, 2011 10:49 PM EST up reply actions
What happens when they escape from the farm and start terrorizing your neighbors?
Then we will have to send Jack Hanna out to hunt them down.
It is foolish to allow people to own as many .gifs as they want without proper training.
And fentanyl ain't that like super-morphine for elephants and soldiers with their head blown off
by RoastBeefKazenzakis on Dec 17, 2011 10:51 PM EST up reply actions 3 recs
I'll have to hire a full-time .gif wrangler, I suppose.
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
by Cy Schourek on Dec 17, 2011 11:15 PM EST up reply actions
sure, so jim day can pick them off more readily?
sick bastage…
\gif is an abbreviation, right?
... I still say it was a touchdown, got tammit.
...
Let a man come in and do the Popcorn.
Crum-Bum Beat
by -ManBearPig on Dec 18, 2011 12:44 PM EST up reply actions 5 recs
easily in my top 5 fav gifs I send to people at work via Sametime
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 18, 2011 1:33 PM EST up reply actions
we're switching to whatever replaced Microsoft Office Communicator by the end of Q1 2012 I believe
Sametime is the only thing we don’t have integrated between our MS Office products, and SharePoint(s). We used to be a HUGE IBM shop, so for whatever reason they stuck with Sametime instead of going to Office Communicator when we moved to Outlook from Lotus Notes
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 18, 2011 2:13 PM EST up reply actions
Office Communicator is pretty slick
"Wait, you think I'm being mean to the pretend orangutan?" -- battlekow
We're running Microsoft Lync
It’s tight
"Aroldis Chapman is a seven course meal followed by four hours of sex on the table with a nymphomaniac model heiress who owns her own brewery." - jch24
by BK on Dec 18, 2011 4:39 PM EST up reply actions
I'm not familiar, I'mma go check it out
Condolences on today by the way, I was shocked to see that score. Tu Holloway’s POY candidacy just got a lot stronger.
"Wait, you think I'm being mean to the pretend orangutan?" -- battlekow
Let me put it this way
I’m as embarrassed by that performance than I was with the postgame presser last week
"Aroldis Chapman is a seven course meal followed by four hours of sex on the table with a nymphomaniac model heiress who owns her own brewery." - jch24
by BK on Dec 18, 2011 4:42 PM EST up reply actions
Lync
I think that’s what we’re going to
That’s the next generation of Office Communicator
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 18, 2011 6:41 PM EST up reply actions
And Lotus Notes can suck a dick
"Wait, you think I'm being mean to the pretend orangutan?" -- battlekow
I'm amazed at the people at work that wish we still had it..
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 18, 2011 6:42 PM EST up reply actions
If an animated gif is killing your connection in 2011, you need to move
"Wait, you think I'm being mean to the pretend orangutan?" -- battlekow
Sorry, sir!
I checked the draft post list to see if someone was doing it, but might have missed it. Was trying to get it done on a pretty tight timeline! :)
I write at:
Red Reporter | Basement-Dwellers.com | Twitter: @jinazreds
by JinAZ on Dec 17, 2011 9:30 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Wait, what?
Alonso is a low defense, low/moderate power 1B.
Did I miss something?
Still not a candidate.
Low power is stupid. Moderate is right.
He’ll probably only hit 15-20 homers playing in SD. Lots of doubles though I’d bet.
That's too bad. Slighty chubby doubles hitters never pan out in San Diego.
Oh wait…
they totally do!
by Supreme Olajuwon on Dec 17, 2011 4:24 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
After gawking at him at Redsfest, I wouldn't say he's even slightly chubby.
He’s leaned up quite a bit.
18, if the reports I saw were correct
Not 17, not 19…..18 pounds. After he went pee pee and got a haircut.
"Wait, you think I'm being mean to the pretend orangutan?" -- battlekow
Too bad..
he’s going to eat himself into diabetic shock from the depression of being traded by a winning team to a losing team
I BLEED RED
He gets to live in San Diego
And play in a park that perfectly suits his style. I think he’ll enjoy himself.
Does San Diego have America's best weather? I've never been but even people from Honolulu seemed to think so.
"Wait, you think I'm being mean to the pretend orangutan?" -- battlekow
I think it's a strong contender.
Little humidity and it’s far enough from LA to avoid the smog. It’s pretty great.
One of my roommates is from San Diego and heading home
for Christmas the same day I am. When she told me what the weather was going to be like, I briefly got sad that I was only going to Ohio and Missouri.
by the finest muffins on Dec 18, 2011 4:47 PM EST up reply actions
He's not making big money and he's playing for losers
Might as well have been traded to the ’stros
I BLEED RED
It's pretty great here
never colder than 55 or hotter than 85. Ton of sun. It’s gorgeous
Fuck lion say what! i got a fuck lion now come fuck wit me
That sounds like Casey
Nothing to turn up one’s nose at, but also no Votto.
"The USA despite its flaws and corruption and overall messiness is still a great and powerful instrument of freedom and hope for the entire world." - Madville
Casey is the comp I keep coming back to as well
I think Alonso will be a little better than Casey
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
The Padres have reacquired Wally Joyner!
by FordhamRam on Dec 18, 2011 9:25 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Was it worth Andy Ashby?
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
by Cy Schourek on Dec 18, 2011 10:23 AM EST up reply actions
That's a nice comp dude
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
Karros is a bad comp.
A hot dog at the ballgame beats roast beef at the Ritz. ~Humphrey Bogart
by PeteyHendrix on Dec 18, 2011 3:48 PM EST up reply actions
.325 career OBP for Karros
.370 OBP for Alonso in the minors
Completely different players who approach the game differently.
A hot dog at the ballgame beats roast beef at the Ritz. ~Humphrey Bogart
by PeteyHendrix on Dec 19, 2011 6:38 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah, they're different
but in terms of overall production I think their careers might look similar.
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
I couldn't disagree more.
Alonso makes his living getting on base and battling through PAs.
Karros was an all-or-nothing, swing for the fences guy who only got cumulative stats like 30 HR and 100 RBI in a season because he could stay healthy and put up nearly 700 PAs every year.
Karros had a career .779 OPS as a first baseman…which stinks. I don’t think Karros was much more than a AAAA player. He had three good years surrounded by mediocrity, and those three years were BABIP anomolies. I don’t see Alonso as a .779 career hitter. I think he is gifted beyond that, and in just the right way: not making outs.
A hot dog at the ballgame beats roast beef at the Ritz. ~Humphrey Bogart
by PeteyHendrix on Dec 19, 2011 6:48 PM EST up reply actions
Alonso seemed like the only Red last season that knew what a strike zone was.
by Im_a_fun_haver on Dec 17, 2011 5:06 PM EST up reply actions
yeahhhh Votto sucked and BP had the worst season of his career!
Tequila and pancakes, anyone?
by Kevin Mitchell is Batman on Dec 17, 2011 5:57 PM EST up reply actions
Other than Votto, Alonso had the best approach at the plate.
by Im_a_fun_haver on Dec 17, 2011 6:32 PM EST up reply actions
This I agree with, I love watching him hit
Reminds me a lot of Votto in that he seems to go to the plate with an approach in mind and doesn’t deviate too much.
"Wait, you think I'm being mean to the pretend orangutan?" -- battlekow
and what else?
b/c after a let down in 2011 I think it’s perfectly acceptable to trade off 2 prospects for an all in move for 2012.
Says something to the fanbase, don’t you think?
Cards lost your boy Pujols, Brewers will probably be without Braun for 50 days, so the fucking Central is ours for the taking.
Walt finally did something
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 18, 2011 11:33 PM EST up reply actions
I meant low/moderate for a 1B
I’m really not sold on his bat, and especially his power. He could be good. But I dunno. -j
I write at:
Red Reporter | Basement-Dwellers.com | Twitter: @jinazreds
by JinAZ on Dec 17, 2011 9:32 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
I'll take that bet and you're gonna regret 'cause I'm the best that's ever been
"Wait, you think I'm being mean to the pretend orangutan?" -- battlekow
Rotation
Cueto, Latos, Leake, Bailey, Arroyo.
Chapman starting again in L’Ville. Wood doing the same – or possibly joining the ’pen?
Mgr., Red Reporter
"Bootsy, you're a superstar right?"
"Twinkle, twinkle, babble."
by RijoSaboCaseyWKRP on Dec 17, 2011 4:32 PM EST reply actions
Wood doesn't thrill me as a pen arm.
I could see him being the swing guy/Arroyo’s backup, though.
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
by Cy Schourek on Dec 17, 2011 10:50 PM EST up reply actions
Ours
Mgr., Red Reporter
"Bootsy, you're a superstar right?"
"Twinkle, twinkle, babble."
by RijoSaboCaseyWKRP on Dec 17, 2011 4:45 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Let's get another "t" on that name though, hmm?
Mgr., Red Reporter
"Bootsy, you're a superstar right?"
"Twinkle, twinkle, babble."
by RijoSaboCaseyWKRP on Dec 17, 2011 4:46 PM EST reply actions
A guy's name is no reason to hayte him.
"The USA despite its flaws and corruption and overall messiness is still a great and powerful instrument of freedom and hope for the entire world." - Madville
by bbjones on Dec 17, 2011 6:17 PM EST up reply actions 4 recs
Mat LaTost
"Aroldis Chapman is a seven course meal followed by four hours of sex on the table with a nymphomaniac model heiress who owns her own brewery." - jch24
by BK on Dec 17, 2011 7:07 PM EST up reply actions 6 recs
He's a pitcher...
You find who has no arms and no legs and is sitting on your doorstep.
What, me? Being negative? No. Never.
by Paul Householder on Dec 17, 2011 8:48 PM EST up reply actions
Really?
I think that he fits the Reds to a “T”!
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
by Cy Schourek on Dec 17, 2011 10:50 PM EST up reply actions
sooner or later, everyone comes around to 'tHan's way of thinking! buster olney on twitter:
IMO: Would’ve traded Votto this winter for huge prospect haul, plugged Alonso at first. Could’ve contended that way,too,and managed payroll.
this was my idea
Thief!
Buy RED: My Uncensored Life in Rock by Sammy Hagar, today
by obc2 on Dec 17, 2011 4:49 PM EST via iPhone app up reply actions
Walt's too conservative to ever think like that
so this is a welcome plan B.
The “window” is definitely shorter now, though.
We're all mad. I'm mad. You're mad. Otherwise, you wouldn't have come here.
Conservaties don't believe in Plan B, either!
by FordhamRam on Dec 17, 2011 4:54 PM EST up reply actions 11 recs
Not necessarily.
Bob wants him locked up. This trade could very well be a first step toward accomplishing it.
Votto hopefully sees that the administration is trying to build a winning team around him, at the expense of similarly-positioned prospects no less…
Does is it seem like Votto is determined to leave unless the Reds wow him with an offer?
Or is it just me?
"Good luck, National League managers – I have no idea how you’re supposed to get this guy out." - Dave Cameron on Joey Votto
by Grahamophone on Dec 17, 2011 6:24 PM EST up reply actions
I think Votto may be deterimined to test the market
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
Not just test the market, but do everything possible to leave Cincinnati.
"Good luck, National League managers – I have no idea how you’re supposed to get this guy out." - Dave Cameron on Joey Votto
by Grahamophone on Dec 17, 2011 6:30 PM EST up reply actions
I have never gotten the feeling Votto hates Cincinnati
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
Maybe it's just me, what say you, other RRers?
"Good luck, National League managers – I have no idea how you’re supposed to get this guy out." - Dave Cameron on Joey Votto
by Grahamophone on Dec 17, 2011 6:33 PM EST up reply actions
I think he's determined to get paid what he's worth
And he’s smart enough to know that’ll be tough for the Reds to pull off. I’ve never gotten the impression he hates Cincinnati or the Reds.
Slyde pointed out on twitter that a considerable amount of money will be coming off the books in 2014,
perhaps as much as 18-20m. Obviously other salaries will escalate, but it may not be absurd to think the Reds can afford Votto if they want to, and if the money situation stays stable or improves.
by Cuetotally Amazing on Dec 18, 2011 5:00 PM EST up reply actions
i've noticed several of you slowly starting to develop hope that the reds can & will sign votto to an extension
this is going to end in heartbreak for you guys
by 'tHan on Dec 18, 2011 5:01 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I think you are right, 'tHan
"Good luck, National League managers – I have no idea how you’re supposed to get this guy out." - Dave Cameron on Joey Votto
by Grahamophone on Dec 18, 2011 5:01 PM EST up reply actions
But the Cardinals were players, and their offer was similar to the offer he took.
So it’s not like they just threw up their hands.
by Cuetotally Amazing on Dec 18, 2011 5:04 PM EST up reply actions
During the season they offered five years, then something like 8 years when the bidding started.
by Cuetotally Amazing on Dec 18, 2011 5:06 PM EST up reply actions
I think the difference lies in the no trade clause
I wouldn’t want people shooting my name off at the mouth before every trade deadline for the next 10 years if I could help it.
I BLEED RED
That's what his wife said--
they were offended with the five year offer, and then wanted a no-trade clause in the end.
by Cuetotally Amazing on Dec 18, 2011 5:15 PM EST up reply actions
I think the dealbreaker was that the Cardinals didn't offer
Pujols a post-career job with the organization
"Good luck, National League managers – I have no idea how you’re supposed to get this guy out." - Dave Cameron on Joey Votto
by Grahamophone on Dec 18, 2011 5:06 PM EST up reply actions
I think it is possible Votto stays.
I wouldn’t be shocked if he stays, but I think it is more likely he leaves.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
I'd rather hope for the best than scoff at those who dare to.
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
by Cy Schourek on Dec 18, 2011 5:04 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
'tHan is right, again
"Good luck, National League managers – I have no idea how you’re supposed to get this guy out." - Dave Cameron on Joey Votto
by Grahamophone on Dec 18, 2011 5:06 PM EST up reply actions
No pain
"Good luck, National League managers – I have no idea how you’re supposed to get this guy out." - Dave Cameron on Joey Votto
by Grahamophone on Dec 18, 2011 5:15 PM EST up reply actions
oh sure.
But as FVA said, it’s summertime and we’re dancing with the prettiest girl in town. I’m going to enjoy it.
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
by Cy Schourek on Dec 18, 2011 5:06 PM EST up reply actions 3 recs
We just really don't know though.
He hasn’t given an indication either way.
The Reds like him enough to not trade him, indicating they want to make a run at signing him.
The owners have plenty of money, if they want to spend it.
If the Reds make the playoffs and do well, they will have bigger payrolls.
There are plenty of reasons to be optimistic, or at least not pessimisticl
by Cuetotally Amazing on Dec 18, 2011 5:07 PM EST up reply actions
The owners have plenty of money?
"Good luck, National League managers – I have no idea how you’re supposed to get this guy out." - Dave Cameron on Joey Votto
by Grahamophone on Dec 18, 2011 5:08 PM EST up reply actions
The Castellinis have plenty of money.
The issue is how they want to spend it.
by Cuetotally Amazing on Dec 18, 2011 5:12 PM EST up reply actions
I believe that they are tight with payroll, but I've never heard it confirmed
"Good luck, National League managers – I have no idea how you’re supposed to get this guy out." - Dave Cameron on Joey Votto
by Grahamophone on Dec 18, 2011 5:14 PM EST up reply actions
Absolutely, they run the Reds as a business.
But they’ve never had someone like Votto before.
by Cuetotally Amazing on Dec 18, 2011 5:16 PM EST up reply actions
There is reason to believe that it's a far better business move
to plow back all the profits into payroll/player development
"Good luck, National League managers – I have no idea how you’re supposed to get this guy out." - Dave Cameron on Joey Votto
by Grahamophone on Dec 18, 2011 5:17 PM EST up reply actions
Absolutely.
But it would probably also have been a better business move to not sign Arroyo to such a generous extension. We will see what happens with Philips. They appear to consider a lot of factors when they make decisions, including fan favorites.
by Cuetotally Amazing on Dec 18, 2011 5:20 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah, the Arroyo contract pissed me off at the time
and I only get madder about it as time passes
"Good luck, National League managers – I have no idea how you’re supposed to get this guy out." - Dave Cameron on Joey Votto
by Grahamophone on Dec 18, 2011 5:22 PM EST up reply actions
Lets see how the next four years go
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
I think they're going to try but fail
"Wait, you think I'm being mean to the pretend orangutan?" -- battlekow
From where? Arroyo?
Or is most of that 18-20 Just Votto’s contract expiring?
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
Rolen is off the books after next season
and so is BeeP, for now. Masset will be a FA, too.
by Charlie Scrabbles on Dec 18, 2011 5:25 PM EST up reply actions
I don't think there is any evidence he hates it here.
What he said about not wanting an extension, if you take it at face value, makes sense and is perfectly reasonable.
Let a man come in and do the Popcorn.
Crum-Bum Beat
he was interviewed one time saying he liked the small-town feel, wasn't he?
Old guys Harang and Arroyo are replaced by Cueto and Latos: a solid young core.
Through in WS rings for ‘12 and ’13, and I’m guessing he feels more like signing a long term contract.
"The USA despite its flaws and corruption and overall messiness is still a great and powerful instrument of freedom and hope for the entire world." - Madville
I don't remember him saying that, but he could have.
Given his issues in the past (none of us know if his emotional issues are a recurring thing or was just a one time deal), it makes sense that he could want to stay in a small town.
I wouldn’t be shocked if he left, but you have to believe that the front office’s priority #1 is trying to figure out a way to keep Votto in Cincy. Which is why a BP extension should not happen.
Let a man come in and do the Popcorn.
Crum-Bum Beat
I'm becoming more and more persuaded in favor of that position
At the same time, BP has everything anyone could hope for out of a 2B and then some.
The time it’s taken for a contract to get hammered out I think betrays Walt’s attempt at radio silence on the issue and highlights the immense difficulty of the situation.
The problem with BP
is his age. He’s not going to be a premium second baseman for too much longer. No long extension for him, please, Walt.
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
Pressure can actually be greater in a small, confined market
My hunch is that he’d love to go to LA – big market, weather, Lakers, and relative anonymity for a baseball star.
by ken on Dec 19, 2011 4:12 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
I don't think he hates Cincinnati
He said something in a recent interview that I think rings true. He said he signed the 3-year deal hoping the Reds would win, more tickets would be sold, and the Reds would be able to afford to pay him what he’s worth.
I think he wants what most players want: to be paid as much as possible (it’s a matter of respect, not just money), and to play for contending team. If Cincinnati could give him that, he’d stay.
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
yup
Players aren’t greedy per se, they just want “respect”. Imagine someone being paid twice as much as you at your work while being equally productive. Now imagine that company X offers you their salary +10%. Do you stay or do you go?
"Wait, you think I'm being mean to the pretend orangutan?" -- battlekow
Everything I've seen and heard from him points to the contrary, actually.
Of course he wants to get paid, and I’m sure if a big market team offers him a much bigger contract (which is likely) he’ll leave. But I think he enjoys Cincinnati.
Joey did the Reds a favor, imo
He signed that 3-year extension and allowed his arb years to be bought out. If he went year-to-year, he would’ve made a lot more money.
I think he’ll give them every chance to bring him back, but he’s going where the money is.
Respect my authoritah!
I disagree
he probably would have made about the same, unless he happens to get injured in which case he would have made less. Joey hasn’t given anybody any discounts and I doubt he’s likely to.
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
i bet if he only went year to year
he would end up making even more over those 3 years.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
by Yossarian22 on Dec 18, 2011 12:38 PM EST up reply actions
I don't, look at what Howard got in arbitration.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
by Yossarian22 on Dec 18, 2011 12:39 PM EST up reply actions
In his first year of arb eligibility
by Charlie Scrabbles on Dec 18, 2011 12:47 PM EST up reply actions
a few years ago
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
by Yossarian22 on Dec 18, 2011 12:49 PM EST up reply actions
But if he would have
he would have made more money.
by Charlie Scrabbles on Dec 18, 2011 12:51 PM EST up reply actions
typical 40, 60, 80 in arbitration
equates to 15 mil and then 20 mil if he woulda went through arbitration again
Except that he wasn't as good in the years after his forst arb year
so, factor that in too
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
No way Votto gets 17 million in arbitration. NO WAY.
"Wait, you think I'm being mean to the pretend orangutan?" -- battlekow
Probably not
but this, his second year of arb, would most likely net much more than the $9 mil he’s being paid. So I think the extension just back-loaded his monies is all.
by Charlie Scrabbles on Dec 18, 2011 5:26 PM EST up reply actions
Arb is way too risky to be that certain
There are so few compel for a guy as good as Votto, and the team could draw a bad panel. I don’t think $17m would be out of the question at all.
by ken on Dec 19, 2011 4:16 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
I'm not sure if you want to be compared with Buster Olney
by DerekH91 on Dec 17, 2011 4:52 PM EST up reply actions 5 recs
Rec'd.
How about you agree to waive the fine and I promise not to email you the remaining eighty six photos of my dog dressed as a bear.
by Fat Vegas Alan on Dec 17, 2011 4:55 PM EST up reply actions
I'M STILL FREAKING GIDDY ABOUT THIS TRADE!!!!!
My wife is mad at me because I’m making her wrap the presents by herself while I’m here on Red Reporter talking about the trade.
"Bitch slap your goldfish folks, we're all screwed."
-KevinMitchellisBatman
better get her something extra nice for Christmas
I don’t blame you, though. This is not your average Saturday afternoon on the internets. Mat Latos. Holy guacamole. Honestly, I thought he was out of our league.
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
just not in our division
got yer back there, ’nuk
"The USA despite its flaws and corruption and overall messiness is still a great and powerful instrument of freedom and hope for the entire world." - Madville
good work, Walt
I take back all the bad things I said.
This is the kind of move the Reds needed to make. It might not work out, but I will never criticize Walt for trying. We gave up a ton, but we’re getting a lot back, too.
And by my count, we now have three empty spaces on the roster. Boxy wasn’t on the 40-man yet, Grandal, Volquez and Alonso were. So we added one, subtracted three. Roster stands at 37.
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
RH LF, backup SS, closer
I assume.
Tequila and pancakes, anyone?
by Kevin Mitchell is Batman on Dec 17, 2011 5:59 PM EST up reply actions
not in the order of importance or $$ amount, no.
Maybe the order of who signs first, though.
I feel like the closer market won’t fully shake out until late January.
Tequila and pancakes, anyone?
by Kevin Mitchell is Batman on Dec 17, 2011 6:02 PM EST up reply actions
I can see that.
After listening to Walt talk with Ken Broo on 700 WLW, he mentioned that a “few” outfielders have contacted the Reds about signing with them. We already know that Willingham was interested but for our lack of money.
It sounds like they're talking to Kubel now
I wouldn’t hate that. He’s pretty much Gomes with better D
I'd be fine with that.
And perhaps trading Yonder leaves the door open for us to sign Dimitri Young as a backup 1B.
I haven't been around
This whole thing with Dmitri Young is a joke, right?
by Brendanukkah on Dec 17, 2011 7:08 PM EST up reply actions
is Todd Hollandsworth available?
Buy RED: My Uncensored Life in Rock by Sammy Hagar, today
by obc2 on Dec 17, 2011 8:10 PM EST via iPhone app up reply actions 1 recs
Rookie of the year, by god
/JeromeWalton’d
"Wait, you think I'm being mean to the pretend orangutan?" -- battlekow
Andruw Jones please!
"Good luck, National League managers – I have no idea how you’re supposed to get this guy out." - Dave Cameron on Joey Votto
by Grahamophone on Dec 17, 2011 6:25 PM EST up reply actions
Alittle better hitter than Gomes
a little better fielder. I would not care for him much, especially for the price he’ll get.
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
I still don't see why there needs to be a backup SS acquired
In the infield, you already have Votto, BP, Cozy, and Rolen, with Janish, Cairo, END, and Frazier backing them up. If a veteran infielder was going to happen, I don’t think Janish would have got a contract.
"Aroldis Chapman is a seven course meal followed by four hours of sex on the table with a nymphomaniac model heiress who owns her own brewery." - jch24
by BK on Dec 17, 2011 6:19 PM EST up reply actions
I think the problem is, what happens if Cozart goes down
Janish is most likely the everyday shortstop, with Negron backing him up.
For the right price I wouldn’t mind Theriot, a back up middle infielder who’s bat isn’t a black hole isn’t a bad thing.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
Nope
I want nothing to do with Theriot, because Dusty would start him everyday over Cozart. Don’t act like he fucking wouldn’t.
"Aroldis Chapman is a seven course meal followed by four hours of sex on the table with a nymphomaniac model heiress who owns her own brewery." - jch24
by BK on Dec 17, 2011 6:22 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I don't know about that
I think Dusty gets very hung up on roles, and depth charts. I would like to believe if Cozart out plays Theriot, Cozart will play everyday.
I think Dusty read Janish’s scouting report and tagged Janish as a backup. I think he read Frazier’s scouting report and tagged him as a utility guy. Where as he read Francisco’s report and he sees star.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
If Dusty played people based on merit, Heisey would have had 500 ABs last season
and Gomes and Lewis would have been DFA’d by June.
Heisey was already tagged as a 4th outfielder
I just don’t think Dusty does well with changes.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
Theriot is one of those "proven major leaguers."
Once you show you can stick around for a season or two, Dusty doesn’t care how bad you are, you’re always Jake when it comes to your ability to play.
Heisey has been exposed every time he has had exyended playing time
"Wait, you think I'm being mean to the pretend orangutan?" -- battlekow
Overdrafts suck
Just poor financial management
Buy RED: My Uncensored Life in Rock by Sammy Hagar, today
The first time he got an extended look was because everyone else was injured
and so was Heisey, actually. But he had to play through it anyway. I wouldn’t count that against him.
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
I didn't remember him playing through an injury...
link?
A hot dog at the ballgame beats roast beef at the Ritz. ~Humphrey Bogart
by PeteyHendrix on Dec 19, 2011 6:39 PM EST up reply actions
That was a long time ago man....
I really don’t wanna dig for a link about an injury that wasn’t even made official by a DL trip…
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
You lazy whore.
No point in chatting sabermetrics with a guy who’s afraid of google.
A hot dog at the ballgame beats roast beef at the Ritz. ~Humphrey Bogart
by PeteyHendrix on Dec 19, 2011 6:50 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
He has OPS'd 200 points higher as a sub in his career
I’m not sure why that is, but it is.
"Wait, you think I'm being mean to the pretend orangutan?" -- battlekow
word on the street is because he can't handle breaking balls
and in late and close situations with runners on base a pitcher’s are more likely to throw fastballs.
That is at least how those who have played the game explain it.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
by Yossarian22 on Dec 20, 2011 10:59 AM EST up reply actions
this post has some syntax and apostrophe issues
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
by Yossarian22 on Dec 20, 2011 11:02 AM EST up reply actions
You don't remember Renteria, Lewis, Patterson, Gomes, or A-Gon?
"Aroldis Chapman is a seven course meal followed by four hours of sex on the table with a nymphomaniac model heiress who owns her own brewery." - jch24
by BK on Dec 17, 2011 6:28 PM EST up reply actions
But who was Patterson blocking?
Who was Renteria blocking?
Who was Lewis and Gomes Blocking?
Who was A-Gon blocking?
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
Stubbs, Cozart, Heisey, Heisey, Cozart
"Aroldis Chapman is a seven course meal followed by four hours of sex on the table with a nymphomaniac model heiress who owns her own brewery." - jch24
by BK on Dec 17, 2011 6:30 PM EST up reply actions
Really
Because it seems to me that Patterson was a Red in 2008, and Stubbs didn’t debut until 2009.
Heisey maybe, but his numbers tank when he starts.
A-Gon left the Reds in 2009, Cozart didn’t join the team until 2011.
Renteria didn’t get any starts after Cozart was promoted.
Seems like your beef is more with Walter than Dusty.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
Stubbs wasn't ready when Patterson was playing
Patterson was “blocking” Dickerson and NoHo. Cozart was nowhere near ready when AGon was playing. Lewis and Gomes have indeed taken time Dusty should have been giving to Heisey or others.
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
I'm a little worried that Theriot would start over Cozart
But not too much. Dusty seems to have faith in Cozart. He stuck with Bruce and Stubbs even when they struggled. I don’t think he has quite as much faith in Cozart, but he has a lot more than he ever had in Janish. Dusty’s the one that forced Cozart’s callup, and he used him until he was injured.
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
I don't see evidence that Dusty forced that callup
I agree that he wouldn’t make Theriot the outright starter, but I think Theriot would still start about 30 more games than he ought to, even if Cozart performs adequately.
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
I think Dusty did force it
Walt kept saying he wasn’t going to make change for change’s sake, the Reds had plenty of offense, etc. It wasn’t until Dusty benched Janish that Cozart was called up.
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
IF cozart goes down, you go out and find a gonzo or theriot to trade a scrubb AA player for
Individuality: Always remember that you are unique. Just like everybody else.
I think Walt doesn't trust Cozart
He’s afraid he’ll struggle like Janish did. Then what? Bench him for Janish?
Janish has options, and can be stashed in Louisville as insurance. As we saw last year, depth is a good thing. We needed all three of our shortstops last year.
I think they also want a SS who can play a little OF. By my count, we’ll still have only four OFers on the roster. Alonso is gone, which means we’re either adding another LFer, or using Heisey there. If Heisey becomes the starter, they’ll need a backup CFer (Sappelt?).
I don’t see Janish and Frazier making the roster (barring injury or another big trade). They’ll be AAA insurance. I think there will be 13 position players, and they will be Mez, Hanigan, Votto, BP, Rolen, END, Cozart, Cairo, Heisey (or new LFer), veteran backup SS guy, Bruce, Stubbs, and Sappelt (if Heisey becomes LFer).
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
I say sign Andruw Jones!
Sappelt backs up in centerfield. Heisey/Sappelt/Jones mix in left field.
"Good luck, National League managers – I have no idea how you’re supposed to get this guy out." - Dave Cameron on Joey Votto
by Grahamophone on Dec 17, 2011 6:47 PM EST up reply actions
that's too many roster spots
If we sign the guy whose mom can’t spell “Andrew,” Heisey is the backup CFer, and Sappelt starts in RF in Louisville.
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
Don't they normally carry 5 outfielders?
"Good luck, National League managers – I have no idea how you’re supposed to get this guy out." - Dave Cameron on Joey Votto
by Grahamophone on Dec 18, 2011 12:47 AM EST up reply actions
I think with Alonso out of hte picture,
Frazier has a spot on the big league bench.
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
by Cy Schourek on Dec 18, 2011 12:54 AM EST up reply actions
I still don't see how there's room for him
Unless END is traded. And I don’t think he’s going to be, because they hope he’s the third baseman of the future.
If Heisey becomes the starting LFer, they’ll need a backup CFer. That will probably be Sappelt, with Phipps as insurance. Frazier cannot play CF.
It’s the same if they sign an LFer like Andruw. He’ll need a roster spot, and Heisey will be the backup CFer, leaving Frazier out in the cold again.
IMO, the only way Frazier makes the roster is if he’s the starting LFer.
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
Well, something is weird now.
OF: Stubbs, Bruce, Heisey, Sappelt
IF: Votto, BP, Cozart, Rolen, END, Cairo, [Backup SS]
Is this your team, plus two catchers and 12 pitchers?
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
by Cy Schourek on Dec 18, 2011 10:26 AM EST up reply actions
Throw Janish and Frazier into that mix
And you have a whole load of players who will be really unhappy if any of them get sent to Louisville to start the year
"Aroldis Chapman is a seven course meal followed by four hours of sex on the table with a nymphomaniac model heiress who owns her own brewery." - jch24
Sappelt honestly doesn't have much cause to complain if he starts the year in Louisville
Sucks for Frazier and to some degree Janish, but that’s just how it breaks for them right now, unfortunately.
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
I don't think they'll be unhappy
They probably see the handwriting on the wall. Janish should be happy he’s getting a big league contract instead of being nontendered. Frazier and Sappelt have gotten only cups of coffee, and probably aren’t expecting to stick on the big league roster, at least not yet.
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
Frazier has reached the point where he can start to be upset
the clock is ticking big time on his MLB career prospects.
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
agreed
he has done nothing to be second fiddle behind END.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
Plus the two-year deal to Cairo
plus he could probably play SS about as well as Ed-Rent did (not saying much). Or hit as well as Gomes did while fielding much better.
Frazier getting screwed man!
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
he doesn't seem the type to be upset
And he hasn’t really done anything to force the Reds’ hand. Valaika was called up instead of him because he was hitting better at the time (boy, did that change). He was okay when he was called up later in the year, but not better than END.
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
he also didn't get any sort of extended oppurtunity
for some reason the Reds were fucking around with Cairo until END returned.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
he got his first multi year deal about a year ago.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
by Yossarian22 on Dec 18, 2011 12:25 PM EST up reply actions
I think I had blocked that out of my memory.
Still not a candidate.
by Gray on Dec 18, 2011 12:25 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Rec'd because you should have
"Wait, you think I'm being mean to the pretend orangutan?" -- battlekow
Why would a team carry 7 infielders?
Doesn’t that seem like a lot?
"Good luck, National League managers – I have no idea how you’re supposed to get this guy out." - Dave Cameron on Joey Votto
by Grahamophone on Dec 18, 2011 12:30 PM EST up reply actions
There are still a lot more crappy former Cardinal infielders and middle relievers out there Graham
you can never have too many.
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
maybe
Basically, Rolen and Cairo being old farts is really a pain in the roster. Rolen can’t play everyday, which means they need a “real” third baseman. A few years ago, Cairo could have been the veteran backup SS. Now, he’s considered too old. And END is out of options, meaning he has to be on the roster (unlike last year).
All this is stranglehold on the roster.
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
The roster will probably look something like this on opening day
Rotation:
1. Cueto
2. Latos
3. Leake
4. Arroyo
4. ? (Wood/Bailey)
Bullpen
6. LeCure
7. Arredondo
8. Masset
9. Bray
10. Ondrusek
11. ?
12. ?
(one of those question marks could be filled by the loser of the Wood/Bailey sweepstakes, especially if Bailey is the loser as he is out of options. I also would not be surprised to see the other spot taken by a free agent.)
Catchers:
13. Meso
14. Hannigan
Infield:
15, Votto
16. Phillips
17. Cozart
18. Rolen
19. END
20. Cairo
21. ????
(Based on the roster constraints Fraizer would make the most sense, he can play short, and outfield if need be, so he can back up Cozart and be the 5th outfielder, which really helps.)
Outfield:
22. Bruce
23. Stubbs.
24. Heisey
25. ????
(Seppelt or a free agent we don’t see right now).
If Cairo sucks I wouldn’t be surprised to see him cut. Cairo and END are a problem. Now that I have written this out, I really don’t want to get Theriot. Give Fraizer a chance.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
Louisville, and a dark horse for the 5th spot.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
I think he will be launching from Cincinnati
Anyone that can throw 106 can sell a whole lot of tickets. Walt isn’t going to sleep on a few million in ticket sales to keep him out of the pen. That’s why he went to the pen in the first place.
And they have to use the Chapman radar guns on someone! I just hope Cincinnati Police don’t get a hold of them.
I BLEED RED
I don't think he will be up to sell tickets
winning sells tickets, and Chapman in April may not help the Reds win.
If the Reds were looking to be a 5th place team, I think your argument would have more validity.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
True
nothing worse than looking at the first few months of the season thinking, ’i could have been a contender", But that arm will work just fine in the 7/8th innings.
Bray, Wood and Chapman are the only lefties we got. Bray, Wood and Chapman are breaking with the team.
I BLEED RED
I don't think Bray, Wood, and Chapman will break with the team due to being left handed.
If Wood is in the bullpen, he will most likely be a long man, not a short reliever/left handed specialist.
I think the Reds have committed to Chapman starting, and I think they are willing to let him work on his craft in the minors until he is ready. Also remember that Chapman walked 7 per 9 innings pitched last year. He could probably use some more work just to fix his command a bit, I have a hard time seeing him as a learn term success in the rotation or bullpen until he improves his command.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
It's not like the guy is picking up a baseball for the first time
If you want him to get better, then he’s going to have to be more comfortable with his surroundings. Putting him in AAA is going to hurt him more than help him in the long run for that very reason.
He still has months of off season left and spring training after that. He will pitch somewhere before spring training and If in deed he is going to be a starter this year, He will have PLENTY of time to stretch(he gone) his innings out in the mean time.
I BLEED RED
But Chapman isn't a polished pitching prospect
He hasn’t really spent much time in a 5 day rotation while expected to throw 6-8 innings every time he pitches. Look at his Cuban stats, he struggled to go deep into games down there (like many young power pitchers do). He just needs to be able to start every 5 days to work on his craft. That won’t happen in the Cincinnati bullpen.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
I'll take this bet if you're saying he'll be the 5th starter
"Wait, you think I'm being mean to the pretend orangutan?" -- battlekow
Cmon, I'm high
But not THAT high.
I BLEED RED
by Excalib8 on Dec 18, 2011 5:04 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
i only take bets i am 100% I can win
Chapman could surprise me and mow everyone down in Spring Training and force his way into the rotation.
But I do not think he will get in unless he earns a spot in the rotation.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
I love how Justin's signature has a typo in it.
"Good luck, National League managers – I have no idea how you’re supposed to get this guy out." - Dave Cameron on Joey Votto
by Grahamophone on Dec 18, 2011 4:55 PM EST up reply actions
Even then he left out an apostrophe.
"Good luck, National League managers – I have no idea how you’re supposed to get this guy out." - Dave Cameron on Joey Votto
by Grahamophone on Dec 18, 2011 4:57 PM EST up reply actions
Yes, he did
"Good luck, National League managers – I have no idea how you’re supposed to get this guy out." - Dave Cameron on Joey Votto
by Grahamophone on Dec 18, 2011 5:01 PM EST up reply actions
I'm so confused
"Good luck, National League managers – I have no idea how you’re supposed to get this guy out." - Dave Cameron on Joey Votto
by Grahamophone on Dec 18, 2011 5:05 PM EST up reply actions
He's never thrown 106 and he's never succeeded in America as a starter
"Wait, you think I'm being mean to the pretend orangutan?" -- battlekow
I can throw over half that, does that count?
"Wait, you think I'm being mean to the pretend orangutan?" -- battlekow
hey
get divorced get sober and get a lung condition and you are Johnu1.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
I'm fucking meatloaf
I’ll let you decide whether this is a musical reference or a statement on my current state of life.
"Wait, you think I'm being mean to the pretend orangutan?" -- battlekow
well, you do seem kinda like a bat out of Hell
but I guess 2 out of 3 ain’t bad..
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 18, 2011 8:45 PM EST up reply actions
just cuz you're remarried doesn't mean you're not divorced
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 18, 2011 8:52 PM EST up reply actions
It's not going to be Frazier
It will be Janish before Frazier (and I’m not expecting Janish to make the 25-man).
Walt wants a veteran SS. Someone who he trusts to take over as a starter if Cozart falters. That’s not Frazier. They didn’t give Frazier a single start at SS last year, even when they no longer had anything to play for and were holding tryouts. Even Valaika got a couple of starts, but Frazier didn’t. I think it’s pretty clear that they don’t trust Frazier at SS.
And he’s not a veteran. Even if he were a real SS, Walt is not going to have another unproven player back up the unproven Cozart.
As for Cairo…if he sucks, he might be released, but it won’t be before opening day. He’ll have a suck awhile during the regular season before they cut him.
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
Where does a veteran shortstop fit in?
Votto Phillips, Cozart, Rolen, END and Cairo make it difficult to fit an extra infielder who can’t play any outfield on the roster.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
that's why Walt is interested in Theriot
He thinks Theriot can play OF as well as infield, or so sayeth teh Fay. With the roster constraints this year, the Reds need a Freel-like supersub.
Push comes to shove, they can go with 4 OFers. They started the year last year with only 4 OFers. Cairo and END can play corner OF in an emergency, and they have Sappelt and Phipps in Louisville, with options. They can swap them out with relief pitchers from time to time.
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
Just like the way that Renteria could play third?
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
I think that's why Walt is looking for someone
“more versatile,” as he put it. (Renteria’s agent asked the Reds about his returning, and Walt said no.)
Theriot has actually played in multiple positions. Renteria had never played anything but SS when he signed with the Reds, and there seems to have been some misunderstanding about his ability and willingness to play 3B.
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
Theriot has played 18 innings in the outfield
so yes he “can” play the outfield, but really he should be the 6th outfielder, for long games or injuries.
Can Theriot do anything better than Frazier? And if he can, can he do things so much better than Fraizer he should make a few million to do it?
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
Anything Theriot can do, Frazier does better
Frazier does anything better than you.
"The USA despite its flaws and corruption and overall messiness is still a great and powerful instrument of freedom and hope for the entire world." - Madville
by bbjones on Dec 18, 2011 3:56 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Since when did Frazier turn into Annie Oakley?
Bart: "Dad, what's a Muppet?"
Homer: "Well, it's not quite a mop, not quite a puppet, but man... (laughs, then pauses) So, to answer you question, I don't know."
No he can't!
"The USA despite its flaws and corruption and overall messiness is still a great and powerful instrument of freedom and hope for the entire world." - Madville
It's Possible*!
*pending stellar performance in key RBI opportunities at the bottom of the order and exceptional flexibility on and off the field.
raven riley’d
I BLEED RED
Who's idea was it to sign every player in the majors that looks like a dick
Any word on Brendon Ryan and Ryan Roberts?
I BLEED RED
I'm not thrilled with Theriot
I’d rather stick with Janish.
But I can see how Walt’s thinking. At least Theriot is willing play other positions. Renteria wasn’t.
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
BUT WE HAVE TODD MOTHER FUCKIN FRAZIER!
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
"But it's the only one I've got!"
-Mat
by the finest muffins on Dec 18, 2011 4:21 PM EST up reply actions 7 recs
x
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
by Cy Schourek on Dec 18, 2011 4:27 PM EST up reply actions 5 recs
This is sneaky clever
"Aroldis Chapman is a seven course meal followed by four hours of sex on the table with a nymphomaniac model heiress who owns her own brewery." - jch24
by BK on Dec 18, 2011 4:43 PM EST up reply actions
Also
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s3cbKKf37Mg
"Aroldis Chapman is a seven course meal followed by four hours of sex on the table with a nymphomaniac model heiress who owns her own brewery." - jch24
by BK on Dec 18, 2011 5:04 PM EST up reply actions
I wanted to save this until March
but I couldn’t help myself today.
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
We could trade Cairo to the Yankees...
A hot dog at the ballgame beats roast beef at the Ritz. ~Humphrey Bogart
by PeteyHendrix on Dec 18, 2011 4:10 PM EST up reply actions
he would be their most professional base runner.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
some teams carry 4, some carry 5
The problem is that the Reds have two third basemen. Rolen can’t play every day. That means they have an extra infielder. Makes it tough for them to carry 5 OFers. I think that’s why Walt is interested in Theriot. He can play some OF, and therefore could fill two roles: backup SS and fifth OFer.
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
I'll say it again.
Find me an NL team that carried 4 OFers for any extended period.
It feels so nice to be back to normal
like I said
I think that’s why Walt wants Theriot.
What do you think the Reds are going to do? Assuming the usual 13 position players, the bench is looking pretty obvious to me. Calling Mez and Rolen the starters, the 5-man bench will be:
Hanigan, Cairo, END, Heisey, veteran SS guy.
You may prefer to dump Cairo or END, or let Frazier be the backup SS, but do you seriously think the Reds are going to do that?
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
I seriously don't think they'll go with 4 OF
Apart from that, I have no idea.
And you didn’t answer my question.
It feels so nice to be back to normal
I don't know the answer to your question
It’s not the kind of thing I keep up on, especially for the NL, and I have no clue how to look it up.
But I do think that a contending team has to have depth, in the form of players with options. That’s how you deal with roster constraints. Backup OFers and relief pitchers can be shuttled back and forth from AAA to the big league as needed.
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
Those are 2 different and mostly unrelated issues though
And I’ll help you out. Pretty much zero NL teams go with only 4 OFers for more than a couple weeks at a time.
To attempt to answer your question, I could see them signing Theriot and saying something dumb like he’s the 5th OF.
Or calling Cairo the 5th OF. I dunno, but I’m sure whatever they do I won’t like it!
It feels so nice to be back to normal
I agree
if Theriot gets any time in the OF Walt and/or Dusty are screwing up pretty bad. And it’s practically guaranteed that we won’t be elated by the roster construction thanks to the Rolen/END situation combined with the Cairo/Frazier situation, plus whatever happens with veteran backup SS.
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
Jason Kubel.
Under my tutelage, you will grow from boys to men. From men into gladiators. And from gladiators into Swansons. ~ Ron Swanson
by BigBabyBruce on Dec 17, 2011 6:52 PM EST up reply actions
then jch must love him
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 18, 2011 12:11 PM EST up reply actions
Besides figuring out closer and who else will be playing LF next season
the Reds need to designate a third-string catcher. I guess it’s Corky at this point.
Mgr., Red Reporter
"Bootsy, you're a superstar right?"
"Twinkle, twinkle, babble."
by RijoSaboCaseyWKRP on Dec 17, 2011 5:08 PM EST reply actions
Corky seems like not a terrible option as a third string catcher
Am I wrong?
by Brendanukkah on Dec 17, 2011 5:11 PM EST up reply actions
probably as good as most other teams have
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
yeah.
If Corky gets 500 PAs, it doesn’t matter who the Reds traded for.
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
by Cy Schourek on Dec 17, 2011 10:55 PM EST up reply actions
I think it'd be workable
But in a scenario where Devin is the one who’s out, it wouldn’t be the greatest. Hanigan thrives in that part time role. Then again, the bar has gotten pretty low for catchers.
The Reds no longer have a Spanish-speaking backstop at the major league level (or even close) either. Might not matter at all, but it’s interesting. The nice thing about Hanigan is that he’s the second-longest tenured player on the team. He goes way back with some of these guys and can clearly handle the staff.
Mgr., Red Reporter
"Bootsy, you're a superstar right?"
"Twinkle, twinkle, babble."
by RijoSaboCaseyWKRP on Dec 17, 2011 5:16 PM EST up reply actions
You think Hanny ends up being Cueto's catcher?
It certainly wouldn’t surprise me, but I wouldn’t be shocked if they want to get Mes in on Opening Day, either.
"Aroldis Chapman is a seven course meal followed by four hours of sex on the table with a nymphomaniac model heiress who owns her own brewery." - jch24
by BK on Dec 17, 2011 6:32 PM EST up reply actions
I'm curious if it'll be Cueto or Latos.
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
by Cy Schourek on Dec 18, 2011 11:12 AM EST up reply actions
Nah
It’ll be Cueto. Unless he can’t.
by Charlie Scrabbles on Dec 18, 2011 11:15 AM EST up reply actions
Yep. Cueto/Hanigan I
It feels so nice to be back to normal
by nycredsfan on Dec 18, 2011 12:07 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Yep. Cueto/Hanigan I
It feels so nice to be back to normal
by nycredsfan on Dec 18, 2011 12:07 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
yep
Let a man come in and do the Popcorn.
Crum-Bum Beat
by -ManBearPig on Dec 18, 2011 12:48 PM EST up reply actions
My money is on Cueto.
They’ll go with the guy with more tenure.
I’m hoping so, at least. Since they moved OD from Friday to Thursday, I’ll have to hit game 2 instead.
Oooh, I forgot about that.
It’ll be a whole lot tougher to get tickets to game 2 all of the sudden.
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
by Cy Schourek on Dec 18, 2011 11:20 AM EST up reply actions
I think changing game two to "Opening Night" did wonders last year.
I’m not sure if it was sold out, but if not it was damn close. And it was a great atmosphere. Opening Day-esque, even.
I think Dusty already said Cueto will pitch opening day next year
I doubt that will change.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
by Yossarian22 on Dec 18, 2011 11:54 AM EST up reply actions
Game 2 is an RR outing, by the way
"Aroldis Chapman is a seven course meal followed by four hours of sex on the table with a nymphomaniac model heiress who owns her own brewery." - jch24
Still?
Shouldn’t it be game 3 now, since they do the whole opening night with tuxedo-ed ushers, etc.?
I thought the point was “real fans go to game 2” because the novelty of Opening Day is gone, 18-20,000 show up…
Real fans go to both!
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
by Cy Schourek on Dec 18, 2011 12:08 PM EST up reply actions
We decided to keep it because now most of us don't have to work after Game 2
"Aroldis Chapman is a seven course meal followed by four hours of sex on the table with a nymphomaniac model heiress who owns her own brewery." - jch24
I can't go; I'll be watching UK in the Final Four.
You were just a rich girl only having fun. Your worn out dresses brought stares from everyone. Hey little rich girl, where did you go wrong?
frank caliendo is still the unfunniest man on earth, too
other than jeff dunham. and bill engvall. and carlos mencia.
You were just a rich girl only having fun. Your worn out dresses brought stares from everyone. Hey little rich girl, where did you go wrong?
by boobs on Dec 18, 2011 12:49 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
i always put it on the one with the best game afterward
got GB on fox
You were just a rich girl only having fun. Your worn out dresses brought stares from everyone. Hey little rich girl, where did you go wrong?
Staring intently at a blank screen >>>>>>> cbs or fox pregame
"Aroldis Chapman is a seven course meal followed by four hours of sex on the table with a nymphomaniac model heiress who owns her own brewery." - jch24
by BK on Dec 18, 2011 12:51 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Walt said
Latos would be #2, slotted behind Cueto. Though a lot of people think he’ll be better than Cueto.
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
he was serviceable in the role in 2010.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
I have been thinking of all the reds catchers today.
Who is this good for? Barnheart?
by Eastwindquinn on Dec 17, 2011 5:11 PM EST up reply actions
Yep
It definitely opens the door a bit. even though he’s still blocked by Mes and will be for years to come
"Aroldis Chapman is a seven course meal followed by four hours of sex on the table with a nymphomaniac model heiress who owns her own brewery." - jch24
by BK on Dec 17, 2011 5:24 PM EST up reply actions
Someone will rise up by the time Hanigan goes,
I hope it is Todd.
by Eastwindquinn on Dec 17, 2011 5:44 PM EST up reply actions
Is Skelton still around?
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
by Cy Schourek on Dec 17, 2011 10:56 PM EST up reply actions
Nope.
Barnhart is the best non-Mes catching prospect, and Mark Fleury has been pretty promising since a good college career at UNC. Kevin Coddington had a nice year in Dayton but tailed off a bit last year.
"Aroldis Chapman is a seven course meal followed by four hours of sex on the table with a nymphomaniac model heiress who owns her own brewery." - jch24
Dang.
Came a long way since Dane Sardinha.
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
by Cy Schourek on Dec 17, 2011 11:15 PM EST up reply actions
Don't get too excited.
I think Barnhart is the only one with a chance to be an average starting MLB catcher.
It feels so nice to be back to normal
Unless one of the guys has a breakout year next year, I also believe that
"Aroldis Chapman is a seven course meal followed by four hours of sex on the table with a nymphomaniac model heiress who owns her own brewery." - jch24
by BK on Dec 18, 2011 4:05 AM EST up reply actions
We gave up a lot
but I feel like this has a good chance to be a win-win trade
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
Like the deal
Good controllable arm for several years. Can help us make a push this year. Only 1 player we gave up would have contributed this year. Others… meh not much except for Grandal. Would have liked to see them throw in Blanks tho… Blanks in RF as a damned RH powerbad.
So, I know the thinking was that Latos is an ace...
And he’s almost certainly the best available, but this is a guy with an ERA+ of 108 in the majors so far, right?
Still not a candidate.
Being a baseball noob as I am
What means a ERA+ of 108 in the majors? How good or bad is this?
ERA+ takes parks effects and maybe defense? into account
100 is average, 108 means if you take park effects into account he is 8% above average.
But ERA+ is not a perfect science, it may give too much credit to GABP.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
An ERA+ of 100 is, as you would imagine, exactly average*
So a ERA+ of 108 is about 8% better than league average.
*Well, it is in the AL. In the NL, it’s slightly lower than that due to the pitchers batting
Ooooooooooookay
Knowing what is ERA+, Cueto had a career ERA+ of 109. Slightly better, right? This season, Cueto had an ERA+ of 169, what seems a godawful lot, amirite?
I would say 120 would be were I expect Cueto to sit next year.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
You and I are on the same page about pitching
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
you don't want to be on that same page with him
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 18, 2011 12:13 PM EST up reply actions
besides irrational Maloney love
but I really agree very strongly with almost everything justin says about pitching.
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
me too
he’s like a pitching idiot savant
Let a man come in and do the Popcorn.
Crum-Bum Beat
by -ManBearPig on Dec 18, 2011 12:49 PM EST up reply actions
In justinese, the "savant" is silent
"Aroldis Chapman is a seven course meal followed by four hours of sex on the table with a nymphomaniac model heiress who owns her own brewery." - jch24
by BK on Dec 18, 2011 12:50 PM EST up reply actions 3 recs
our own Rainman
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 18, 2011 1:36 PM EST up reply actions
my love for Maloney really isn't all that strong
i defended him in 2009 and wanted him to get a chance, I think i argued with HLM about him, and the more they argued the more I took a hardline position. Then it just sorta became a schtick.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
by Yossarian22 on Dec 18, 2011 12:55 PM EST up reply actions
It is a shame he is out of options
he isn’t a bad extra starter to keep around.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
so then who should close for us?
this is a test
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 18, 2011 1:35 PM EST up reply actions
who ever the best available pitcher is in the bullpen in the 9th inning
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
Yeah, but Dusty definitely doesn't work that way
this situation is unfathomable to him.
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
The Dusty is all about high leverage situations
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 18, 2011 2:14 PM EST up reply actions
how about on a regular basis?
Mr. I Got Jokes
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 18, 2011 2:13 PM EST up reply actions
Did you see Szymborski's projection?
Here it is:
Latos projects at 15-9, 3.38, ERA+ 119 in Cincy #12ZiPS
I’ll take some of that.
"The USA despite its flaws and corruption and overall messiness is still a great and powerful instrument of freedom and hope for the entire world." - Madville
which is probably good for 3.5-4 wins.
Or 4.5-5 wins more than Volquez last season.
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
Cueto's ERA most likely won't have a 1 or a 2 in front of it next year
which is okay, if he puts up the 3.6 he put in 2010 I will not be disappointed, especially if he does it over 200+ innings.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
Bob Gibson in '68 - ERA+ of 258 (!!!)
Sandy Koufax in ‘66 – ERA+ of 190 (his last year, I’d love to have seen what he could have done)
Greg Maddux in ’94 – ERA+ of 271 (followed up in ’95 with a 262, has there ever been a higher two year ERA+?)
"Wait, you think I'm being mean to the pretend orangutan?" -- battlekow
Greg Maddux, 94-95: 266 ERA+
Pedro, 99-00: 265 ERA+
That’s the first one I thought of, but it’s not quite there. Pedro pitched almost twenty more innings, too. But no, I don’t see any two year stretch that is better.
"Good luck, National League managers – I have no idea how you’re supposed to get this guy out." - Dave Cameron on Joey Votto
by Grahamophone on Dec 18, 2011 5:13 PM EST up reply actions
At the height of the steroid ERA, in the AL, in a hitter's park
"Good luck, National League managers – I have no idea how you’re supposed to get this guy out." - Dave Cameron on Joey Votto
by Grahamophone on Dec 18, 2011 5:17 PM EST up reply actions
*era
"Good luck, National League managers – I have no idea how you’re supposed to get this guy out." - Dave Cameron on Joey Votto
by Grahamophone on Dec 18, 2011 5:17 PM EST up reply actions
...and was traded after winning a Cy Young for Carl Pavano.
can you imagine if that happened in the internet age?
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
The Expos were a joke at that point in time.
They were selling off stars for spare parts. It was stupid.
"Good luck, National League managers – I have no idea how you’re supposed to get this guy out." - Dave Cameron on Joey Votto
by Grahamophone on Dec 18, 2011 5:23 PM EST up reply actions
It was downright corrupt once the league took over
Conflicts of interest become unavoidable.
I’ve lost a lot of faith in David Stern for how he’s handled the Paul trade for similar reasons.
by ken on Dec 19, 2011 4:32 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
Jeff Loria has spent great deals of time screwing two markets over
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
Yeah, career ERA+ is 108
Since he’s only been in the league for slightly over 2 years, his early struggles (not uncommon for a 21-year-old pitcher, of course) are more heavily weighted than a guy who’s been in the league 3, 4 or more years. the last 2 seasons, it’s 113.
Also, worth noting his that his 2011 line was dragged down slightly by the fact that he missed the first month of the season with shoulder inflammation, and was a little rusty when he came back. His first 3 starts were bad as you might expect, 11 ER in 16 IP. After those first 3, though, he had a 3.24ERA the rest of the season, which would have been good for another 12 points on last year’s ERA+, and about 5 points on his career ERA+. That poor performance happened, and should be noted, but there’s an obvious explanation for it, and that 3-start stretch has a pretty enormous impact on his career ERA+.
Take out that 3-start stretch, and you’re looking at a 24-year old pitcher who has posted an ERA+ of around 120 the last 2 seasons, and has peripherals that scream elite pitcher.
"Bitch slap your goldfish folks, we're all screwed."
-KevinMitchellisBatman
yeah, I have full confidence in his abilities
the only wild card is his health
Fuck lion say what! i got a fuck lion now come fuck wit me
/every pitcher ever'd
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
by Cy Schourek on Dec 17, 2011 10:57 PM EST up reply actions
This is an excellent summary why to ignore the 108 ERA+
1, the first part-season weighs him down a lot.
2, he gets crushed for pitching in PETCO, but he has the kind of stuff that will play anywhere.
If he kept last years ERA and puts it into GABP, the ERA+ would be above 120 I’d guess.
It feels so nice to be back to normal
by nycredsfan on Dec 17, 2011 7:14 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Is there anywhere you can find home/away splits for ERA+?
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
Career Splits
I don’t have ERA+ splits, but I do have this:
Career Home ERA: 3.11
Career Road ERA: 3.57
So, obviously PETCO has something to do with his success, right? Actually, no. The home/road difference in his splits is nothing but statistical noise. How do we know this? See below:
Career Home batting line against: .229/.287/.348
Career Road batting line against: .224/.286/.351
The dude is exactly the same pitcher on the road as he is at home, unless you believe that there’s some reason he is able to pitch better from the stretch at home than he is on the road. If the batting lines are the same, the only real explanation for the ERA difference other than dumb luck is strand rate. Some (bad) sabermetricians will tell you that strand rates are as randomly distributed as BABIP, but some pitchers do have trouble with their mechanics from the stretch, and consistently post a lower-than-expected strand rate given their batting line against. I see no possible explanation for why a guy would be able to pitch well from the stretch at home, but not on the road, leaving me to assume that the most likely explanation for the ERA difference is dumb luck.
"Bitch slap your goldfish folks, we're all screwed."
-KevinMitchellisBatman
well he gets a ton of outs via the K, and he is not a ground ball pitcher, but his GB% is over 40, so he isn't a flyball machine.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
Hmm
Seems like somebody forgot to mention Latos!
shitoncredsagainwithlittlereasonwhenheprobablyspentafairamountoftimewritingadecentarticleandlatosreallywasnotonanyonesradarwhenthearticlewaswrittensoreallyiamthedick’d
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
Makes the rest of my predictions look pretty decent though, eh?
It feels so nice to be back to normal
by nycredsfan on Dec 17, 2011 10:08 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
i don't know
it had nothing to do with cookie bras.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
this guy
thinks the Padres made out well in this deal. But he ends with this:
I like this deal for the Padres a great deal, as it sets them up very well for 2012 and beyond. It also helps the Reds this season, as they were desperate for a solid starting pitcher. He is under team control for the next 4 seasons, and becomes arbitration eligible after the 2012 season. This deal probably makes the Reds the favorite to win the NL Central in 2012.
(Emphasis mine.) If he’s right – that this is a deal that helps the Padres long-term and the Reds short-term – I’m fine with that. As long as we’re doing the Votto window thing, might as well go all-in.
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
Walt also said he was pursuing 6 pitchers
and he realizes now Latos, and maybe one other guy he was interested in, were actually seriously available. So if Latos is the only real ace out there to be had, the Reds do have to pay a premium if they want to have an ace for 2012.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
Win now, baby.
Do it before Votto joins your other favorite team as a free agent in 2013.
What, me? Being negative? No. Never.
by Paul Householder on Dec 17, 2011 8:53 PM EST up reply actions
How many of us will purchase
a Joey Votto Tampa Bay Rays jersey?
that reminds me of a nightmare I had last season
and still won’t mention due to superstition about the content, but Votto appeared to be in a Tampa Bay Ray jersey in it
That's funny...
Votto isn’t usually wearing clothes in my dreams.
by KSE on Dec 17, 2011 10:18 PM EST up reply actions 5 recs
I just hope we don't end as the Raiders
in that Carson Palmer trade. Being herschel walker’d and then seeing your guy throw a lot of picks, or in this case, playing like the ’11 Arroyo.
Suppose.
But I don’t think any of the guys traded were going to contribute much anyways in 2012. It’s like trading your orange peel for an orange slice.
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
by Cy Schourek on Dec 17, 2011 10:58 PM EST up reply actions
Palmer lost his fastball.
After that elbow injury in ’08, he was never the same.
Latos’s fastball is fine.
"Bitch slap your goldfish folks, we're all screwed."
-KevinMitchellisBatman
This remains a fairly well-stocked system.
That the Reds have two — three if Coco goes somewhere else — very high picks in the 2012 draft potentially allows for a quick restocking. Many a team would like to be in Cincinnati’s situation.
We Are ... Marshall!
by Thundering Turtle on Dec 17, 2011 6:04 PM EST via mobile reply actions 1 recs
From Walt
"The Padres wouldn’t do the deal without Boxberger and that was a tough decision because he had a very good second half last season and a good Arizona Fall League."
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
Of all we gave up,
Boxberger is the toughest for me to swallow.
If I remember correctly from the farm prediction thread, we all knew and still know he has great potential as an ace closer.
but an ace starter is much more valuable than an ace closer
hell I would rather have Mike Leake than Miriano Riveria.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
by Yossarian22 on Dec 17, 2011 6:15 PM EST up reply actions 3 recs
Miriano Riveria is useless if starting pitchers don't give the manager the position to give Riveria the ball.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
Then you should finish before he does
Or was that cookie bit in the other thread?
by Chester Drawers on Dec 17, 2011 7:00 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
Grandal and Alonso are way tougher
Boxberger could turn into a nice player, he might even be Broxton-esque (besides all the Bs and Rs and Xs and Os in their names). Definitely useful, but has any team ever looked back at a trade and truly regretted losing a relief pitcher?
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
reliever prospects should never hold up a trade like this
Boxberger should have been the easiest guy to send packing, aside from Volquez, of course
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 18, 2011 12:16 PM EST up reply actions
what if JCH ran the Reds
and traded Chapman?
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
by Yossarian22 on Dec 18, 2011 12:26 PM EST up reply actions
Your logic is flawed.
Chapman is not a reliever prospect. He is a starter prospect currently being used in relief. Big difference.
"Bitch slap your goldfish folks, we're all screwed."
-KevinMitchellisBatman
to JCH he is a reliever!
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
by Yossarian22 on Dec 18, 2011 12:38 PM EST up reply actions
and probably the Red, unfortunately
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 18, 2011 1:37 PM EST up reply actions
I'd say he's no longer a prospect
he’s pitched enough for the league to know about him
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 18, 2011 1:37 PM EST up reply actions
it would depend what we got back
just like any trade
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 18, 2011 1:36 PM EST up reply actions
also predictably, Hal feels that Latos took a "big step backwards" last season, I assume because he was a sub .500 pitcher last year...
LATOS, A NO. 11 draft pick by the Padres in 2006, was outstanding in 2010 when he was 14-10 with a 2.92 ERA in 31 starts. The 6-6, 225-pound righthander pitched 184.2 innings, walking 50 and striking out 189.
He took a step backward in 2011, going 9-14 with a 3.74 ERA over 194.1 innings, walking 62 and striking out 185.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
also Hal reversed the 7 and the 4 in Latos's ERA, I don't know if that is a typo or a factual mistake
I can’t look at a starting who goes from 2.92 to 3.47 as taking a “big step back”.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
You've put this in quotes twice, but misquoted it both times.
He said he “took a step backward,” which seems reasonably accurate.
Still not a candidate.
by Gray on Dec 17, 2011 6:14 PM EST up reply actions 4 recs
i don't really think so
when you look at his peripherals he was pretty similar. Plus he threw more innings in 2011.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
Plenty of people would consider those stats a small step backward...
but he definitely didn’t claim that it was a big step backward, which is what you said he wrote.
Still not a candidate.
he did in teh special article he wrote that only i can see!
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
Come back, Gray.
And stay a while.
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
by Cy Schourek on Dec 17, 2011 11:00 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
This is a great deal
for the simple reason that we no longer have Edinson Volquez, who in the last two years practically redefined “shit pitcher” in an entire decade of mostly shit pitching in Cincinnati.
Hmm
Volquez beet Latos, in Latos’s first start of 2011
OH NOES!
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
Also, I'm sure you are at least partly taking the piss here,
but in case you’re not, the stats from these two clearly indicate that much more than the SP contributed to the Reds’ W in that one…
I napped all afternoon because I was got pretty drunk last night.
Thank you Walt… you have fulfilled my Christmas wish.
MATT FUCKING LATOS!!!
Under my tutelage, you will grow from boys to men. From men into gladiators. And from gladiators into Swansons. ~ Ron Swanson
I'll have to get used to spelling it with only one T.
Under my tutelage, you will grow from boys to men. From men into gladiators. And from gladiators into Swansons. ~ Ron Swanson
by BigBabyBruce on Dec 17, 2011 6:22 PM EST up reply actions
I can't think of another way to spell it than with only one T
itt doesn’t make any sense
"Aroldis Chapman is a seven course meal followed by four hours of sex on the table with a nymphomaniac model heiress who owns her own brewery." - jch24
by BK on Dec 17, 2011 7:26 PM EST up reply actions
to be fair, his full name is Mathew.
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
by Cy Schourek on Dec 17, 2011 11:00 PM EST up reply actions
He should go by "Math" instead
Maybe then even Slyde could love him
"Aroldis Chapman is a seven course meal followed by four hours of sex on the table with a nymphomaniac model heiress who owns her own brewery." - jch24
by BK on Dec 17, 2011 11:02 PM EST up reply actions 7 recs
comment from Gaslamp Ball
“Maybe he’ll earn enough in Cinci to buy another T for his name.”
They seem to be a little happier than they were at first. They were really upset at losing Latos, but are coming around now that they’ve found out what they’re getting in return.
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
Of course, it doesn't help that there's some dude over there claiming to be a Reds fan talking shit about how overrated Alonso is
Yet, the dude doesn’t even have a RR account. Bad form.
"Aroldis Chapman is a seven course meal followed by four hours of sex on the table with a nymphomaniac model heiress who owns her own brewery." - jch24
Is it Luke Scott?
What, me? Being negative? No. Never.
by Paul Householder on Dec 17, 2011 11:26 PM EST up reply actions
he's probably been banned
"The USA despite its flaws and corruption and overall messiness is still a great and powerful instrument of freedom and hope for the entire world." - Madville
I have seen a number of arguments recently about how "ridiculously overrated" Alonso is right now
those people haven’t seen much of Alonso, and probably don’t understand why people are excited about his future.
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
Everyone's happy in December.
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
by Cy Schourek on Dec 17, 2011 11:15 PM EST up reply actions
This trade has really allowed Leatherpants to show his bitterness at the Reds.
The cost for Latos ended up being: an AL MVP (Hamilton used to acquire Volquez) and 3 years of first round selections
The most lopsided trade I’ve witnessed in recent memory as the Padres swindle the Reds in the 5-player trade that lands Mat Latos in Cinci
i like the way he makes it seem like Hamilton plus 3 first round picks got Latos
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
I'm sorry, but that's such bullshit
Alonso was blocked at his natural position by a better player.
Grandal is at least another year in the making before he hits the majors, and even then, he would’ve been blocked by another 1st round draft pick. What the fuck is he suggesting here?
To be fair, he should know a thing or two about uneven trades.
He did knowingly trade an injured Gary Majewski to the Reds.
fuck him in the ear
Let a man come in and do the Popcorn.
Crum-Bum Beat
by -ManBearPig on Dec 17, 2011 6:43 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
This is the same guy...
Who wanted to send Alonso and Grandal to Tampa for Wade Davis, right?
by badenjr on Dec 17, 2011 8:50 PM EST via mobile up reply actions 6 recs
I can't rec this enough
"Aroldis Chapman is a seven course meal followed by four hours of sex on the table with a nymphomaniac model heiress who owns her own brewery." - jch24
by BK on Dec 17, 2011 8:51 PM EST up reply actions
YES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
YES
Let a man come in and do the Popcorn.
Crum-Bum Beat
by -ManBearPig on Dec 17, 2011 6:26 PM EST reply actions 6 recs
Seriously guys, this is fucking awesome.
I never thought this would happen, but goddamn I’m happy it did. I take back all the nasty things I said about Walt. I cannot wait until April, this season should be fun!
Let a man come in and do the Popcorn.
Crum-Bum Beat
word
Merry Christmas to us.
I feel like I did when I was 15, and the hot guy all the cool girls were chasing asked quiet, nerdy me out instead of them. Maybe it wouldn’t work out, maybe he’d turn out to be a jerk who only wanted me to do his homework for him, but FTH. Not gonna worry about it now.
Thanks, Walt! You’ve redeemed yourself in my book.
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
by BubbaFan on Dec 17, 2011 6:58 PM EST up reply actions 3 recs
did it work out?
Maybe your 15-year-old experience portends our future ace…
"The USA despite its flaws and corruption and overall messiness is still a great and powerful instrument of freedom and hope for the entire world." - Madville
hah
He was a nice guy, so far as I know. He seemed remarkably mature for a 15-year-old, perhaps because he was Australian. We didn’t date too long, because I ended up moving. (I moved a lot as a kid.) I haven’t thought about him in years. I should see if he’s on Facebook or something.
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
//jch'd
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
by Yossarian22 on Dec 17, 2011 7:06 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
So you came of age in a '90s teen romcom? ; )
by ken on Dec 19, 2011 4:40 AM EST via mobile up reply actions 1 recs
Plus, the dirty talk is even cooler.
Under my tutelage, you will grow from boys to men. From men into gladiators. And from gladiators into Swansons. ~ Ron Swanson
by BigBabyBruce on Dec 17, 2011 9:04 PM EST up reply actions
Woody Allen would have trouble
SLIDE!!! is not gonna cut it.
"The USA despite its flaws and corruption and overall messiness is still a great and powerful instrument of freedom and hope for the entire world." - Madville
did the ending involve a bucket full of pig's blood?
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
by BubbaFan on Dec 18, 2011 5:23 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I know what you mean.
I feel like Latos only came on the radar just a few days ago and it all happened so soon.
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
by Cy Schourek on Dec 17, 2011 11:02 PM EST up reply actions
When I first heard the Latos rumors, I figured they were BS
It didn’t seem to make any sense, given his youth and years of team control. Actually getting him (for around the price rumored for Shields and others) is pretty awesome in my book.
And fentanyl ain't that like super-morphine for elephants and soldiers with their head blown off
by RoastBeefKazenzakis on Dec 17, 2011 11:03 PM EST up reply actions
I agree
Just think if we would have given up Alonso and Grandal and got someone like Gio or Jurrjens back. Only jch would have been happy about that, which helps no one.
"Aroldis Chapman is a seven course meal followed by four hours of sex on the table with a nymphomaniac model heiress who owns her own brewery." - jch24
by BK on Dec 17, 2011 11:06 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Yeah I didn't want Gio or Jurrjens at all
"There's only one god, and his name is Death. And what do we say to Death? Not today!" --- Syrio Forel, Game of Thrones
by cesarhernandez on Dec 17, 2011 11:07 PM EST up reply actions
In fact, I'd argue that a happy jch hurts us all.
It feels so nice to be back to normal
by nycredsfan on Dec 18, 2011 1:18 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
same here
I really didn’t think we had a chance. And we got him without giving up anything we need right now.
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
Exactly my thought
I put up those hypothetical trade proposals and a bunch of people liked them. The only difference between those and this was essentially Boxy instead of Sappelt. And in a way, Volkie instead of Wood is a net win, if for no other reason than Volquez is more expensive.
That’s not that different from what they gave up for Latos. I’m really not sure why people would be upset at all with this trade.
It feels so nice to be back to normal
Also Wood has options
the Reds can stash Wood in Louisville if the need to.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
Not so fast.
Yonder’s sister was also included in the deal.
Sadface. I gotta revise my plan to wife her.
I forgot Kyle Lotzker is only 22 years old
He seems so much older because he has been around for a while and has had injuries.
I don’t know if he can stick around in the rotation, but he could become a useful pitcher sometime soon.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
Holy snotballs! I've been driving all day and wasn't checking twitter
And somehow we landed Mat Latos and got rid of Volquez? Excellent!
I’m sad to see Alonso and Grandal go, but we didn’t have good ways to use them. A great trade.
darthmom: It's like sabremetrics, but for boobs.
Hey did you guys know we got Mat Latos!?!?!?!??!?!?
I’m getting wasted… right now…. for realz.
Under my tutelage, you will grow from boys to men. From men into gladiators. And from gladiators into Swansons. ~ Ron Swanson
by BigBabyBruce on Dec 17, 2011 8:10 PM EST reply actions 5 recs
right there with you
I’m might get Jager drunk tonight. I haven’t touched the stuff in 8 years because it makes me go buck ass wild, but now seems as good a time as ever.
Let a man come in and do the Popcorn.
Crum-Bum Beat
Jager has always scared me
i have never touched it.;
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
I just can't stand the taste of it.
If I want something anise-flavored, I’m just going to go straight for sambuca.
I like to be buzzed and sorta drunk as much as the next guy
but i hate being so drunk I don’t know my name. I hate laying in the bathroom, dizzy and throwing up, and just hoping to pass out or die, whichever comes first.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
Pernod is my preferred anisette.
That may be the gayest sentence I’ve ever typed.
Let a man come in and do the Popcorn.
Crum-Bum Beat
by -ManBearPig on Dec 17, 2011 9:36 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I don't mind Pernod
but I’ve attended many family Italian gatherings where sambuca is the preffered celebratory shot.
A shot of sambuca with three peppercorns. A cigar. A nice fire. Friends. A fantastic evening.
A nice tenor on the iPod. A cannoli. Semiautomatic weapon in lap. Handkerchief in hand to wipe brow.
And Ash doing shots of leftover calamari grease juice and gunk
Buy RED: My Uncensored Life in Rock by Sammy Hagar, today
raki raki raki raki raki raki raki raki raki raki
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
by Cy Schourek on Dec 17, 2011 11:02 PM EST up reply actions
It turns me in to a hell of a good time.
Even more than what I am sober.
Under my tutelage, you will grow from boys to men. From men into gladiators. And from gladiators into Swansons. ~ Ron Swanson
by BigBabyBruce on Dec 17, 2011 8:37 PM EST up reply actions
I'm drinking in house, and by myself last night.
I lost some money gambling last night, and I don’t make money as a sub over Christmas break. It is time to be frugle. But, I think my roommate is coming home…. so maybe I’ll have a drinking partner.
I also have a bottle of Wild Turkey American Honey in my freezer. Let’s see what that will do to me.
Under my tutelage, you will grow from boys to men. From men into gladiators. And from gladiators into Swansons. ~ Ron Swanson
by BigBabyBruce on Dec 17, 2011 8:37 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
American Honey is way too syrupy to drink straight.
You’re going to need something to mix that sucker with.
I liked it.
But, I really need to shy away from these liquors that have extra’s in them. When I dillute the burn/taste of liquor I get myself in trouble.
For example, last Saturday was a Whiskey showdown. I lost… oh around 11pm.
Under my tutelage, you will grow from boys to men. From men into gladiators. And from gladiators into Swansons. ~ Ron Swanson
by BigBabyBruce on Dec 17, 2011 8:58 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Try Jack Daniel's Tennessee Honey
More whiskey, better whiskey, less sugar, tastes better.
#idothisforaliving
@DavefrmLville.....is fun to follow on twiiter!
by Dave from Louisville on Dec 17, 2011 9:09 PM EST up reply actions
I couldn't find it at the liquor store I was at.
Trust me, I tried.
Under my tutelage, you will grow from boys to men. From men into gladiators. And from gladiators into Swansons. ~ Ron Swanson
by BigBabyBruce on Dec 17, 2011 9:12 PM EST up reply actions
Just get whiskey man!
I hate the gimmicky drinks. A bottle of Eagle Rare will do just fine.
by Cuetotally Amazing on Dec 17, 2011 10:12 PM EST up reply actions
You could just drink Jack on the rocks
or Woodford Reserve if bourbon’s your thing.
Best mixed drink in the world: “Jack and Ginger Ale”
Your welcome
@DavefrmLville.....is fun to follow on twiiter!
by Dave from Louisville on Dec 17, 2011 11:51 PM EST up reply actions
Good man
I’d be doing the same if I wasn’t on call tonight for work. Jager is the liquor I learned to drink straight up before I knew how to drink whiskey, but I have the complete opposite reaction to it. Mellow.
"Aroldis Chapman is a seven course meal followed by four hours of sex on the table with a nymphomaniac model heiress who owns her own brewery." - jch24
by BK on Dec 17, 2011 8:39 PM EST up reply actions
Votto Will Leave
Anyone else worried that we just gave up our first baseman of the future? We have votto this season and next, then we can’t pay the guy. He’s so gone. Yonder would have softened the blow a little. Not saying he’s Ryan Howard (definitely not saying that), but the Phillies held Howard back for years until Jim Thome was gone from 1st base. I guess Howard was more of a guaranteed allstar than yonder.
I understand if this was the asking price for a young potential ace like Latos, but man, we gave up a lot, even if we couldn’t use the players we gave up immediately (especially a catcher). Maybe it’s just easier to find a .300, 100 RBI hitting 1st baseman than it is a potential ace. At the end of the day, the division is wide open and it’s clear the reds front office wants to try to win while they still have #19.
I like Soto's power better than Alonso's
@DavefrmLville.....is fun to follow on twiiter!
by Dave from Louisville on Dec 17, 2011 8:49 PM EST up reply actions
I was thinking of Soto too.
This year’s a big one for him.
Wear something sexy to my funeral.
by Pops Daniels on Dec 17, 2011 8:52 PM EST up reply actions
If he can work on his plate discipline that would be awesome.
Under my tutelage, you will grow from boys to men. From men into gladiators. And from gladiators into Swansons. ~ Ron Swanson
by BigBabyBruce on Dec 17, 2011 8:58 PM EST up reply actions
Soto is not about to show Alonso-like plate discipline.
by Eastwindquinn on Dec 17, 2011 9:54 PM EST up reply actions
I know, but a little would be nice.
Under my tutelage, you will grow from boys to men. From men into gladiators. And from gladiators into Swansons. ~ Ron Swanson
by BigBabyBruce on Dec 17, 2011 10:05 PM EST up reply actions
Indeed it is.
But even if he’s a wash, there are ALWAYS band-aid 1B available.
It feels so nice to be back to normal
by nycredsfan on Dec 17, 2011 10:19 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Completely agree
look at how cheap Pena and Lee are going to go for
@DavefrmLville.....is fun to follow on twiiter!
by Dave from Louisville on Dec 17, 2011 11:52 PM EST up reply actions
This is true.
But now with Poo-holes gone and Braun gone, the Reds have a chance to win the Central now. Walt is all-in on the remainder of the Joey Votto era.
What, me? Being negative? No. Never.
by Paul Householder on Dec 17, 2011 8:57 PM EST up reply actions
Don't count your Braun suspension before it hatches
I have a funny feeling he might get out of that one
by ams78 on Dec 17, 2011 9:05 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Still, they also lose...
The first baseman formerly known as Fielder.
What, me? Being negative? No. Never.
by Paul Householder on Dec 17, 2011 9:07 PM EST up reply actions
i doubt it
#noonewinswithherpes
@DavefrmLville.....is fun to follow on twiiter!
by Dave from Louisville on Dec 17, 2011 9:10 PM EST up reply actions
Cross that bridge when we get there...
There are still two more years in the Votto window, and we’re poised to contend in both. We can get good and pay to keep Votto. We can draft an advanced college bat to take over. We can trade Votto if we’re out of contention and get a young stud bat in return. Soto or Vidal or D’Anna could blossom. Loads of possibilities still. Chill. This really is as good as we all want it to be.
by badenjr on Dec 17, 2011 8:59 PM EST via mobile up reply actions 3 recs
+1
What, me? Being negative? No. Never.
by Paul Householder on Dec 17, 2011 9:00 PM EST up reply actions
Keep Donald Lutz in mind too
He’s on the 40-man. He’s a big lumbering German who got a late start in baseball. I saw him play in Dayton this year. He was a very different hitter in the second half, I was impressed with what I saw. He has sick power, too.
Respect my authoritah!
125 K in 123 games.
I’m a fan of this trade, don’t get me wrong. But damn, can the Reds get someone with plate discipline one of these days?
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
by Cy Schourek on Dec 18, 2011 10:30 AM EST up reply actions
"The fuck's that supposed to mean?"
by Charlie Scrabbles on Dec 18, 2011 11:17 AM EST up reply actions 6 recs
The bottom line, in my mind:
This team needed a #1 starter. They’re set from 2-7 (as long as Arroyo decides not to suck next year), but didn’t have the guy up top to match up with the best in the NL. Latos is that guy. None of the other guys mentioned this offseason are. Shields? One season in his career with an ERA better than 3.5. Barely 12 months removed from a season where he put up an ERA North of 5. Jurrjens? The peripherals don’t back up the 2 really good seasons he’s put up. He’s probably not the 4.60ERA guy he was in 2010, but I don’t think you can project him as the sub-3 ERA guy he was last year (and in ’09).
Latos was the only guy out there who had the production, the peripherals to back it up, and the youth to allow you to project that his best years are probably still ahead of him.
Votto’s going to do what Votto’s going to do. The best thing the Reds can do is put a competitive team around him, and keep enough money around to offer him a fair contract. Seems to me that a really good starter with huge upside who’s cost controlled for 2 years after Votto’s contract runs out is a hell of a place to start. We gave up a lot, but we got the single biggest piece we need to make a run in ’12, show Votto that the organization is committed to winning, and allow us to make a fair offer to him once he hits Free Agency.
"Bitch slap your goldfish folks, we're all screwed."
-KevinMitchellisBatman
by BLee2525 on Dec 17, 2011 9:53 PM EST up reply actions 3 recs
I saw Mat Latos in the game the picture is from
I went with a couple of friends and got good and buzzed at Rock Bottom before the game, and was stone cold sober after Harang’s 5 run first inning.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
This is still awesome.
Also, I totally played D&D today… or some kind of variant of it. It was way more fun than I expected.
I use my turn to pity Pierce Hawthorne
I think of this now every time someone mentions that game.
by Chester Drawers on Dec 17, 2011 8:41 PM EST up reply actions
Only the finest show on hiatus right now
Someone in this Community knows it, I’m sure
by Chester Drawers on Dec 17, 2011 8:42 PM EST up reply actions
I'll watch the whole thing when I get the chance.
I’m into HIMYM now and I can only handle one show at a time.
Spolier alert:
Seven seasons in and people that watch the show still know shit about who the mother is.
I know!
It is on Netflix. I always watched the reruns on FX, but now I’m addicted.
Barney is my best friend, which might mean you are my best friend by default.
Under my tutelage, you will grow from boys to men. From men into gladiators. And from gladiators into Swansons. ~ Ron Swanson
by BigBabyBruce on Dec 17, 2011 9:00 PM EST up reply actions
I've pretty much decided
That if that whole finding true love thing doesn’t work out, I’ll just become Barney Stinson.
Suit up!
Seriously, don’t be a Ted. Be a Barney.
Under my tutelage, you will grow from boys to men. From men into gladiators. And from gladiators into Swansons. ~ Ron Swanson
by BigBabyBruce on Dec 17, 2011 9:05 PM EST up reply actions
I went bowling with my friend the other day.
We both wore suits. I’m more of a Ted on the inside, but I can pull off Barney quite well. If I get totally torched by love (again), I know who I’ll be.
i remember reading about that
it seemed awesome
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 18, 2011 12:25 PM EST up reply actions
yeah, Ted sucks
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 18, 2011 12:25 PM EST up reply actions
co-incidence
I’m listening to Dan Harmon’s interview on WTF w/ Marc Maron right now.
by DevilsAdvocate on Dec 17, 2011 8:42 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
rec'd for listening to Marc Maron
I love WTF and Marc Maron is really fucking awesome. I downloaded his albums from ITunes, he is a funny guy.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
I had never heard of Marc Maron until I saw him on Bill Maher's show last summer
I thought he was so funny I immediately subscribed to his podcast. Fuck I would pay for it if it were not free.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
I usually only listen when there are people on I've heard of
That was a great episode though… Donald Glover is the best.
"Aroldis Chapman is a seven course meal followed by four hours of sex on the table with a nymphomaniac model heiress who owns her own brewery." - jch24
by BK on Dec 17, 2011 9:12 PM EST up reply actions
Awesome episode.
Under my tutelage, you will grow from boys to men. From men into gladiators. And from gladiators into Swansons. ~ Ron Swanson
by BigBabyBruce on Dec 17, 2011 8:59 PM EST up reply actions
Is Liriano still available?
If the Twins still are (ever were?) looking to deal him, he could be a nice pick up at the right price. The Reds wouldn’t need him to be an ace, but if he becomes 2/3rds of what he use to be the Reds would be in great shape.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
I think the Reds will make 1 or 2 moves to fill 3 somewhat major holes
I am pretty sure they will bring in a veteran relief pitcher, I don’t know if he will “closer” but I am guessing if they don’t retain Coco they will get somebody to help stabilize the bullpen; Masset, Ondrusek, Arredondo, Bray, and LeCure make up a decent core, but they are losing Chapman and Cordero, one more reliable arm down there would be a good thing.
After that I think they will either get one more starting pitcher to stabilize the staff or a left fielder. Despite what Fay reporter, Walt said the Reds will use the money they saved today towards another pitcher or left fielder. I would use the money to get Beltran, and I would like to see them trade for a Liriano type of guy.
The top three of the rotation is awesome, but after that the Reds need one from the group of Bailey, Wood, Arroyo, or Chapman to step up and throw 180+ innings with an ERA+ over 90. While Liriano may not do that, he could, and he would help hedge the Reds bets.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
I also think the Reds will add a back up middle infielder
but I don’t think Theriot or whomever the Reds get will really be a game changer (despite what others say).
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
Good
trade for y’all.. unfortunately as a Pirates fan. Traded from depth and got a stud for the next several years.
Looks like the Reds will be winning the NL Central this year. As long as it’s not the Brewers.
by McCutchenIsTheTruth on Dec 17, 2011 8:53 PM EST reply actions
You're wrong.
As long as it isn’t the fucking Cardinals.
Under my tutelage, you will grow from boys to men. From men into gladiators. And from gladiators into Swansons. ~ Ron Swanson
by BigBabyBruce on Dec 17, 2011 9:01 PM EST up reply actions 8 recs
Ahh
sorry I hate the Brewers much more than the Cardinals. I’ll take the Reds over the Cards though if that helps.
by McCutchenIsTheTruth on Dec 17, 2011 9:56 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
Really?
Why is that?
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
by Cy Schourek on Dec 17, 2011 11:04 PM EST up reply actions
Uh
I dunno. Pirates fans of late all seem to hate the Brewers. I wasn’t enamored with their beastmode antics, etc. Plus they beat the crap out of this regularly.
by McCutchenIsTheTruth on Dec 18, 2011 12:28 AM EST up reply actions
The main reason I dislike the Brewers
is a former Pirate: Tony Plush. AKA “Beanie Baby.”
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
That's the only reason I dislike the Brewers
After the Reds, I pull for the Brewers in the Central. Cards of course can DIAF.
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
after the Reds
I think I pull for the Pirates in the division.
Personally, one of my best friends is a Bucs fan, and she’s a big reason I’m a baseball fan today. She grew up in Pittsburgh not far from Forbes Field, and used to go over after school when you could get in free after the fifth inning (even the World Series games, which were during the daytime back then). I never understood baseball until she took the time to answer my dumb questions (without laughing too hard).
Plus, Pirates fans are so long-suffering. The Bucs have been so bad, for so long. It was nice to see the stands full when they were contending last year.
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
I've lived in Pittsburgh since 2003
And Pirates fans are not long suffering because they’re also Steelers fans. That’s like being a Yankees fan but worse because of Roethlisberger. Plus when they were in first last summer and playing well, they were more than happy to talk shit.
I feel really bad for Pirates fans
and wish them the best, because the ones they still have deserve it. But as an outsider, there is just nothing to root for with the Pirates. The brewers have had interesting players and somewhat competitive seasons where they were interesting in the division, but they’ve never been a true threat (until the last few years), and they’ve never done anything to rub me the wrong way. Plus i think their fans are smart and very loyal.
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
No, I was being serious, if in a playful way.
Lots of Reds fans are going crazy right now with overanalysis. It is nice to hear someone with a different P.O.V. tell us that this is a good move.
by Cuetotally Amazing on Dec 17, 2011 11:21 PM EST up reply actions
Yep
I think it was a good move on both sides. Reds made a move to compete in the present and they should be a strong favorite for the NL Central crown over the next 2 years.
Long-term longevity depends on Phillips and Votto resigning, but that’s why the move needed to be made; the uncertainty with those two.
by McCutchenIsTheTruth on Dec 18, 2011 12:30 AM EST up reply actions
I like this trade a lot
Walt is proving he’s one of the best GMs in baseball.
@DavefrmLville.....is fun to follow on twiiter!
by Dave from Louisville on Dec 17, 2011 8:54 PM EST reply actions
He spare your boy Hamilton...for now.
It feels so nice to be back to normal
by nycredsfan on Dec 17, 2011 10:11 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
That was my first thought when I saw Alonso + other prospects
@DavefrmLville.....is fun to follow on twiiter!
by Dave from Louisville on Dec 17, 2011 11:53 PM EST up reply actions
No kidding. It's like Christmas, but better.
by crolfer on Dec 17, 2011 9:08 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
You mean Christmat.
What, me? Being negative? No. Never.
by Paul Householder on Dec 17, 2011 9:09 PM EST up reply actions 9 recs
If we celebrated Hannukah
We’d be eating Latkos
by DerekH91 on Dec 17, 2011 9:33 PM EST up reply actions 9 recs
Matzo Latkos for everyone!
"Aroldis Chapman is a seven course meal followed by four hours of sex on the table with a nymphomaniac model heiress who owns her own brewery." - jch24
by BK on Dec 17, 2011 9:40 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
ew.
that sounds gross.
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
by Cy Schourek on Dec 17, 2011 11:04 PM EST up reply actions
Ouch.
But rec’d.
What, me? Being negative? No. Never.
by Paul Householder on Dec 17, 2011 11:28 PM EST up reply actions
Agreed.
It was a lot to give up, but that’s what a contending team has to do. It was time to shit or get off the pot, and Walt finally decided to do something- something that not only gets the Reds a borderline ace but gets them a guy who could be an ace for a very long time.
And to think most of us wanted to trade these prospects for Ubaldo Jiminez near the deadline.
It was a steep price.
But the two biggest pieces were blocked prospects. I’m really excited for this year now.
well folks we got Latos
have fun this evening.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
Now, if we could just get rid of Arroyo.....
Wear something sexy to my funeral.
by Pops Daniels on Dec 17, 2011 9:17 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
Flip him and $5 million for nothing at all?
I’d do it.
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
fuck
i’d pay a team $5M to take Arroyo.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
by Yossarian22 on Dec 18, 2011 11:44 AM EST up reply actions
You know
maybe I’m just hysterical after the Latos trade, or maybe Obwok has finally burrowed his way into my medulla oblongata, but I’m pretty well convinced that there is no way Arroyo is bad as he was this past year. I still don’t like that we signed him to an extension, but I think he’s gonna be okay. Okay enough, anyway.
by Charlie Scrabbles on Dec 18, 2011 11:48 AM EST up reply actions
Cueto won't be as good as he was and Arroyo won't be as bad as he was.
So it’s up to Leake, Bailey, Wood, and Latos to make up the rest of it.
That plus improvement from 3b and SS is going to have to be what does it.
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
by Cy Schourek on Dec 18, 2011 11:50 AM EST up reply actions
and a regression to pythagorean wins
which we were several games below until late August, when the team gave up.
Which, by the way, really was Dusty’s fault.
"The USA despite its flaws and corruption and overall messiness is still a great and powerful instrument of freedom and hope for the entire world." - Madville
if they could unload his contract
they could afford to sign Kuroda or Jackson,
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
by Yossarian22 on Dec 18, 2011 11:52 AM EST up reply actions
His contract becomes bigger if they trade him.
Arroyo is not really tradable.
A hot dog at the ballgame beats roast beef at the Ritz. ~Humphrey Bogart
by PeteyHendrix on Dec 18, 2011 5:15 PM EST up reply actions
Yes. Correct.
I’ll remain bitter about the decision to offer him this contract with and before an option year. It was just stupid.
Wear something sexy to my funeral.
by Pops Daniels on Dec 18, 2011 5:17 PM EST up reply actions
So many people on here called it at the time, too.
Walt must have phoned in sick that day or something.
"Good luck, National League managers – I have no idea how you’re supposed to get this guy out." - Dave Cameron on Joey Votto
by Grahamophone on Dec 18, 2011 5:18 PM EST up reply actions
I wouldn't be surprised to see him bounce back a bit
I could see 180 innings with an era between 4.8 and 5.
Assuming Latos, Cueto, and Leake do their job, if Arroyo can do that the Reds will be fine.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
by Yossarian22 on Dec 18, 2011 11:51 AM EST up reply actions
I could see 170 innings around 4.7 ERA
He’s gonna miss some starts this year, mark it down. I could also see 150 innings of 5.10 ERA, which would still be better than last year because he’d be pitching fewer innings.
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
And if Wood or Bailey can give a full solid season
Arroyo really only needs to be a place holding 5th starter.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
by Yossarian22 on Dec 18, 2011 12:28 PM EST up reply actions
The only reason Arroyo has a rotation spot right now is because of his contract
we don’t NEED him to do anything, because we have fully viable replacements already. However, the Reds aren’t likely to handle this situation optimally so we should hope for Arroyo to be a respectable 5th starter.
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
But we don't really know if Wood or Bailey can pitch signicantly better than Arroyo
we really just need of the three to put up 200ish innings with an ERA+ over 90.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
by Yossarian22 on Dec 18, 2011 12:41 PM EST up reply actions
Bailey can if he stays healthy
Or we just need all three to combine for something like that.
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
I don't think he'll be as bad as he was last year
But I don’t think he’ll be better than any of Cueto, Latos, Bailey, Leake, or Chapman next year, which is where this is for me.
"Aroldis Chapman is a seven course meal followed by four hours of sex on the table with a nymphomaniac model heiress who owns her own brewery." - jch24
He probably won't be any better than them
but it’s not like they can get rid of him. We are stuck with him, and while that’s kind of a drag, I don’t think it’s gonna be crippling. Like it was this year.
by Charlie Scrabbles on Dec 18, 2011 12:07 PM EST up reply actions
I guess we'll have to assume that he's on a shorter leash than he was last year, too
If he’s the poop in our ice cream, he can be replaced by someone like Chapman or Wood. No more running soft-tossing yoga-obsessed lefties out there for us!
"Aroldis Chapman is a seven course meal followed by four hours of sex on the table with a nymphomaniac model heiress who owns her own brewery." - jch24
I think he will still have a long leash
He is under contract for 2013, so I am guessing the Reds will give him every opportunity to not suck, because if they give up on him next year, they will either have to release him or realize they are stuck with a very expensive long reliever.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
by Yossarian22 on Dec 18, 2011 12:29 PM EST up reply actions
Volquez can't hurt our roster anymore
now we just need to do the same with Arroyo
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 18, 2011 1:02 PM EST up reply actions
Fahq
Wear something sexy to my funeral.
by Pops Daniels on Dec 18, 2011 9:44 AM EST up reply actions
And Jim Day!
Buy RED: My Uncensored Life in Rock by Sammy Hagar, today
by obc2 on Dec 17, 2011 9:29 PM EST up reply actions 7 recs
I almost went with The Cowboy
He’s much worse IMHO
Turrrrrible
Buy RED: My Uncensored Life in Rock by Sammy Hagar, today
If I had to choose, I would go Cowboy
only because you have to hear him for entire games.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
i actually enjoyed listening to JD to the FSN call
Individuality: Always remember that you are unique. Just like everybody else.
me too.
I’m really, really, done with the Brennamen though.
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
by Cy Schourek on Dec 18, 2011 10:31 AM EST up reply actions
sadly...hell, yes
A hot dog at the ballgame beats roast beef at the Ritz. ~Humphrey Bogart
by PeteyHendrix on Dec 18, 2011 5:17 PM EST up reply actions
No bullshit ahora.
Wear something sexy to my funeral.
by Pops Daniels on Dec 18, 2011 5:25 PM EST up reply actions
What would votto bring in trade?
If Latos brings three top five prospects from a loaded organization…would Joey net the top five?
Buy RED: My Uncensored Life in Rock by Sammy Hagar, today
Nah, I don't think so.
As much as Votto is an elite hitter, there’s more of a demand for pitching than hitting.
I wouldn't be so sure about that.
There’s more of a premium on pitching, but hitters are much safer bets- that’s the reason an elite hitting prospect will often be drafted before an elite pitching prospect. A pitcher is one throw away from TJ and all that.
The thing is, Lato is covered for 4 years for a price that is probably less than Joey will get over the next two years
Latos is a more valuable commodity than Joey, as great as Joey is.
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
I dunno about that
Joey is, like totally fer serious, one of the very best players in the game. Even at nearly $30 mil over the next two years, he’s worth more than all but five players or so. Latos is awesome and I’m happy to have him, but he’s not as valuable as Votto.
by Charlie Scrabbles on Dec 18, 2011 11:40 AM EST up reply actions
Chuckie...
I will agree with you that Joey is a top-10 player in all MLB and leave it at that. I don’t like disagreeing with you!
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
We should trade him to SD for one of their 1B prospects
"Aroldis Chapman is a seven course meal followed by four hours of sex on the table with a nymphomaniac model heiress who owns her own brewery." - jch24
by BK on Dec 17, 2011 9:40 PM EST up reply actions
I'd take Yonder over the guy they got from Boston.
I think the latter kid’s confidence was shot after this season.
Trade him to Tampa bay for upton and price
Buy RED: My Uncensored Life in Rock by Sammy Hagar, today
oh to dream..
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 18, 2011 1:03 PM EST up reply actions
Man, I was going to preempt that
cuz I knew it was coming
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
That is BP?
he does not really look like himself.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
Yeah, he looks kinda like Griffey instead...
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
plus, then there would be a "sleeping in the clubhouse" joke.
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
Which added to my thinking at first that it was indeed a picture of Griffey
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
Boxy isn't a top-5 prospect, or wasn't.
He was top 10 at best. And some might say either Grandal or Yonder aren’t top 5 either. Both have a lot of value by virtue of being MLB ready (or close) but that virtue is useless to the Reds.
The team kept all of their good young starting prospects, Meso, and Hamilton.
And they have 3 picks in the top 60-70 next draft. The system is going to be fine.
It feels so nice to be back to normal
by nycredsfan on Dec 17, 2011 10:27 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
It's not just "going to be" fine. It is fine.
I’m not sure what the revised top 10 would look like, but here are some of the candidates:
Mesoraco
Hamilton
Cozart
Corcino
Stephenson
Yorman
Duran
Torreyes
Frazier
Sappelt
HRod
DiDi
I’m sure there are more that are worth including too. Really, that’s still a solid list. They gave up some talent, but they’ve still got plenty to work with. In fact, I still feel like Sappelt and Heisey are a little redundant. I’d package one of those two with Wood or Bailey and see if I could get a decent LF platoon partner, then use what money is left on relief pitching.
Really interested to see what happens to Soto
he’s probably the best power hitter in the minors now.
And I keep on forgetting about Bob Steve.
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
by Cy Schourek on Dec 17, 2011 11:06 PM EST up reply actions
Good call on Soto.
Slipped my mind. Several intriguing prospects for corner IF positions a bit farther away too. Vidal, D’Anna, Rosa, Buckley, Lutz. Maybe one of those guys becomes something.
oh yeah, Vidal has potential.
I’m not sold on Lutz myself.
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
by Cy Schourek on Dec 18, 2011 12:55 AM EST up reply actions
I think the organization likes him
And plus, he’s gunning to be the first German player to make the big leagues. I’m rooting for the guy. (thoguh it helps that he hit over .300 last year with 20 dingers)
"Aroldis Chapman is a seven course meal followed by four hours of sex on the table with a nymphomaniac model heiress who owns her own brewery." - jch24
And Torreyes.
This trade skewed the system VERY young in terms of legit prospects, but that’s really fun in a way.
It feels so nice to be back to normal
Could work out nicely if they pan out.
When the guys they traded would be potentially needed, new guys should be ready.
Hard to say
Latos is pre arbitration eligible and under cost control for 4 seasons. Joey Votto is due 26M over the next two years and is a free agent after that.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
I know you guys know this already
But one thing I haven’t seen in the initial reactions I’ve read…
Mat Latos is YOUNGER than the centerpiece prospect they gave up. I know it’s a big haul, but how is this seen as anything but a great deal for Cincy?
Do you think in a world where people collect Beanie Babies,
that there will ever be a market correction on prospects?
by Cuetotally Amazing on Dec 17, 2011 10:19 PM EST up reply actions
/fires up the jch signal
/realizes he just put a (.Y.) on the inky night sky
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
by Cy Schourek on Dec 17, 2011 11:07 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
It's been that way for awhile
@DavefrmLville.....is fun to follow on twiiter!
by Dave from Louisville on Dec 17, 2011 11:56 PM EST up reply actions
That's a great point.
I’ve been talking up Latos’s youth, but hadn’t made that connection. Seriously, I think some people don’t realize just how valuable a player we got in this deal.
"Bitch slap your goldfish folks, we're all screwed."
-KevinMitchellisBatman
Truth.
All I’m seeing is talk about his bad mound presence and ignoring he strikes out a ton and doesn’t walk anyone.
And there is no way in hell Boxy was one of our top 5 prospects.
FWIW, Baseball America had Yonder #3, Grandal 5, and Boxy 9. Still a haul, but very fair.
It feels so nice to be back to normal
by nycredsfan on Dec 17, 2011 10:15 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
I suspect it is harder to have "bad mound presence"
when you’ve got Rolen glaring at you from 3rd and Votto glaring at you from 1st.
by Cuetotally Amazing on Dec 17, 2011 10:20 PM EST up reply actions
"Bad Mound Presence"
He’s demonstrative on the mound. When you’re old, and demonstrative on the mound, you’re “fiery,” “competitive,” and “a gamer.” When you’re young and demonstrative on the mound, you have “Bad Mound Presence.”
Latos at his worst is nothing you don’t see in an average Chris Carpenter start.
"Bitch slap your goldfish folks, we're all screwed."
-KevinMitchellisBatman
I made these exact comments below.
I’m on my phone, sorry if I copied you.
It feels so nice to be back to normal
by nycredsfan on Dec 17, 2011 10:30 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Fuck copying.
You, sir, are a genius. I just wanted you to know that.
"Bitch slap your goldfish folks, we're all screwed."
-KevinMitchellisBatman
I think what the scout meant was
3 of their top 5 trade chips, and Buster just fucked it up
@DavefrmLville.....is fun to follow on twiiter!
by Dave from Louisville on Dec 17, 2011 11:57 PM EST up reply actions
I think people (and me, a little, but not much) are just frustrated that it had to be 3/10.
It’d have been nice to make a trade around Yonder and one around Grandal. But, this is the going rate and people need to live with it.
Easy:
Bowden’s an asshole.
Olney doesn’t think for himself.
“Rival evaluators” are jealous.
And Enquirer comments are bitter.
by Cuetotally Amazing on Dec 17, 2011 10:19 PM EST up reply actions 3 recs
Hooray!
My working Saturday night was just made more awesome!
http://stereogum.com/907151/stream-the-nationals-final-high-violet-show-now/video/
YEAYYYY
Today is fucking awesome. Just….just awesome.
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
by Cy Schourek on Dec 17, 2011 11:09 PM EST up reply actions
people tend to use
#firstworldpains
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
Not mine
Tis just a 42, but I can tweet on it!
Buy RED: My Uncensored Life in Rock by Sammy Hagar, today
Well, the picture is great
But everything else was engineered to be annoying.
There’s a little logo under the screen that is permanently lit up, it takes 15 seconds to turn on, while flashing a giant logo on the screen, it doesn’t have analog audio out ports, the built in speakers are terrible, it takes forever to switch inputs…
Go Colts Dammit!
some of that may be your particular TV.
I don’t have any of those problems (except for the audio out. that does bug me)
"Red Reporter - An elitist clique full of like-minded douchebags." - BK
Good trade for both teams
Reds = the favorite in the Central. Padres get some good young players who didn’t fit on the Reds.
Now....let's keep Yu Darvish out of the NLC
Buy RED: My Uncensored Life in Rock by Sammy Hagar, today
That would make me feel more comfortable re reds pen
Buy RED: My Uncensored Life in Rock by Sammy Hagar, today
Haha
Bowden is… well easy to laugh at.
by McCutchenIsTheTruth on Dec 17, 2011 9:57 PM EST up reply actions
you should hang out here more.
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
by Cy Schourek on Dec 17, 2011 11:09 PM EST up reply actions
I honestly think that he's still bitter about his tenure with the Reds
"Aroldis Chapman is a seven course meal followed by four hours of sex on the table with a nymphomaniac model heiress who owns her own brewery." - jch24
by BK on Dec 17, 2011 9:58 PM EST up reply actions
I agree.
And like I said on twitter, my barometer for whether a move is good is to see what Bowden thinks, then think the opposite.
It feels so nice to be back to normal
by nycredsfan on Dec 17, 2011 10:24 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
but he was such a good judge of pitchers to retred
He got two staff aces off the scrap heap.
Actually trading for a good pitcher or drafting one yourself is cheating, yo!
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
Completely different than Arroyo feaver.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
Young proven talent is always better than highly taughted prospects.
We get rid of the Volquez headache, solve our Alonso problem, and get a young pitcher who is not even in his prime and already has great numbers. PETCO doesn’t help strikeout totals. Only thing that sucks, Volquez has a Haranglike 2010 to make us second guess, and when Votto walks in 2 years, we are trying to find a 1st baseman. Pitching is almost always more important to find than 1sthigh baseman.
by Jack Armstrong started an All Star Game on Dec 17, 2011 10:03 PM EST via mobile reply actions
Glad to hear Reds fans are happy
I live on the West Coast but I grew up a few hours away from Cincinnati, so I always have a soft spot for the Reds. In fact, my nephews are die hard Reds fans. Latos is an awesome addition for the Reds.
By the way, I like your moniker. Jack Armstrong did start an All Star game. It was just part of the magic of that 1990 season that was sandwiched between two losing seasons for the Reds including the year after Pete got banned. Our family had tickets to the NLCS vs. the Pirates. It was a great time.
The blood of "The Five" cries for justice.
by PullManiac on Dec 17, 2011 10:14 PM EST up reply actions 3 recs
that's cool
I really hope this works out for us, I definitely have that nagging feeling of buyer’s remorse but I’m stoked about Latos. You guys will love Alonso he is really warm and outgoing in addition to being a good player. Check him out on twitter!
Can't even begin to describe the excitement
It’s been a long time since we have been competitive in football
The blood of "The Five" cries for justice.
Leach is an evil genius, a la Les Miles
"Wait, you think I'm being mean to the pretend orangutan?" -- battlekow
SERIOUSLY!
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
by Cy Schourek on Dec 17, 2011 11:12 PM EST up reply actions
I want everyone to remember that JA did start an all star game
Because not every ASG starter is a potential Hall of Famer. Or a repeat all star even. Some are just lucky to have a miracle start to the season.
by Jack Armstrong started an All Star Game on Dec 17, 2011 10:29 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
one of my best friends is from Pullman, another went to Wazzu.
I love the Palouse.
What I’m trying to say is…I’m just so happy right now.
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
by Cy Schourek on Dec 17, 2011 11:11 PM EST up reply actions
"Solves our Alonso problem"?
That’s a curious thing to say. Oh, and losing Volquez is the least likely thing to make me second guess this trade.
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
I.E what to do with a hitter with no place to play
Or, keep him as a backup until he’s 28 and Votto’s gone. He won’t be happy as a backup for 2the years.
by Jack Armstrong started an All Star Game on Dec 18, 2011 12:32 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
He was gonna play LF and probably field as well as Gomes did
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
Let's not call ourselves the division champs yet.
I know they lost Pujols, but I have that terrible feeling that the Cardinals are going to be the St. Louis Motherfucking Cardinals and pull a great season out of their asses. And that isn’t even mentioning the Brewers. Our chances look really good now, but that doesn’t mean the division is locked up. Not with the Cardinals and Brewers still existing.
/Red Hot Chili Peppers'd
Let a man come in and do the Popcorn.
Crum-Bum Beat
by -ManBearPig on Dec 17, 2011 11:15 PM EST up reply actions
I kinda like the baseball seams
I’m not really into ink, but the baseball seams are pretty neat.
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
I don't like ink too much myself
most of the time it just looks like accumulated grime and dirt to me
Still better than Yadier's ugly neck tats.
"The USA despite its flaws and corruption and overall messiness is still a great and powerful instrument of freedom and hope for the entire world." - Madville
Huh, I just read up some on Jim Boweden.
I had no idea he was investigated for skimming signing bonuses…
He's the worst.
A real scumbag, and not just because he was a terrible GM.
by Cuetotally Amazing on Dec 17, 2011 10:22 PM EST up reply actions
is the FBI still investigating?
The stuff he was suspected of doing is illegal.
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
not if he never returns to the U.S.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
Yeah, he's got bigger fish to fry right now
Last I heard there’s a warrant out for his arrest.
by ken on Dec 19, 2011 4:46 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
Sorry Jin Az but barely a year's time at the MLB level and you're saying:
Alonso is a low defense, low/moderate power 1B?
This guy is the real deal. He makes contact, gives very ABs and once he’s playing everyday, lookout…this kid will hit 45HRs, 100 RBIs .300 OBP….335 OPS…what a loss for this organization. About the time Yonder’s tearing up Votto and prolly Latos too will be long gone…should have tied up Alonso for a long term contract a la Bruce.
Scott Roland should retire tomorrow.
Sorry Mads, but you are overreacting
Im bummed to lose Alonso too, but he ain’t never hitting 45 HR in any park, ever. And he does suck at defense, even at 1B.
And Latos is probably the best pitcher this org has had since Rijo.
It feels so nice to be back to normal
by nycredsfan on Dec 17, 2011 10:22 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Wrong...this is what we get:
THIS IS WHAT WE GAVE UP:
YONDER MAY NOT HIT 45 NEXT YEAR BECAUSE OF PETBLOW PARK, But I still see him in the 30-35 range easily.
Scott Roland should retire tomorrow.
by Madville on Dec 17, 2011 10:38 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Yonder will be lucky to hit 25 in Petco
Good trade for the Reds…..adding Boxy is the only thing I pause at. And Latos is potentially the best pitcher the Reds have had in a long long time.
"There's only one god, and his name is Death. And what do we say to Death? Not today!" --- Syrio Forel, Game of Thrones
by cesarhernandez on Dec 17, 2011 10:54 PM EST up reply actions
you still have your boy Frazier, Mads.
Let a man come in and do the Popcorn.
Crum-Bum Beat
by -ManBearPig on Dec 17, 2011 11:25 PM EST up reply actions
Really?
I mean, I love Alonso too, and I was excited to see how he would have handled LF this year with the sleeker physique. That said, the odds are still stacked against him ever becoming THAT good. I mean, it could happen. I just think it is much more likely that he’s more Sean Casey/Scott Hatteberg than he is Joey Votto.
I finally came across a photo of Yonder from Redsfest
Wow, he really is skinny now. I didn’t recognize him at first.
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
we got Mat Latos
and a puppy for Christmas—Walt is the best GM in the world!
by Red_Poodle on Dec 17, 2011 11:47 PM EST up reply actions 5 recs
so rec'd
Mat should get along great with Joey and Jay. They both have dogs.
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
That is a cute doggy, though he reminds me a bit of the gigantic pits my neighbors have.
Very cute puppies, and can be very sweet adults. Hopefully Mat(t) is a nice owner.
by Cuetotally Amazing on Dec 17, 2011 11:56 PM EST up reply actions
actually
I don’t think that’s his dog. He is an animal lover, and was volunteering at a pet adoption drive.
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
Well he's an even better guy then!
I think someone did post a picture of him with a dog yesterday, and it may have also been a pit bull terrier, but in any case it was a cute dog. And he sounds like a nice guy.
by Cuetotally Amazing on Dec 18, 2011 12:05 AM EST up reply actions
I think it was the same picture, or at least the same event
It comes up near the top if you GIS “Mat Latos.”
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
that's nice
he can’t have that many personality issues if he is nice to animals! (although I expect a hundred counterexamples to be posted)
how many athletes do you stalk that you know so much about them?
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 18, 2011 1:09 PM EST up reply actions
I doubt Mat will need a dogsitter
His wife fills that void nicely.
Buy RED: My Uncensored Life in Rock by Sammy Hagar, today
she and Joey's and Jay's girlfriends
can take the dogs on play dates!
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
I would like to fill her voids nicely
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 18, 2011 1:09 PM EST up reply actions
she's hot
if I had the opportunity, I would
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 18, 2011 1:40 PM EST up reply actions
I have a feeling Mat won't particularly like Cincinnati
not that I really care about that, unless it spills onto the field somehow.
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
There's about 29 major league cities that are worse places to be 23 than San Diego.
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
by Cy Schourek on Dec 18, 2011 11:49 AM EST up reply actions
Anyone else hate weezy?
I kinda hate weezy.
by Charlie Scrabbles on Dec 18, 2011 11:50 AM EST up reply actions
Mads, I agree with you that Alonso is a big asset to lose
But you’re vastly underestimating what we’re getting. Latos is under our control for 4 years and is likely to be the best pitcher on the staff that whole time. Face it, Mads. One big reason why the team wasn’t able to progress in the playoffs in 2010 and didn’t make the playoffs in 2011 was the lack of an ace starting pitcher, and now that need has been addressed. Nobody likes losing Alonso, but that’s what ace starting pitchers cost.
"Aroldis Chapman is a seven course meal followed by four hours of sex on the table with a nymphomaniac model heiress who owns her own brewery." - jch24
by BK on Dec 17, 2011 10:40 PM EST up reply actions 5 recs
Off topic, but I've decided that the MLB playoffs are stupid.
It seems like it’s almost all about getting lucky and heating up at the right time. If the Reds happened to be clicking on all cylinders offensively, they could have made a run to the WS that year and the lack of an ace wouldn’t have mattered. It’s pretty much all about getting to the playoffs then catching a streak of good luck.
socialism.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
by Yossarian22 on Dec 18, 2011 3:03 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Sigh.
BK as you are my hero and a great punk rock drummer, I’ll refrain from explaining that yes Mat Laktos is a promising pitcher and a good fit for the Reds…….but my problem with this deal is mostly about keeping JOEY VOTTO (who will be gone after 2012, cause Walt will have to trade him to get anything in return) and not keeping Yonder, the guy who (including GAPB) could hit for as much power etc and could have been cxontrolled for a fair amount of time a la Jay Bruce. Nope I’ll just acquiesce and post this final comment;
Scott Roland should retire tomorrow.
I see the Votto argument, but you have to assume they're taking that into account here
The way I see it, if they’re willing to deal Alonso, then they’re more confident than we are that Votto will be here for a long time.
"Aroldis Chapman is a seven course meal followed by four hours of sex on the table with a nymphomaniac model heiress who owns her own brewery." - jch24
by BK on Dec 18, 2011 1:08 AM EST up reply actions
Tell them how you really feel Mads
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
by Yossarian22 on Dec 18, 2011 3:04 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
So, I spend the whole day out of the house, away from the internet
And I come home to discover the Reds acquired Matt. Fucking. Latos.
And Jim Bowden thinks the Reds got fleeced.
What a great way to end the day. I’m going to get a Yuengling.
And fentanyl ain't that like super-morphine for elephants and soldiers with their head blown off
by RoastBeefKazenzakis on Dec 17, 2011 10:20 PM EST reply actions
The Reds did get fleeced...one of the few times I agree leatherballs.
Scott Roland should retire tomorrow.
ah, leather... and his sister Pinky...
Leather wants to review the trade?
Let’s review him:
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/111814-judging-jim-bowden-reviewing-the-reds-biggest-trades-of-bowdens-tenure
... I still say it was a touchdown, got tammit.
I wish my college roommate was the son of an MLB owner.
Instead, my freshman roommate was a cocaine addict. Dang.
Mine would eat way too much White Castle
and then fill up the room with farts. It was so humid.
by Charlie Scrabbles on Dec 18, 2011 11:19 AM EST up reply actions
Luckily my roommate wouldn't do that.
He was a recovering member of Overeaters Anonymous.
Dude was messed up.
I'm gonna assume he didn't graduate
Poor fella.
by Charlie Scrabbles on Dec 18, 2011 11:41 AM EST up reply actions
Nope. Transferred to a school with a theatre program.
And it was a sticking point for him that said school called it a “theatre program” and not a “theater program.”
Heh
My wife was a “theatre” major at Otterbein. But she was a BA instead of a BFA, so she was of an untouchable caste.
Theatre folks be trippin’ shit, yo.
by Charlie Scrabbles on Dec 18, 2011 11:56 AM EST up reply actions
sounds like she wasn't up to their calibre.
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
by Cy Schourek on Dec 18, 2011 11:59 AM EST up reply actions
my memory deceived me
Wells was traded for Goodwin not Owens.
They were all shitty players so they run together.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
by Yossarian22 on Dec 18, 2011 11:34 AM EST up reply actions
I wonder who the other teams were
who were after Latos.
I looked back over the Latos rumors at MLBTR, and there wasn’t much except, “We’re not trading him.”
I am a little concerned about his injury history. Also, someone out there on the left coast is reporting that the Pads had a “ton of concern about his maturity issues.” I’ve heard that about him – that he’s not well-liked by his teammates. But that was the knock on BP, too, and he worked out okay.
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
I honestly think Dusty, Rolen, and Votto can possibly help with the maturity
And I’ve seen tons about his mound presence, but Chris Carpenter consistently acts like a punk-ass bitch on the mound, and yet he’s a"competitor." as long as he’s dominating, it’s cool.
It feels so nice to be back to normal
by nycredsfan on Dec 17, 2011 10:29 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
When I was looking him up earlier, I stumbled across something that a high school coach of his said about him when he was first called up.
That he’s tough to deal with off the field at times, but that on the mound he wants to win more than anyone.
This is true.
I’m a coach, and I recognize competitors when I see them. Latos shouts into his glove a lot, pumps his fists a lot, and is generally very demonstrative on the mound. It’s the same shit that gets some people labeled as “fiery,” and other guys labeled as “showing people up.” Latos has visible tattoos, which means people put him in the latter category.
"Bitch slap your goldfish folks, we're all screwed."
-KevinMitchellisBatman
I just saw that
through a link via Wikipedia.
He was so difficult to handle in high school that he fell to the 11th round of the 2006 draft even though scouts throughout baseball agreed he had first-round talent.
Holy cow, how bad can your personality be, that it means going from the first round to the 11th round?
But the article goes on to say he’s grown up:
Latos’ transformation from an abrasive, immature jerk trying to harness his immense talent to a well-liked, dependable staff ace is a remarkable tale involving a promise to his dying grandfather and a particularly persuasive pitching coach. Another breakthrough came in December when he was home visiting his parents in Virginia. Latos was watching a movie on DVD with his 21-year-old first cousin, Josh Branick. Latos began popping off as usual, and Branick, whom only-child Latos says is as close as a brother, got in his face and asked him if he was ever going to grow up.
"It really sunk in," Latos said. "I remember every detail. We were watching ‘Underworld: Rise of the Lycans.’ The fireplace was going. I had both of my dogs lying at my feet. The Christmas tree was lit up behind us. I have a deep appreciation for what Josh said. He doesn’t know it yet. I haven’t given him credit."
Of course, that article’s from 2010, when things were going well. Still, it sounds like he’s trying to change. Not least because he realizes it may affect the amount of money he makes.
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
what's wrong with the Underworld movies?
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 18, 2011 6:59 PM EST up reply actions
Here's what we should do with our extra money.
Sign Arthur Rhodes.
Seriously.
I don’t care if he pitches. Hire him as a coach, if you want. Put him in the bullpen, sitting next to Latos, telling him how it’s done in the Show.
"The USA despite its flaws and corruption and overall messiness is still a great and powerful instrument of freedom and hope for the entire world." - Madville
Arthur Rhodes: LOOGY and Angry Stare specialist.
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
by Cy Schourek on Dec 18, 2011 3:30 PM EST up reply actions 3 recs
I am sooo glad I am not in the right margin of this screen.
A hot dog at the ballgame beats roast beef at the Ritz. ~Humphrey Bogart
by PeteyHendrix on Dec 18, 2011 5:31 PM EST up reply actions
Very true
He makes crappy gametime decisions, but he’s known as a player’s manager that communicates well with the players. I actually think that should be a big part of an MLB manager, effective communication with the team, not just pushing buttons during the game. Dusty should be a big help if there are any issues.
Respect my authoritah!
I've sometimes wondered
if Dusty was willing to hire a “in-game tactician” to tell him what to do in the game itself, he could be a stellar manager.
"The USA despite its flaws and corruption and overall messiness is still a great and powerful instrument of freedom and hope for the entire world." - Madville
I have wondered for a long time why some team STILL hasn't done this
it makes all the freaking sense in the world
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
because it's tough to respect a coach who's not doing jack shit?
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
by Cy Schourek on Dec 18, 2011 12:00 PM EST up reply actions
that said, CFB programs always have that "Recruiting Coordinator" type of dude.
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
by Cy Schourek on Dec 18, 2011 12:00 PM EST up reply actions
He's still making the calls
he’s just getting input that managers haven’t really been getting before.
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
Don Zimmer did that for Joe Torre
He was officially the bench coach, but he handled the in-game stuff. To the point that Torre sometimes napped on the bench.
I would guess other teams have had similar arrangements. They just don’t publicize them.
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
It's called a bench coach.
Maybe Dusty picks shitty bench coaches or doesn’t heed them.
A hot dog at the ballgame beats roast beef at the Ritz. ~Humphrey Bogart
by PeteyHendrix on Dec 18, 2011 5:32 PM EST up reply actions
doesn't need them?
Um…the guy who let his players bat out of order?
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
"heed"
"Good luck, National League managers – I have no idea how you’re supposed to get this guy out." - Dave Cameron on Joey Votto
by Grahamophone on Dec 18, 2011 5:41 PM EST up reply actions
BubbaFan, seeing n words everywhere.
Still not a candidate.
by Gray on Dec 18, 2011 5:41 PM EST up reply actions 8 recs
nice one
"Good luck, National League managers – I have no idea how you’re supposed to get this guy out." - Dave Cameron on Joey Votto
by Grahamophone on Dec 18, 2011 5:42 PM EST up reply actions
I have absolutely no doubt at all this is true
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
Is it too soon to make a Sandusky joke?
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
by Yossarian22 on Dec 18, 2011 11:53 AM EST up reply actions
Yes, but this is RR
"Good luck, National League managers – I have no idea how you’re supposed to get this guy out." - Dave Cameron on Joey Votto
by Grahamophone on Dec 18, 2011 12:49 PM EST up reply actions 3 recs
RR: Our group showers are pedophile-free!
A hot dog at the ballgame beats roast beef at the Ritz. ~Humphrey Bogart
by PeteyHendrix on Dec 18, 2011 5:33 PM EST up reply actions
Wasnt that also the knock on Volquez?
Hence the demotion to A Ball with Texas?
by Jack Armstrong started an All Star Game on Dec 17, 2011 10:31 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Good Riddance to Voltron.
Scott Roland should retire tomorrow.
by Madville on Dec 17, 2011 10:38 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
and Bailey, and a lot of guys.
Everyone who’s that young and has dominated for their entire life can be kind of a jerk. They can’t all be Jay Bruce.
But I feel with Dusty and Rolen around, it’ll be ok. and Mike and Mat should become roomates and get into hijinx
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
by Cy Schourek on Dec 17, 2011 11:14 PM EST up reply actions
I saw a Reds' flag sponsered by Macy's yesterday.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
I don't think any other team had the AVAILABLE talent to start the conversation
@DavefrmLville.....is fun to follow on twiiter!
by Dave from Louisville on Dec 18, 2011 12:02 AM EST up reply actions
they said
Four teams had offers they were interested in. They winnowed it down to two, and the Reds won. Apparently Boxy was key to the deal.
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
Because they will put Boxy in their bullpen, he will pitch to a 2.20 FIP or something ridiculous as all their relievers do, and they will then flip him for 2 legit position players young and cost-controlled because no one knows how to value relievers.
It’s the Padre way.
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
ha. This is correct.
The Padres traded Mike Adams for essentially two Mike Adamses.
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
by Cy Schourek on Dec 18, 2011 12:02 PM EST up reply actions
The Padres have a time traveler scout
and have secretly smuggled a replicator from the year 2100!
by Charlie Scrabbles on Dec 18, 2011 12:04 PM EST up reply actions
They said the same thing about Hernandez when the Reds traded for him
I take with a grain of salt the maturity issues people bring up. With clubhouse leaders like Cairo, Rolen, and whoever else they sign, it should be okay
Respect my authoritah!
I think maturity issues are overblown in general
dudes 24, I know I was still a dumbass when I was 24. Maybe now that he is on a decent team with some playoff hopes will help (Latos’ good year was when they were competing for the playoffs, maybe there is some correlation there), maybe a change of scenery helps, the clubhouse here is pretty well established which will help deter someone from upsetting that. If the Pads were unhappy with some sort of attitude issues then thats fine that they were willing to part with him, doesn’t mean it will be a problem here, people grow up.
if the padres thought latos had maturity issues
wait til they get a joy of having volquez on staff for a season
by 'tHan on Dec 18, 2011 3:19 PM EST up reply actions 5 recs
MLBTR
has some info.
The team we beat out for Latos was the Blue Jays. No word on what they offered, but they reportedly hung in to the bitter end.
I guess they’ll have to console themselves with Yu Darvish, assuming they beat out the Rangers.
Holy cow, imagine if they got both Darvish and Latos.
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
The Jays have an excellent farm system
A similar offer from their end would have been Travis D’Arnaud, Anthony Gose, Joel Carreno, and Dustin McGowan. I have to believe their final offer was something close to that.
"Bitch slap your goldfish folks, we're all screwed."
-KevinMitchellisBatman
I thought the word on Dustin McGowan is that he might never pitch again
at least, that his career as a starter is almost certainly over, and his MLB career might be as well.
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
Time will tell
Lots of opinions outside Redville believing the trade favored the Padres. I fear Volquez will return to all star caliber.
by RedsManWalking on Dec 17, 2011 10:34 PM EST reply actions
I do
think Volquez is an underrated piece of the trade – I see him being solid in Petco and the Padres swapping him at the deadline – but I think this is a fair trade for both sides. Reds made a big move when they needed to and are now the clear favorite in the NL Central.
by McCutchenIsTheTruth on Dec 17, 2011 10:44 PM EST up reply actions
I don't see Petco improving Volquez much
he doesn’t have a home run problem, he has a control problem, and deeper fences won’t help him throw more strikes.
Volquez is an intriguing pitcher, and I would take a chance on him if I were an MLB GM, but the size of ballpark isn’t the issue, it is command. If he fixes his command he can be great.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
I do think Volquez will have the second-best year of his career if he stays healthy
besides the park itself, the NL West is pretty full of bad or downright terrible offenses (and the other parks are nice and big as well).
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
I still think Volquez will walk the world
and I mistyped a bit, he did have a home run problem last year, but his ground ball rate was 52. I think his home run problem was he would walk the world and then groove a fat pitch down the middle in a desperate attempt to throw a strike. So I still think that may not be improved that much by Petco.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
by Yossarian22 on Dec 18, 2011 11:58 AM EST up reply actions
Without Coco or Volquez,
I kinda feel bad for Cueto, he has nobody to hang out with anymore.
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
by Cy Schourek on Dec 18, 2011 12:03 PM EST up reply actions
CMM is gone as well
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
by Yossarian22 on Dec 18, 2011 12:05 PM EST up reply actions
let's hope Arredondo is a great storyteller.
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
by Cy Schourek on Dec 18, 2011 12:07 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
Jay Bruce - "Hey...Hey Johnny."
“You wanna play catch with me and Drew? His dad got him a new nerf turbo screamer for his birthday.”
Johnny – “¿Qué?”
by Charlie Scrabbles on Dec 18, 2011 12:06 PM EST up reply actions 3 recs
Cueto could probably kill a man with a nerf football.
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
by Cy Schourek on Dec 18, 2011 12:07 PM EST up reply actions
Johnny speaks fairly decent English now...
he’s been in Cincinnati for, what, 3 seasons? He should be fine.
Yeah
Word is that he speaks pretty good English, but he’s not comfortable enough with it for interviews.
by Charlie Scrabbles on Dec 18, 2011 12:11 PM EST up reply actions
I think it's also a defense mechanism
if he’s not the type to like giving interviews, he can just be all “Lo siento, no hablas” instead of having to deal with Hal.
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
by Cy Schourek on Dec 18, 2011 12:12 PM EST up reply actions
Yep.
Put a reporter in front of him, he’s more likely to pull the “no comprende” card. Put a cute 25 year old who speaks English, he’d do just fine.
Tengo su número!
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
by Cy Schourek on Dec 18, 2011 12:24 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
A GIS of Jonny is fun.
His wikipedia page shows how much weight he’s put on. I thought that was Elizardo at first.
And I still think that his follow-through is as badass as Tom Terrific’s. It’s like he’s literally on a different plane than the rest of us.:
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
by Cy Schourek on Dec 18, 2011 12:25 PM EST up reply actions
I don't like his follow through, really
it lends itself to overthrowing, and it would literally be impossible to find a follow through that puts him in a worse fielding position.
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
but it looks badass.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
by Yossarian22 on Dec 18, 2011 12:31 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
Indeed
not to me though. It look unnecessary.
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
It reminds me of Bob Gibson...
…so it’s beyond cool. And not something I would discourage.
A hot dog at the ballgame beats roast beef at the Ritz. ~Humphrey Bogart
by PeteyHendrix on Dec 18, 2011 5:55 PM EST up reply actions
I love watching Johnny pitch
he is animated and fun. He is sorta like a walking cartoon.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
by Yossarian22 on Dec 18, 2011 12:31 PM EST up reply actions
I think Joey did that last season
Lo siento, no hablo ingles. Soy canadiense.
Can’t say I blame him.
"The USA despite its flaws and corruption and overall messiness is still a great and powerful instrument of freedom and hope for the entire world." - Madville
by bbjones on Dec 18, 2011 3:19 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
This is quite common in boxing.
Miguel Cotto made a point to learn English early in his career, but didn’t use it for post-fight interviews for a while. Even when he did, he had some interesting verbal quirks. He always used “pretty” when he meant “very,” leading to some comments that sounded very strange in context until you realized what he was doing. He was talking up his preparation for a fight saying things like “We had a pretty good training camp. I felt pretty confident coming in to the fight.”
"Bitch slap your goldfish folks, we're all screwed."
-KevinMitchellisBatman
that doesn't sound strange to me
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
one night in middle school we played "500" with an nerf screamer.
It was at once terrifying and an incredible amount of fun. You couldn’t see the ball, so you had to hope to catch it with essentially echolocation.
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
by Cy Schourek on Dec 18, 2011 12:08 PM EST up reply actions
is this going to be a new subway commercial?
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
by Yossarian22 on Dec 18, 2011 12:30 PM EST up reply actions
yeah, but he wasn't likely to get many more starts than Wood or Bailey.
Both of which are just as likely to be of all star calibre, I think.
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
by Cy Schourek on Dec 17, 2011 11:14 PM EST up reply actions
Volquez will do better for a while
then bottom out and spend some time in the minors. This isn’t cynicism, but a prediction based on lots of evidence
The wagon wasn't ever returning to all-star caliber with the Reds
Sometimes a situation is stale and needs to be shook up. I wish him all the best, but truly believe any success in SD won’t be indicative of how his hypothetical Reds future would have played out.
We're all mad. I'm mad. You're mad. Otherwise, you wouldn't have come here.
I think this is a more fair assesment than mine
I really don’t think Volquez was going to do anything for us, but that doesn’t mean, necessarily, that he can’t be of some use to the Pads
if you look at the gross gain for each club, yes
The Padres came out ahead.
if you look at the net or delta gain, the Reds came out ahead. They gave up good talent, but it was talent that wasn’t going to play.
The Pads gave up good talent, but they have some nice fitting replacements.
... I still say it was a touchdown, got tammit.
it's like this
the Reds gave up, in terms of hot chicks, an 8, a solid 7, a touchy 7 and a 4 (volquez) in order to pick up an 8.
But, the reds already have a 10, a solid 7, and replaced the 4 with that 8.
/I’ll be in my bunk with the lotion
... I still say it was a touchdown, got tammit.
Latos, the fresh maker
I love this trade. You have to give up a ton to get a young top flight starter under control for 4 years, and the fact that Bowden and Heyman hate it means I like it even more.
Dayman, Fighter of the Nightman, Champion of the Sun
So,,,,
What happens to the rotation when Chapman gets brought up in…. say May?
by RedsManWalking on Dec 17, 2011 10:55 PM EST reply actions
Chapman will not start in Louisville
That’s ridiculous, if he doesn’t make the rotation they put him in the bullpen again.
We can try the starter thing and stretch him out over the winter again next year.
@DavefrmLville.....is fun to follow on twiiter!
by Dave from Louisville on Dec 18, 2011 12:05 AM EST up reply actions
No, THAT'S ridiculous
Either you commit to it for a full year, or you commit to him being a closer.
This back and forth bullshit has to stop. If he’s a closer, so be it. But if you really want to see if he can start, give him more than fucking spring training to prove himself.
It feels so nice to be back to normal
by nycredsfan on Dec 18, 2011 1:27 AM EST up reply actions 2 recs
No one else in the organization is closer material
Buy RED: My Uncensored Life in Rock by Sammy Hagar, today
That's not a big issue to me
we’ve got guys who can do as well as Kevin Gregg, Frank Francisco, Jon Rauch, Matt Capps, FKA Leo Nunez, Chris Perez, Joe Nathan, Brian Fuentes….you get the idea. A bunch of guys who were closers who really weren’t any better than the guys we have in the pen.
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
Not really
it worked out for a lot of great pitchers
@DavefrmLville.....is fun to follow on twiiter!
by Dave from Louisville on Dec 18, 2011 8:50 AM EST up reply actions
it's worked for some
But I don’t think it’s the right way to handle Chapman.
It works if the pitcher is polished and already knows how to be a starting pitcher. It doesn’t work for a pitcher who is still learning that. Chapman is the latter.
And spring training is just not an adequate test. It’s a very small sample size, and a lot of players are just goofing off. Starting pitchers don’t start going the distance until the last week or so. Chapman’s problem is pacing himself, so he won’t get a chance to learn to do that in spring training.
When Chapman started in Louisville, he was great for the first month. When AAA pitchers are only going 4 innings or so. When they started to stretch them out over the next two months, Chapman put up ERAs on the wrong side of 5. Matt Maloney had an ERA of about 3 during that time.
Given that history, I just don’t see Chapman being ready for the show as a starter.
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
Yep, Chapman is really raw
If you take 2 MPH of his fastball, and have it average at 95 I don’t think he is close to big league ready with his command.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
by Yossarian22 on Dec 18, 2011 11:39 AM EST up reply actions
Totally agree
Chapman as a starter, if it’s ever going to work out at all, isn’t going to be satisfactory for at least two years.
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
Which I am okay with
he spends most of this year in AAA, the Reds still control him.
Now if they really need relief help in Late July and August, I would have little issue cutting his development a little short to help out the big league team.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
by Yossarian22 on Dec 18, 2011 12:04 PM EST up reply actions
if Chapman doesn't make a start by the 3rd game of the year
I’m gonna be upset with the Reds
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 18, 2011 1:14 PM EST up reply actions
you have yet to make an argument against leaving him in the oven if he isn't ready to start in Cincinnati.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
x
Under my tutelage, you will grow from boys to men. From men into gladiators. And from gladiators into Swansons. ~ Ron Swanson
by BigBabyBruce on Dec 18, 2011 1:22 PM EST up reply actions
Prepare to be upset one way or another
because if he does start by the 3rd game of the year, I bet he underwhelms with his performance.
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
and anyone who slots him in the rotation over Leake is out of their mind
Cueto, Leake, and Latos all had successful 2011 seasons.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
For me: injury concern >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "maturity issues"
But that’s a concern with almost any pitcher, so it’s one I’m willing to take. In his interview he said the Padres training staff told him that the shoulder issue was a one time freak injury and I’m going to believe that (because it makes me feel better). Regardless I FUCKING LOVE THIS TRADE
Coming out of Coconut Creek HS
Latos was regarded by many scouts as a hothead with electric stuff. He was known for losing his cool if teammates made errors. He pitched a season at Broward JC, where he matured a bit, and signed with the Padres as a draft-and-follow just before the 2007 draft. San Diego gave Latos $1.25 million.
He’s still “spirited,” but vastly improved his breaking pitches and the ability to locate his fastball, clocked as high as 97 mph in junior college.
Latos and Jordan Walden were the prizes of the draft-and-follow class of 2006/2007, with great debate over which would be the better prospect.
We Are ... Marshall!
by Thundering Turtle on Dec 17, 2011 11:33 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Are draft and follows still allowed?
I forgot about Walden. He’s been darned electric out of the pen.
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
by Cy Schourek on Dec 18, 2011 12:57 AM EST up reply actions
Anthony Rizzo
is a suddenly hot property. I guess they figure he’ll be traded with Alonso as the new first baseman.
And jeez, the posting fee for Yu Darvish is more than for Matsuzaka. That’s a lotta dinero.
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
I'd like to think Hi-Z is starting in LF
But if the Reds don’t see him as an everyday player, who can the Reds realistically trade for?
Dayman, Fighter of the Nightman, Champion of the Sun
Quentin?
I don’t know
"Aroldis Chapman is a seven course meal followed by four hours of sex on the table with a nymphomaniac model heiress who owns her own brewery." - jch24
I kind of like the Andruw Jones idea.
Let a man come in and do the Popcorn.
Crum-Bum Beat
by -ManBearPig on Dec 17, 2011 11:46 PM EST up reply actions
Is he really that much of an upgrade over Heisey?
Dayman, Fighter of the Nightman, Champion of the Sun
Heiseys OBP doesn't play in LF
The Reds need less out makers
Buy RED: My Uncensored Life in Rock by Sammy Hagar, today
Yep, he'll be here
Mark it down
@DavefrmLville.....is fun to follow on twiiter!
by Dave from Louisville on Dec 18, 2011 12:07 AM EST up reply actions
He's too left handed
@DavefrmLville.....is fun to follow on twiiter!
by Dave from Louisville on Dec 18, 2011 12:07 AM EST up reply actions
Seth Smith, or they could sign Jason Kubel
Either one would be fine with me.
It feels so nice to be back to normal
From that 2006 draft, the Reds could
have had Latos, Jordan Walden and Tim Lincecum. How would this team have looked the last two years with that trio on the mound?
We Are ... Marshall!
by Thundering Turtle on Dec 18, 2011 12:00 AM EST via mobile reply actions
and they could have had Albert Pujols
and everybody could have had Joey Votto.
You get nowhere playing that game.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
You were just a rich girl only having fun. Your worn out dresses brought stares from everyone. Hey little rich girl, where did you go wrong?
by boobs on Dec 18, 2011 12:03 AM EST reply actions 4 recs
Not bad.
Started out kind of flat, but turned into a very heady post.
We Are ... Marshall!
by Thundering Turtle on Dec 18, 2011 12:10 AM EST via mobile up reply actions 8 recs
even the door matt is spelled correctly
Individuality: Always remember that you are unique. Just like everybody else.
Am I doing this right?
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
by Cy Schourek on Dec 18, 2011 10:37 AM EST up reply actions 4 recs
You were just a rich girl only having fun. Your worn out dresses brought stares from everyone. Hey little rich girl, where did you go wrong?
by boobs on Dec 18, 2011 11:58 AM EST up reply actions 3 recs
I think I prefer Mit Linus!
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
by Yossarian22 on Dec 18, 2011 11:59 AM EST up reply actions
.
(Matte, Late Toes)
A hot dog at the ballgame beats roast beef at the Ritz. ~Humphrey Bogart
by PeteyHendrix on Dec 18, 2011 6:27 PM EST up reply actions 4 recs
I thought it was
Mmm — Lay LA Tos(h)
The Lays and LA seem redundant plus I can’t figure out how the condom fits in.
"Good luck, National League managers – I have no idea how you’re supposed to get this guy out." - Dave Cameron on Joey Votto
by Grahamophone on Dec 18, 2011 6:45 PM EST up reply actions
Walt's list of shit to do since last July's trade deadline
1. Trade for a badass SP
2. Free up salary by trading Volquez
3. Acquire RH #4 hitter for LF
4. Give Ryan Braun herpes
5. Use remaining resources for a closer
6. Placate BP
7. Eliminate duplication of resources on 40 man roster
8. Convince Melvin F-Rod won’t accept arbitration
@DavefrmLville.....is fun to follow on twiiter!
by Dave from Louisville on Dec 18, 2011 12:22 AM EST reply actions 15 recs
good trade
people shouldn’t whine about losing Alonso. Guy was great, but the Reds would be foolish to trade away proven talent like Votto and rely on Alonso instead. Reds have a solid chance to win div not only in 12 but in 13 too. If they win the div back to back (and thus 3/4 last year), might help convince votto to stay.
...which is why we didn't win the division last year
"Aroldis Chapman is a seven course meal followed by four hours of sex on the table with a nymphomaniac model heiress who owns her own brewery." - jch24
by BK on Dec 18, 2011 1:09 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
what if you put him in left field?
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
Then he's average at best, if not slightly below.
"Red Reporter - An elitist clique full of like-minded douchebags." - BK
But it's not like the guys after Latos are four Volquezes right?
"It’s time people started realizing just how good a player Carlos Dunlap already is, and that starts with the Bengals. They gave him a season-high 58 snaps and what was the result? Carnage on the right side of the Seattle line." -Pro Football Focus
x
when everybody is around and we're swinging for long bombs away, how do we come around to know - man, this really is what it's for?
Better, But still the wrong colour
He’s got good teeth. I bet that’s the reason for them throwing in boxy brown.
I BLEED RED
This trade improves the Reds
by around 3 wins in the 2012 season according to my simulator. It plays every game using the real 2012 schedules 5000 times. With Latos added in and Volquez dumped the Reds win an average of three more games.
I don't understand all the backlash to this trade at all.
People want a trade, it happens, and they are pissed. When I first heard this I was ecstatic and thought the rest of the general public would be too. But then the opinions came in and everybody, I mean everybody (except K. Law, K. Rosenthal, and D. Cameron) didn’t really like the reds side of the deal. I mean I know Yonder showed great potential, but we have JOEY FREAKING VOTTO at 1B. Grandal could be a good C, but we have the best C prospect already. Boxy would be solid in the bullpen. Key phrase: in the bullpen. HE’S A RELIEVER. And then there’s Volquez. I had not seen more than one person want him in the rotation in 2012 and yet people think he’ll magically transform into an ace in SD. The only legitimate argument people can have is that once Votto is gone what are left with at 1B. (What about the possibility that Votto is resigned. Yonder is a complete waste then.) Well for one there’s Soto or another prospect who figures something out. Two, anyone we may happen to draft in the next two years who is a fast mover, a la Yonder or Yasmani. Three, END maybe? And if none of those work out, a decent 1B isn’t that hard to find in FA. If none of these options pan out we still have Mat Latos as an ace of our staff. To me that is greater than a solid first baseman and a solid reliever. Tell me this who do you want on your team, a better than average but not elite 1B and an all star reliever or a Cy Young contender? To me, to all those saying this ruins the Reds when Votto leaves, this is the question you have to ask yourself, and for me the answer is the Cy Young contender without question. I mean we traded for a 24 year old starting pitcher who has a career ERA in the lower 3s in 350-400 innings or so. How could you not be excited about that? What the hell is wrong with people? Are prospects really that coveted? You can’t get a star for a bucket of balls, obviously you’re going to have to give up something. I just am astonished by the amount of negative publicity this is receiving for the Reds. I don’t understand it AT ALL.
by vottomatic on Dec 18, 2011 3:31 AM EST reply actions 4 recs
I think Fangraphs got it right
The cost was high – I like all four of the guys they gave up – but the reality was that the Reds had too many players for too few spots. They weren’t going to be able to receive value from both Yonder Alonso and Joey Votto or Devin Mesoraco and Yasmani Grandal, so packaging their excess depth with Volquez and Boxberger to get Latos made sense. If Latos does show that he can be a 220 inning ace going forward, they won’t regret this deal even if the players they shipped to San Diego turn out to be stars. The Reds needed to consolidate talent this winter, and they’ve managed to trade quantity for quality at the position they needed most.
Pitching doesn’t come cheap, but credit the Reds for landing a pitcher good enough to make a real difference. This move isn’t without its risks, but Latos has the upside to be worth betting on.
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
Um Mr. Vottomaric, sir....um
Latos is not the problem…keeping Votto is.
Walt will prolly HAVE to move him after next season…the Reds simply cannot afford Joey Freaking Votto.
Walt could have tied up Yonder Freaking Alonso in the same manner as Jay Bruce is contracted.
Alonso has a tremendous upside and the 2nd best approach to ML at bats on this team (#1 is Votto).
We’ll have all next season though to ascertain on how to evaluate this trade. I sure hope it works out for the Reds.
Scott Roland should retire tomorrow.
Or the Reds hold onto Votto for two years, and get drafts picks and two years of Votto's production
Sometimes it is okay to keep a player until his contract ends, especially when he is surrounded by strong players.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
by Yossarian22 on Dec 18, 2011 11:33 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
yeah
i don’t know how the reds are going to pay 17 million for votto in 2 years.
that eats up the rolen money and then some.
Rest of Off-Season plan
1. Sign Carlos Beltran for LF
2. Trade for Andrew Bailey (Frazier and Heisey//Sappelt)
3. Sign Ryan Theriot or Ronny Cedeno as backup SS
I know we don’t have much money but we would probably be over by at most $5 mil if this happened and Phil needs to suck it up and go for it.
Rotation:
Cueto, Latos, Leake, Chapman, Arroyo
(Homer), (Wood)
Bullpen:
Ondrusek, Bray, Arrendondo, Masset, Lecure, Wood, A. Bailey
(Brackman), (Fisher), (Smith)
Lineup
2B BP
SS Cozart
1B Votto
LF Beltran
RF Bruce
C Meso
3B Rolen
CF Stubbs
Bench
Cairo, END, Theriot/Cedeno, Sappelt/Heisey, Hanigan
(Phipps), (Janish)
If the Reds could afford Beltran, that would be amazing.
That offense would easily be tops in the NL by a lot. I think he’s too expensive and this is a pipe dream, though. Those top 4 in the rotation sure look nice.
I agree with this completely
Trying to pull off "having no money and talking to no one" as well as the Reds have.
I wonder if Walt's getting us anything else for Christmas
Olney says the Reds are still looking for starting pitching, but MLBTR thinks it would be tough to get anything but minor league roster filler after the Latos trade.
The Padres DFA’d catcher Luis Martinez to make room for their Reds haul.
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
yeah
unless a guy like Liriano who may or may not help anyway, can be had for a single second or third tier prospect, the only way the Reds are going to add a pitcher is free agency.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
by Yossarian22 on Dec 18, 2011 11:42 AM EST up reply actions
Or Jair Jurrjens.
A hot dog at the ballgame beats roast beef at the Ritz. ~Humphrey Bogart
by PeteyHendrix on Dec 18, 2011 7:24 PM EST up reply actions
I don't know if we have the pieces to get Jurrjens at this point.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
Net gain
I realize there is some questioning of the Mat Latos acquisition and some people say they expected to see more when they saw his name. Some even ridiculed when they actually saw it spelled out in front of them.
I really think you folks need to step back and take a breather. Look at the names Walt sent: Yasmani Grandal. Brad Boxberger. Edinson Volquez. Yonder Alonso.
Look at the name we acquired: Mat Latos
I realize that, prima facie, there is an apparent shortcoming for the acquisition and, I suppose, it is worth acknowledging… but I’m really not so sure that it is worth some of the pointless jabbing that I have seen upthread. Kind of disappointing. BUT if you look at those who were traded, there exists absolutely nothing in comparison to those that Latos brings. Please, take a little perspective, folks, and treasure that which Walks just brought to the Cincinnati Reds and to the, now, booming felt-letter T industry. We gave up zero and picked up two. I know some expected to see three (or four, I gather), but it is a solid and clear net gain for the local area.
... I still say it was a touchdown, got tammit.
Too soon to judge
Hopefully we will be talking in a couple of years how this put them over the hump like the Lee May for Joe Morgan et al trade did in the 70’s and not about the Frank Robinson for Milt Pappas deal of the 60’s.
I didn’t even hear about this until JD sent me a text wanting to talk about it. The part of the deal that I would have reservations about is Grandal. I’m not sure the Punxsutawney Kid is going to make it. My fear is he will turn out to be Janish behind the plate. I really hope I am wrong.
Does this hand the starting, everyday left fielder job to Heisey and insure Cozart the SS job? Can the Reds win with those two as everyday players? Is there any trade bait left out there if the Reds want to make another deal?
Overall I think I like it. The Reds can always use another good starter. I just hope Uncle Walt can bring all of us Tiny Tims something else for Christmas; a world series!
Go Reds
"Playing baseball for a living is like having a license to steal." - Pete Rose
by Caleb on Dec 18, 2011 9:44 AM EST reply actions 2 recs
I couldn't agree more on your assessment of Grandal & Mesoraco
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 18, 2011 1:20 PM EST up reply actions
The Photoshop elves
must be working overtime.
From Latos’ MLB player page:
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
Alonso was already in a Padres uniform as well
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
Do you know which player's uniform?
Cuz that seems so sexually forward, it cries neediness to me.
Yonder: “Great to be on your team, guys!”
Padre: “We don’t share the same jock strap, dude. Get your hand out of there!”
A hot dog at the ballgame beats roast beef at the Ritz. ~Humphrey Bogart
by PeteyHendrix on Dec 18, 2011 7:41 PM EST up reply actions
Alright, I'll say it.
He looks like a complete prick. Like the neighbor kid that tortures toys in the first Toy Story.
Wear something sexy to my funeral.
by Pops Daniels on Dec 18, 2011 12:12 PM EST up reply actions
Of course I am.
It’s an excellent quality to have. I’m not a Christian.
Wear something sexy to my funeral.
by Pops Daniels on Dec 18, 2011 4:29 PM EST up reply actions
Hey! You're going to hell for saying that.
I don't know why my kids call me that. I think I'm a pretty nice mom.
by darthmom on Dec 18, 2011 4:34 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
Or at least going to be banned from imagination land.
I BLEED RED
by Excalib8 on Dec 18, 2011 4:38 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
I'm only sad that I won't get my own unicorn.
Wear something sexy to my funeral.
by Pops Daniels on Dec 18, 2011 5:06 PM EST up reply actions
I'll just flip Bronson Arroyo upside down.
Wear something sexy to my funeral.
by Pops Daniels on Dec 18, 2011 5:15 PM EST up reply actions
Might as well.
It’ll be the only use he has going forward.
Wear something sexy to my funeral.
by Pops Daniels on Dec 18, 2011 5:19 PM EST up reply actions
Tom Cruise/d
Wear something sexy to my funeral.
by Pops Daniels on Dec 18, 2011 5:23 PM EST up reply actions
Is that Katy Perry on that Unicorn?
Scott Roland should retire tomorrow.
by Madville on Dec 18, 2011 11:34 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
No, worse.
Wear something sexy to my funeral.
by Pops Daniels on Dec 18, 2011 11:47 PM EST up reply actions
Someone who should know better....
But hides behind reformed addiction and lies about motivations.
Wear something sexy to my funeral.
by Pops Daniels on Dec 18, 2011 11:48 PM EST up reply actions
He call's it "Captain Hook"
freak accident on his bike as a kid
"Good luck, National League managers – I have no idea how you’re supposed to get this guy out." - Dave Cameron on Joey Votto
by Grahamophone on Dec 18, 2011 5:20 PM EST up reply actions
*calls
"Good luck, National League managers – I have no idea how you’re supposed to get this guy out." - Dave Cameron on Joey Votto
by Grahamophone on Dec 18, 2011 5:20 PM EST up reply actions
I like the image of a unicorn with
a question mark shaped cock for a horn.
Wear something sexy to my funeral.
by Pops Daniels on Dec 18, 2011 5:21 PM EST up reply actions
In unrelated news
Blonde sea captain in The Keys reports news of a 4th g-spot, on a dolphin.
I BLEED RED
I'm glad someone said that
now it’s out there…which is something
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
I like that in a pitcher.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
by Yossarian22 on Dec 18, 2011 12:32 PM EST up reply actions
I always thought he looked/acted like a dick.
But he’s our dick now!
Let a man come in and do the Popcorn.
Crum-Bum Beat
or giant slong mere pants can't control that will be fucking every other mlb team into obliteration!
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
This is a great city to be a dick in.
I should know. I can’t even make my way to work without running some red lights and flicking someone off. It’s almost as bad as South Milwaukee.
I BLEED RED
If you are doubting what you just said,
I recommend you read the Enquirer article on the financial peril of the Freedom Center and then read the comments. I need some word for the intense but brief feeling of regret I always feel between clicking “View Comments” and the comments showing up on my screen.
by Cuetotally Amazing on Dec 18, 2011 3:41 PM EST up reply actions
The problem is actually not the browser.
It’s my morbid curiosity that forces me to click “View Comments.” Does Chrome have a feature that will protect me from myself?
by Cuetotally Amazing on Dec 18, 2011 3:46 PM EST up reply actions
It does!
Either that or I’ve done a decent job at disabling everything on Facebook that would allow me to view the comments.
Now, is there also a feature that will get rid of stupid people?
So that I not only don’t have to read their comments, but I also don’t have to live in a world that they ruin?
by Cuetotally Amazing on Dec 18, 2011 3:48 PM EST up reply actions
sry bout that.
good news is I have some herb if you want to come over and smoke it with me.
I BLEED RED
If you can't change the world, change yourself.
by Cuetotally Amazing on Dec 18, 2011 3:50 PM EST up reply actions
you need to change the gum in your mouth
because that shit smell is really starting to linger
I BLEED RED
Is it possible to remove the other bookmarks folder from the bookmarks bar yet?
Or are the developers still being fucking annoying?
Go Colts Dammit!
But, welcome to Cincy, ace!
Wear something sexy to my funeral.
by Pops Daniels on Dec 18, 2011 12:16 PM EST up reply actions
idk, I'm still waiting for the Dontrelle press conference
Individuality: Always remember that you are unique. Just like everybody else.
by joshuar9476 on Dec 18, 2011 10:32 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
He's gotta sign with us first
Has anyone heard anything about him lately?
by Charlie Scrabbles on Dec 18, 2011 11:24 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I am not sure
I think the Phillies or Nationals, some NL East team, is close on him.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
by Yossarian22 on Dec 18, 2011 11:43 AM EST up reply actions
He's staying with the Reds, my brother knows his agent's cousin.
by Cuetotally Amazing on Dec 18, 2011 1:04 PM EST via mobile up reply actions 2 recs
who had a drink at Manbearpig's bar
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
I don't usually follow other team's players on twitter ...
… so i must admit i was a bit sad when i unfollowed Yonder yesterday. i wish him the best.
Individuality: Always remember that you are unique. Just like everybody else.
yep.
I hope that all 4 do well and make lots of somebody else’s money.
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
by Cy Schourek on Dec 18, 2011 10:41 AM EST up reply actions
I think that we're so used to Bowden-like trades with a clear winner (not the Reds)
that it’s hard for us to evaluate a trade that’s a win-win. The Reds traded some very good prospects who may very well become stars (but of course probably won’t), some of whom we didn’t have positions for. Oh, and Volquez too. The Padres traded a very good, young starter who fills a definite need for the Reds.
I’m wary of trading lots of players for one player simply because one player is much riskier than four, but I’m willing to get over that since I just don’t see what better return we could have gotten for prospects that we frankly couldn’t use for a while. And other than that…this trade looks like a win for both teams.
Still not a candidate.
by Gray on Dec 18, 2011 12:30 PM EST reply actions 2 recs
Rockies fan here
I understand why you guys made this trade, but I still don’t know why it was for Mat Latos. Attitude problems, health issues, and he’s been extremely inconsistent.
You guys wanted to trade for an ace, but I don’t consider Latos an ace. Decent to fringe #2, maybe.
Also, damn you for giving the Padres such a big haul.
Some days, I feel like I’ve accidentally entered the Church of Tulowitzki on Baseball Easter.
Proud GM of the PRMLB Cincinnati Reds!
SB Nation Denver | On Twitter | Random Music Writings
Why do you think he's not a #2 to fringe ace?
He throws a pretty nasty slider and was really, really good down the stretch last year, including 4 phenomenal starts in 3 of the most homer-happy parks in baseball.
Pure stuff he's a #2
but you’re answering my claim of inconsistency with a 4 start sample size at the end of the year against September callups. Not an accurate sampling of his ability.
(That Rockies lineup had no Tulo, Cargo, and had Jordan Pacheco batting 5th)
Some days, I feel like I’ve accidentally entered the Church of Tulowitzki on Baseball Easter.
Proud GM of the PRMLB Cincinnati Reds!
SB Nation Denver | On Twitter | Random Music Writings
what does it take to be an ace?
to me a guy who throws strikes, and strikes out around a batter per inning has the stuff of an ace.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
by Yossarian22 on Dec 18, 2011 12:51 PM EST up reply actions
“Ace” implies one of the top 15 starting pitchers in the game, a true #1 starter. I don’t think Latos has shown enough consistency to give you 6+ innings every single outing to be considered on that level. He’s your new staff ace, but I still think of him as a league #2.
Some days, I feel like I’ve accidentally entered the Church of Tulowitzki on Baseball Easter.
Proud GM of the PRMLB Cincinnati Reds!
SB Nation Denver | On Twitter | Random Music Writings
He is entering his third season
he had a phenomenal rookie and sophomore season, and it is not that much of a jump for him to become an “ace” based on your definition.
Most pitchers spend their first two seasons getting beat up and bouncing between AAA and the big leagues. There are very few 24 year old starting pitchers who can hold claim to an ERA of 3.37 over 447 big league innings.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
by Yossarian22 on Dec 18, 2011 12:58 PM EST up reply actions
Clayton Kershaw is 3 months older than me.
That means he’s 23. I know he’s one of the “not many”, but I didn’t realize how ridiculous he was. He debuted when he was 19 in 2008.
That's a fair-ish assessment.
He’s by no measure except k/9 a top-15 pitcher right now. He’s close in the NL, though, coming in at 18th. The Reds are trading for a little bit of upside here, but it’s not like Kershaw or Hudson were available. I wouldn’t have minded them going after Garza, but since Latos is younger (24!!!!!!!) and cheaper and controlled for 4 years, this has a chance to pay off nicely, especially if he’s second half Latos and not first half Latos.
Plus, people are assuming the Reds traded 3 sure-thing prospects and a wildcard in Volquez. How often do we see prospects like these fail? Especially at C? People are writing them in as All Star candidates already…
I always liked Alonso, but I never loved him
I think he will be a fine fringe All-Star type for a while, maybe if he spends a lot of years with one team go into their Hall of Fame one day. I don’t see him going Joey Votto though.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
No, he's definitely not going to appraoch Joey Votto's peak abilities
I really do love Alonso though, I think he’s legit and I wish him the best.
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
The Giants, Rockies, and Diamondbacks are three of the more impatient teams in the league, and have above average K rates.
Not saying Latos doesn’t have great stuff — he does — but pitchers that move from the NL West in the last few years have seen a decline in their K rates because of their opposition. (Even Randy Freaking Wolf saw his k-rate jump to over 8K/9 for the years he was with the Dodgers and Padres)
Something to consider when projecting Latos’ value going forward. That K rate looks great now, but it will likely come down next year.
Some days, I feel like I’ve accidentally entered the Church of Tulowitzki on Baseball Easter.
Proud GM of the PRMLB Cincinnati Reds!
SB Nation Denver | On Twitter | Random Music Writings
or he will use that confidence to strike NL Central hitters out
and he is actually good at baseball.
I BLEED RED
Maybe that's got some truth to it, but I wouldn't say he's a #2 by stuff.
His K% suggests that he’s much more than a #2, especially for a 24 year old whose velocity bounced back after he got healthy late last year. In the second half last year, his K/9 went up to nearly 9 from 8.3 and his BB/9 dropped from 3.42 to 2.29. His IP/G went up from 5.88 to 6.71.
That stuff doesn’t look like statistical noise to me – it fits the narrative of “shoulder getting healthier” and “24-year-old-pitcher”.
didn't he also have the record for quality starts in a row?
He may not be consistent, but Verlander and Holliday aren’t on the market.
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
by Cy Schourek on Dec 18, 2011 12:57 PM EST up reply actions
and if they were
we couldn’t afford them. The Latos deal saved us money!
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
Who would you have made a trade for instead, if not Latos?
we’re kind of constricted by who’s available.
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
I really don't know, honestly
I follow your team pretty closely, and I am well aware of your need for a TOR pitcher. You could have probably grabbed someone from the Rays staff for much less. You guys had a great surplus of MLB ready talent that was blocked, and you spent it all on a pretty good (probably not elite) pitcher.
Some days, I feel like I’ve accidentally entered the Church of Tulowitzki on Baseball Easter.
Proud GM of the PRMLB Cincinnati Reds!
SB Nation Denver | On Twitter | Random Music Writings
The only one Walt wanted from the Rays was Shields, who arguably takes the same package if not more.
And is older, not as much team-control.
The Reds gave up a lot. But they gave up a lot of things that they couldn’t have used for some time.
I think this same package gets you Shields, definitely
Some days, I feel like I’ve accidentally entered the Church of Tulowitzki on Baseball Easter.
Proud GM of the PRMLB Cincinnati Reds!
SB Nation Denver | On Twitter | Random Music Writings
Shields has one season in his career as good as Latos's career average
Shields is not better than Latos.
"Bitch slap your goldfish folks, we're all screwed."
-KevinMitchellisBatman
That's not accurate at all.
Latos has a career 106 ERA+
Shields has three seasons at least 10% better.
Some days, I feel like I’ve accidentally entered the Church of Tulowitzki on Baseball Easter.
Proud GM of the PRMLB Cincinnati Reds!
SB Nation Denver | On Twitter | Random Music Writings
I addressed career ERA+ in another post
but it really sells him short. His ‘09 cup of coffee as a 21-year-old and a poor 3-start stretch coming off of an injury this season distort how good of a pitcher he’s really been.
I guess you’d probably consider ‘08 in addition to ’11 as better than Latos’s career average. I’d take a Latos season over any of the other Shields seasons, though.
But, I think it’s exceedingly likely that Shields has already thrown his best season. Latos almost certainly has not. We’re trading for the next 4 years, not the last 4.
"Bitch slap your goldfish folks, we're all screwed."
-KevinMitchellisBatman
I also wonder how much Petco surpresses his ERA+
I mean he is a guy who can strike out a batter per inning, and I am pretty sure he can strike people out in GABP too.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
by Yossarian22 on Dec 18, 2011 12:59 PM EST up reply actions
Career Batting Line against Latos
At Home: .229/.287/.348
on Road: .224/.286/.351
ERA+ is adjusted for Ballpark, but the available data indicates that PETCO doesn’t help Latos as much as its reputation would suggest. Latos is nails everywhere.
"Bitch slap your goldfish folks, we're all screwed."
-KevinMitchellisBatman
does ERA+ take into account how a pitcher gets his outs?
A ground ball or strike out pitcher are not effected by ballparks dimension in the same way a fly ball pitcher is.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
No, it does not.
If you’re looking for that, you’ll need xFIP (essentially, an ERA calculated using a pitchers K-rate, BB-rate, and G/F rate). Latos’s career xFIP is 3.51, and the last 2 years, it’s been 3.38.
"Bitch slap your goldfish folks, we're all screwed."
-KevinMitchellisBatman
SIERA and tERA are the best
Because they take into account batted ball data.
By those metrics he’s a complete stud.
It feels so nice to be back to normal
You think?
I don’t. The Rays drive a hard bargain. I would have liked Shields (and still hope that Walt trades Billy Hamilton + others for him), but they’d be getting him for a much shorter duration, for a lot more money.
From what we've been following, I disagree
Hell, this is the package the A’s wanted for Gio, and he’s not as good as Latos or Shields. I’m not sure the Rays don’t ask for more, given the leverage they have with his contract.
"Aroldis Chapman is a seven course meal followed by four hours of sex on the table with a nymphomaniac model heiress who owns her own brewery." - jch24
They can want whatever they want
what they want and what an agreeable package amount to are two different things.
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
Supposedly, the Rays wanted Mesoraco
instead of Grandal
"There's only one god, and his name is Death. And what do we say to Death? Not today!" --- Syrio Forel, Game of Thrones
by cesarhernandez on Dec 18, 2011 1:01 PM EST up reply actions
The Rays have zero pitchers as good as Latos.
"Bitch slap your goldfish folks, we're all screwed."
-KevinMitchellisBatman
I know you LOVE Latos
but Price is every bit as good, Moore is more valuable, and Shields, while not as good, is not terribly inferior.
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
Price, you can make the argument.
I’ll take the guy 2 years younger with better carer K, BB and HR rates.
Moore has thrown 19 Major League innings. You can say he’s more valuable owing to the contract, but you certainly can’t say he’s better.
Shields is not as good, older, more expensive, and not signed as long. He’s barely 12 months removed from putting up a Bronson-Arroyo-in-2011 season. He is not as good as Latos.
"Bitch slap your goldfish folks, we're all screwed."
-KevinMitchellisBatman
I agree
But there’s no way you can tell me that, after 19 innings, he’s better than Latos.
"Bitch slap your goldfish folks, we're all screwed."
-KevinMitchellisBatman
Okay
he’s not better but he will be better.
by McCutchenIsTheTruth on Dec 18, 2011 3:27 PM EST up reply actions
Okay
Mat Latos will be better than every pitcher in baseball over the next 4 years with the exception of Clayton Kershaw, Justin Verlander, and Felix Hernandez.
"Bitch slap your goldfish folks, we're all screwed."
-KevinMitchellisBatman
we really missed out on that free agent
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
If only he came with 20 feet of outfield in his half innings
that might be a good FA signing
I BLEED RED
The Reds went to the playoffs with Harang
he was the glue that guided those young pitchers!
OBIWOK’D!
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
I like that portmanteau.
It’s even more Star Wars!
by the finest muffins on Dec 18, 2011 4:48 PM EST up reply actions
The Reds went to the playoffs with arroyo
And he was the veteran leader of the pitching staff. Your point?
I BLEED RED
But he's done basically nothing yet at the MLB level
He might be much better than Latos, but you can’t say that for sure yet.
It feels so nice to be back to normal
That contract gives him an excellent chance to meet or exceed Latos' value
but this is kind of elementary for now
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
Irrelevant
There’s no package the Reds could have put up, short of Cueto+Votto+BP, that would have brought back Moore.
"The USA despite its flaws and corruption and overall messiness is still a great and powerful instrument of freedom and hope for the entire world." - Madville
I don't think even that would do it
Too expensive.
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
Really? This is a joke, right?
Rays pitchers face the BoSox, Jays, and Yankees a zillion times a season.
Latos gets to face the Giants.
Some days, I feel like I’ve accidentally entered the Church of Tulowitzki on Baseball Easter.
Proud GM of the PRMLB Cincinnati Reds!
SB Nation Denver | On Twitter | Random Music Writings
Volquez faced the Giants once. He did pretty poorly.
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
by Cy Schourek on Dec 18, 2011 12:58 PM EST up reply actions
...okay?
Some days, I feel like I’ve accidentally entered the Church of Tulowitzki on Baseball Easter.
Proud GM of the PRMLB Cincinnati Reds!
SB Nation Denver | On Twitter | Random Music Writings
sometimes when I try to be funny,
I lose confidence.
In all honesty, I think that the difference between Shields and Latos is pretty small; one may have a better 2012 than the other, but then a worse 2013. So it’s nicer having more years of Latos.
I really have no idea what to make of “maturity issues” of any sort. Latos does have a propensity for the longball, but hey.
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
Do you ever comment on EDSBS?
I never comment on there for that reason.
It’s like trying to play baseball with a team of Joey Vottos
ha.
I’ve hung out there once or twice, but yeah, I’m definitely the ugliest girl at the Playboy Mansion when I do so.
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
They also pitch in just as friendly of a park as Petco
There is zero legitimate argument that Shields is better than Latos
It feels so nice to be back to normal
but against DHs and the AL East
best offensive division in baseball vs. worst.
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
eh, i'm not convinced the padres got that much.
alonso is a very good hitter, but i don’t know that he has a ton of power.
volquez is useless
boxberger may be good, but he’s a reliever prospect. well worth trading for a great starter
grandal may be good, but he’s a young catching prospect. who knows how he’ll actually turn out?
it could be a long time before they get help in this trade…if they ever do.
by 'tHan on Dec 18, 2011 12:43 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Agree
I haven’t read the whole thread, but this trade seriously kicks ass.
by ken on Dec 18, 2011 12:57 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
I'm looking forward to the ridiculous packages given up for Gio and Jurrjens
That will make this trade look even better
It feels so nice to be back to normal
I for some reason re-subscribed to ESPN insider today.
Here are interesting snippets.
While healthy, however, Latos has top-of-the-rotation stuff and has produced results to match; with him at the top, if Aroldis Chapman can be Cincinnati’s fifth starter, the Reds could make Bronson Arroyo a swingman.
If Grandal can remain a catcher, he’s a potential All-Star, even with his platoon-split issues, but his ability to catch big league pitching is a serious question at this point… I can understand the Reds trading him and keeping the superior Devin Mesoraco, who is a better catcher with more raw power and is ready for the big leagues today.
[Alonso’s] .330/.398/.545 (BA/OBP/SLG) line in the majors this past season isn’t indicative of how he’ll perform in the short term, especially since he barely saw any left-handed pitching, but he could end up a .280/.360/.500 guy going forward… Alonso is limited to first base (silly experiments in left field notwithstanding — I’m all for pushing the envelope, but not tilting at windmills)
In sum:
The Reds didn’t give up much they’ll miss in the short term and get four years of a staff ace to pitch in front of a solid rotation that lacked a No. 1 starter.
Fun comment from an unhappy Padres fan:
So instead of the Padres trading for the better catching prospect, they take the second best. Why not trade the second best pitcher on the Padres then?
Solid display of logic there
kudos ignorant Padre fan
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
Heh
their frustration makes some sense but not their logic.
by McCutchenIsTheTruth on Dec 18, 2011 3:24 PM EST up reply actions
"The Reds could make Bronson Arroyo a swingman."
signed, Someone Who Knows Nothing About How the Reds do Business, Nor the Existence of Travis Wood.
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
by Cy Schourek on Dec 18, 2011 12:59 PM EST up reply actions
Travis Wood kinda sucked last year
I have no problem with the Reds giving Bronson Arroyo an opportunity to redeem himself, but if his ERA is over 5.5 in June, I hope they bounce him from the rotation.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
If it's over 5 or if he's got any kind of even nagging injury
or if his HR problems are not subsiding, he should be bounced. basically, if he doesn’t show significant tangible improvement, he should get bounced by June.
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
me. too.
that’s what I said yesterday maybe an hour before we traded Volquez. I got my wish
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 18, 2011 2:09 PM EST up reply actions
I didn't see that whole conversation until well after the trade.
It was pretty funny to read after the fact.
by the finest muffins on Dec 18, 2011 2:19 PM EST up reply actions
i'd like to think that I gave 'tHan what he wanted for his anniversary
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 18, 2011 7:03 PM EST up reply actions
Something tells me Arroyo would have NO PROBLEM swinging.
You were just a rich girl only having fun. Your worn out dresses brought stares from everyone. Hey little rich girl, where did you go wrong?
by boobs on Dec 18, 2011 1:04 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
He looks douchey? Really?
I’ve realized I just can’t properly evaluate Devin Mesoraco’s appearance because he reminds me a lot of my cousin, if my cousin had slightly creepier eyes.
by the finest muffins on Dec 18, 2011 1:39 PM EST up reply actions
What?
I’m saying my cousin’s eyes are less creepy. Did I word that poorly?
by the finest muffins on Dec 18, 2011 1:41 PM EST up reply actions
Oh, I see. That makes much more sense.
I read it as, “he would look like my cousin, except that my cousin has slightly creepier eyes.”
Still not a candidate.
Luckily we landed the biggest tool in that deal
Mgr., Red Reporter
"Bootsy, you're a superstar right?"
"Twinkle, twinkle, babble."
by RijoSaboCaseyWKRP on Dec 18, 2011 2:31 PM EST up reply actions
nah
can’t be
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 18, 2011 2:15 PM EST up reply actions
Jesus, get the Chiefs OFF THE FIELD
You were just a rich girl only having fun. Your worn out dresses brought stares from everyone. Hey little rich girl, where did you go wrong?
Five minutes in and my fantasy QB hasn't thrown a pass!
You were just a rich girl only having fun. Your worn out dresses brought stares from everyone. Hey little rich girl, where did you go wrong?
You know what is kinda cool
Going in to the 2010 and 2012 seasons the Reds arguable have made the most interesting off season moves.
.
#winningtheoffseason
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
I think the Angels may be the ones to argue with that point
But I’m with you, it’s cool
"Aroldis Chapman is a seven course meal followed by four hours of sex on the table with a nymphomaniac model heiress who owns her own brewery." - jch24
by BK on Dec 18, 2011 1:15 PM EST up reply actions
Definitely a good argument
"Aroldis Chapman is a seven course meal followed by four hours of sex on the table with a nymphomaniac model heiress who owns her own brewery." - jch24
by BK on Dec 18, 2011 1:18 PM EST up reply actions
not sure if being sarcastic.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
I wish Chapman had a bit of a temper
imagine the fear hitters would have when facing a guy who struggles with control, throws 105, and has random fits of rage over who ate the last french fry at Johnny Rockets before the game.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
by Yossarian22 on Dec 18, 2011 1:22 PM EST up reply actions 3 recs
Hannigan should have him hit Mr. Red with a pitch once
So he can say “I don’t know where it’s going. I swear to God.”
Make it Gapper, and I'm fully on board.
by the finest muffins on Dec 18, 2011 1:27 PM EST up reply actions 5 recs
Johnny Rockets sucks
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 18, 2011 2:10 PM EST up reply actions
I know, but it is right across the street from GABP
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
/TobyKeith'd
"Aroldis Chapman is a seven course meal followed by four hours of sex on the table with a nymphomaniac model heiress who owns her own brewery." - jch24
by BK on Dec 18, 2011 2:23 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
they really did
It is a shame they can’t get some local flavor in there, like maybe a Gordo’s and other shit like that.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
the Moerlein Lager House will be the biggest attraction down there
it has plenty of “local flavor.”
Let a man come in and do the Popcorn.
Crum-Bum Beat
i'm curious how expensive it will be
holy grail beer is way to expensive. especially when you have to fight the crowd. toby keith’s beer prices will be outrageous & probably will have a crappy selection.
i hope the moerlein house has a good variety & quality beer specials.
otherwise, i’m sticking to brother’s in newport during the season
I'm assuming price-wise it'll be similar to places like Hofbrauhaus and Rock Bottom
Since both of those places brew it on site (as far as I know).
"Aroldis Chapman is a seven course meal followed by four hours of sex on the table with a nymphomaniac model heiress who owns her own brewery." - jch24
by BK on Dec 18, 2011 3:46 PM EST up reply actions
It'll probably also have Little Kings and brew Hudy on-site too.
So there will probably be some inexpensive options.
Price-wise it will not be better than Brothers
Unless they offer generous happy hour deals before games, which I doubt they will
"Aroldis Chapman is a seven course meal followed by four hours of sex on the table with a nymphomaniac model heiress who owns her own brewery." - jch24
by BK on Dec 18, 2011 3:52 PM EST up reply actions
but the location makes up for that
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
I like to eat a LOT when I drink...
But the idea of a cold cut to go for the game is kinda selling me right now.
I BLEED RED
they say the menu will be inspired by
Cincy’s 19th century cuisine. So I imagine blood sausages, head cheese, and stale bread.
Let a man come in and do the Popcorn.
Crum-Bum Beat
Yeah, I work like 200 yards away every day
But never really go out to Newport for drinks.
I BLEED RED
there's a really good bar in town here
that has a dude making sandwiches at the bar. You should go next time you’re in town.
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
Crossing the bridge blows early in the season.
I’ll take the parking garage and a cheap beer in O’Malley’s or the other dives en route.
I tend to prefer Fountain Square
I-75 through downtown gets all sorts of snarled up when driving in for a night game.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
true
i guess a better way to say it, is from where I am coming I will have to drive all the way throw downtown regardless, so I would really rather park in Cincinnati than Northern Kentucky.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
And a beautiful walk with a view of the ballpark
If you are into using your legs for things.
I BLEED RED
Since I don't use this spot anymore...
free parking on weekends, and after 3pm on weekdays in the alley where O’Malley’s is. That was my go to spot for work for 5 years.
Let a man come in and do the Popcorn.
Crum-Bum Beat
but there is a nice stable of parking (all be it expensive) right there
it is perfect for the lazy and handicapped.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
mmmm
and that shit will get you drunk fast
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 18, 2011 7:05 PM EST up reply actions
They won't brew Hudy on site, though it will almost certainly be available.
All the Hudy/Shoenling stuff will still come from PA. From what I understand, they will be brewing special beers that won’t be available anywhere else. In addition to having other commercial beers.
Let a man come in and do the Popcorn.
Crum-Bum Beat
I highly doubt it.
Though, I suppose it’s possible. I haven’t talked to anyone directly involved in a few months. It’d be cool if they did, because it would likely be a lot better.
Let a man come in and do the Popcorn.
Crum-Bum Beat
i find their offerings hit or miss
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 18, 2011 7:04 PM EST up reply actions
Wait, you don't mean "across the river"?
by the finest muffins on Dec 18, 2011 2:25 PM EST up reply actions
so eat some place else?
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 18, 2011 7:04 PM EST up reply actions
Now you've done it
Chapman’s gonna get medieval on you now.
"The USA despite its flaws and corruption and overall messiness is still a great and powerful instrument of freedom and hope for the entire world." - Madville
I love that, 23 hous later, this thread is still hopping
Especially since in Friday there was a Reposter post that had a title lamenting how little there was to talk about
The announcement thread
Was one of the most fun threads I’ve read in the year and a half I’ve been here
you should have been here when we got Chapman.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
why doesn't the search engine go back that far anymore?
i wanted to link Derek to that thread, but the search engine only goes back to spring training of last year now.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
pro tip:
Go to google and put site:redreporter.com before your search term. Works about a billion times better than the one on here
"Aroldis Chapman is a seven course meal followed by four hours of sex on the table with a nymphomaniac model heiress who owns her own brewery." - jch24
by BK on Dec 18, 2011 1:35 PM EST up reply actions
Thanks!
I’m so glad someone finally brought that up.
by the finest muffins on Dec 18, 2011 1:40 PM EST up reply actions
look at you
Mr. Fancy Search Optimizer..
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 18, 2011 2:16 PM EST up reply actions
It is infinitely scary to me that I almost wrote the exact same thing
It feels so nice to be back to normal
by nycredsfan on Dec 18, 2011 3:15 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
it was that Shake Shack I had last week, I swear
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 18, 2011 7:07 PM EST up reply actions
There is a Shake Shack in Fairfield, CT now
I’ve eaten there 3 times in the last month.
It feels so nice to be back to normal
do they serve alcohol?
we’ll get chan & westie to turn it into shake shake shake shack
by 'tHan on Dec 18, 2011 8:48 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
never had what they brew as their own
but I do know they have draught beer, which is always a plus
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 18, 2011 8:54 PM EST up reply actions
Fairfield isn't exactly around the corner from me
the one on Columbus & 77th was on the way back from Philly last week, so we stopped
did. not. suck.
I was so pissed that Corner Bistro is closed on Mondays and I forgot, though
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 18, 2011 8:54 PM EST up reply actions
We swallowed our snark a little
especially with that sarcastic Kanekoa Texeira! thread coming right before the Latos thread. I’m glad to be wrong about the Reds being risk-averse. Walt played this one close-to-the-vest. I was steeling myself of Jurrjens.
Mgr., Red Reporter
"Bootsy, you're a superstar right?"
"Twinkle, twinkle, babble."
by RijoSaboCaseyWKRP on Dec 18, 2011 2:34 PM EST up reply actions
I was ready to hear Jurrjens name too
glad Walt was able to find an actual upgrade to the top of the rotation instead
Yeah
Jurrjens probably would have improved the Reds, but he isn’t the impact player Latos is.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
i dont care for him.
You were just a rich girl only having fun. Your worn out dresses brought stares from everyone. Hey little rich girl, where did you go wrong?
he is. it's been a poor first quarter of sunday football for me so far.
You were just a rich girl only having fun. Your worn out dresses brought stares from everyone. Hey little rich girl, where did you go wrong?
im rooting for him... i also control rice and welker.
You were just a rich girl only having fun. Your worn out dresses brought stares from everyone. Hey little rich girl, where did you go wrong?
Brees had a heck of a day
Welker looks like he’s done shit
Who knows what Rice will do?
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 18, 2011 6:23 PM EST up reply actions
stranger things could happen..
in my brother’s Yahoo league, I tied in my playoff matchup last week, and only b/c I was the #2 seed did I move on
first time I’ve tied in 2 separate leagues in the same year..
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 18, 2011 7:17 PM EST up reply actions
I think it was actually Marques Colston
I could be wrong, though.
"Bitch slap your goldfish folks, we're all screwed."
-KevinMitchellisBatman
although colston was a TE then, right?
You were just a rich girl only having fun. Your worn out dresses brought stares from everyone. Hey little rich girl, where did you go wrong?
anquan boldin apparently had a good rookie season
Rookie season stats: 101 receptions, 1,377 yards, 8 TDs
yeah but 1981 was a good year for all receivers.
You were just a rich girl only having fun. Your worn out dresses brought stares from everyone. Hey little rich girl, where did you go wrong?
just what this thread needs, everyone is happy about the trade!
by 'tHan on Dec 18, 2011 1:45 PM EST reply actions 3 recs
LANCE!
I KNOW THAT GUY!
SERIOUSLY!
"Bitch slap your goldfish folks, we're all screwed."
-KevinMitchellisBatman
Westerville, OH
Can’t remember if it was North or South.
I knew him at Toledo. One of the nicest dudes you’ll ever meet. He was the kind of guy who, despite being in the process of obliterating every receiving record in school history, always had time to walk out of his way to say “Hi” to a nerdy Engineering student when he saw me walking across campus.
"Bitch slap your goldfish folks, we're all screwed."
-KevinMitchellisBatman
by BLee2525 on Dec 18, 2011 2:34 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
wow jermichael finley's four drops (!) are infuriating me
You were just a rich girl only having fun. Your worn out dresses brought stares from everyone. Hey little rich girl, where did you go wrong?
Xavier feels their pain
"Aroldis Chapman is a seven course meal followed by four hours of sex on the table with a nymphomaniac model heiress who owns her own brewery." - jch24
by BK on Dec 18, 2011 2:18 PM EST up reply actions
They're playing about as good of a game as they can play
And X is playing worse than I’ve ever seen
"Aroldis Chapman is a seven course meal followed by four hours of sex on the table with a nymphomaniac model heiress who owns her own brewery." - jch24
by BK on Dec 18, 2011 2:21 PM EST up reply actions
so do the packers
You were just a rich girl only having fun. Your worn out dresses brought stares from everyone. Hey little rich girl, where did you go wrong?
It's the third quarter and Rodgers has only thrown one TD!
That’s awesome because the guy I’m playing today has him for his QB
I don't know why my kids call me that. I think I'm a pretty nice mom.
OMG
My dad must be having a coronary.
He’s been having nightmares lately about the Packers losing.
I’ve been watching the Giants. They’re sucking today. I’m not unhappy, being a Cowboys fan and all. (Thank you, Tony Romo, for not ruining Latos Day for me. What the heck is it with the Cowboys and the 4th quarter?)
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
It's 9-7 KC at the start of the 4th quarter
I like Rodgers and the Packers but not today. The guy I’m playing also has Findley and the Packers kicker.
I don't know why my kids call me that. I think I'm a pretty nice mom.
I almost think
it would be better for the Packers to lose one. Then they can rest up their players for the postseason, rather than chasing a record.
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
Maybe but I would be devastated if I were a real Packers fan
I don't know why my kids call me that. I think I'm a pretty nice mom.
For reals
And then they didn’t even make the Super Bowl. Best argument against playing it safe. I was pissed about that and I’m not even a Colts fan.
I don't know why my kids call me that. I think I'm a pretty nice mom.
yeah, my dad would be
He’s been a Packers fan his whole life. He was so excited this year he’s been buying shares in the team. (We bought him one for father’s day, a long time ago, and until this year, he was content with one.)
They cut him off at 200 shares. Apparently, you aren’t allowed to own more than that.
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
Oh my! That's a lot of shares, since they are not actually convertible back to money.
But I appreciate his spirit!
by Cuetotally Amazing on Dec 18, 2011 3:43 PM EST up reply actions
I think they were 250 a share this sale, so yes.
by Cuetotally Amazing on Dec 18, 2011 3:47 PM EST up reply actions
that's one way to say someone isn't getting an inheritance..
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 18, 2011 7:10 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah
If my pops had that kinda scratch and blew it all on glorified bubblegum cards, I’d be pissed. Hard.
by Charlie Scrabbles on Dec 18, 2011 7:12 PM EST up reply actions
I'd find out his life insurance coverage
find out the beneficiary, and the reap the benefits
flushing $50K down the toilet is certainly a decision, regardless of economic position
although, now that I think about it, it’s odd that my parents got me life insurance back in 1996 for $100K coverage.. I’m surprised they haven’t bumped me off yet
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 18, 2011 7:19 PM EST up reply actions
I really don't understand
Why anyone would want to own more than 1 share. There doesn’t seem to be any advantage to it, unless you want to give them as gifts.
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
I guess technically he owns more of the Packers than others.
They are voting shares, though I don’t think someone with 200 shares gets 200 votes. But still—he’s a superfan!
by Cuetotally Amazing on Dec 18, 2011 4:20 PM EST up reply actions
He's wasting my inheritance!
I should call him up and gloat about the Packers losing.
(He always gives it to me when the Cowboys lose. When I was a kid, and had to go to bed before the game was over, he would put up a sign with the score in my bedroom, so I would see it as soon as I woke up. Only if the Cowboys lost. When they won, he would sometimes lie to me at breakfast, and tell me they lost.)
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
they switched over the Packers after the Giants game
Packers lost. Any given Sunday, I guess.
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
12-7 now
Jeez. The Chiefs are about as good as the Royals this year. It’s always the team you don’t expect.
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
Rodgers has been amazing this year.
I’m glad he picked this week to suck.
I don't know why my kids call me that. I think I'm a pretty nice mom.
Eli is single handedly going to make me lose in the semi finals of my $ league today
Let a man come in and do the Popcorn.
Crum-Bum Beat
i'm happy I have Brees in all of my leagues
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 18, 2011 7:11 PM EST up reply actions
It's looking good for me to win some $$!
I don't know why my kids call me that. I think I'm a pretty nice mom.
1000th comment!
what do i win?
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
we are all going to stop having sex with your mom
by 'tHan on Dec 18, 2011 2:39 PM EST up reply actions 4 recs
Double mobile rec!
It feels so nice to be back to normal
by nycredsfan on Dec 18, 2011 3:14 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
I double mobile rec'd your wife!
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
i do not believe this to be true
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 18, 2011 7:24 PM EST up reply actions
This, like everything else you say, makes absolutely no sense.
It feels so nice to be back to normal
because you don't speak the language of love.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
this coming from someone that got frying pan'd
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 18, 2011 8:55 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
you knew that post was coming
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 18, 2011 10:02 PM EST up reply actions
rolen
"The USA despite its flaws and corruption and overall messiness is still a great and powerful instrument of freedom and hope for the entire world." - Madville
in
a jar with Scott Rolen’s face on it!
by McCutchenIsTheTruth on Dec 18, 2011 4:03 PM EST up reply actions
I went to a restaurant that had a store cat yesterday. It was pretty awesome.
It doesn’t answer your question, though.
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
Aw man all the groceries around me have store cats. Totally awesome
I don’t know if anyone remembers me but I’ve been reading every day 5 to 10 times a day since I stopped posting. So excited about this trade.
Dusty Baker said it was the first [triple play] he’d seen in person. When he was with the Dodgers, they hit into one, but he was in the bathroom.- C Trent
by The Crushinator on Dec 18, 2011 4:10 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
I remember you, and I'm quite obscure myself.
This is what winning baseball does. Walt makes, ergo we have a reason to post again!
I BLEED RED
release the hounds!!!
"The USA despite its flaws and corruption and overall messiness is still a great and powerful instrument of freedom and hope for the entire world." - Madville
Is there an animal rescue league? Is that what you are asking?
Here in Boston they will come rescue strays and others in peril.
by Cuetotally Amazing on Dec 18, 2011 3:45 PM EST up reply actions
crack a can of tuna
once you get the cat, lets see what sort of shape it is in.
by Eastwindquinn on Dec 18, 2011 4:14 PM EST up reply actions
x
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
by Cy Schourek on Dec 18, 2011 4:16 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
That was really one of TV's best running jokes.
I’m not sure you could get away with it today. I’m not really sure you could get away with Alf today, but probably not with kitten sandwiches.
by Cuetotally Amazing on Dec 18, 2011 4:21 PM EST up reply actions
let the dog go find it?
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 18, 2011 7:13 PM EST up reply actions
A different way to evaluate the trade
Look at upside/baseline(median)/disappointment levels.
What might each player turn into? If you’re a stathead, think of it as 80/50/20 percentiles.
Also, there’s some chance that each of these guys gets hurt and leaves the game.
For example: Best case, Latos could turn into Cliff Lee. Median, maybe Josh Beckett. Disappointment? Probably AJ Burnett. Let’s give him a 20% chance of exploding.
Now, what we gave up:
Volquez: Best: Cueto Median: Volquez Disappointment: Daniel Cabrera
Alonso: Best: Casey Median: Gabby Sanchez Disappointment: Conor Jackson
Boxy: Best: Sergio Romo Median: LaTroy Hawkins Disappointment: Pick your favorite lousy MR
Grandal: Best: Pudge Median: Napoli Disappointment: Benji Molina
So, sure. If the stars mis-align, we gave up Cueto, Casey, Romo, and Pudge for AJ Burnett. But it’s more likely we gave up Volquez, Sanchez, Hawkins and Napoli for Josh Beckett. And maybe we gave up Daniel Cabrera, Conor Jackson, Benji Molina and junk for Cliff Lee.
"The USA despite its flaws and corruption and overall messiness is still a great and powerful instrument of freedom and hope for the entire world." - Madville
Seriously guys
we have Mat Fuckin Latos.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
by Yossarian22 on Dec 18, 2011 5:29 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
It's like all of the Broncos' good luck in the last several weeks has gone out of the window at once
"Good luck, National League managers – I have no idea how you’re supposed to get this guy out." - Dave Cameron on Joey Votto
by Grahamophone on Dec 18, 2011 6:36 PM EST up reply actions
It looks live my beloved Lions are going to lose, too
"Good luck, National League managers – I have no idea how you’re supposed to get this guy out." - Dave Cameron on Joey Votto
by Grahamophone on Dec 18, 2011 6:39 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah, Oakland is going to win
"Good luck, National League managers – I have no idea how you’re supposed to get this guy out." - Dave Cameron on Joey Votto
by Grahamophone on Dec 18, 2011 6:47 PM EST up reply actions
Which works out fine for the Bengals
what with owning the tie-breaker with the Broncos and all.
Wear something sexy to my funeral.
by Pops Daniels on Dec 18, 2011 6:49 PM EST up reply actions
Eh, the Ravens will end the Bengals hopes anyhow.
Wear something sexy to my funeral.
by Pops Daniels on Dec 18, 2011 6:50 PM EST up reply actions
if the ravens win tonight & next week
they’ll have nothing to play for against the bengals.
i’m more concerned with arizona ending the bengals hopes
I make a mistake above
In my mind the Bengals beat the Broncos. They’re fucked.
Wear something sexy to my funeral.
by Pops Daniels on Dec 18, 2011 6:52 PM EST up reply actions
The Broncos have the Bills and Chiefs
the next two weeks. They should walk in despite this loss. And they own the head to head with the Jets. The Bengals are indeed screwed.
Wear something sexy to my funeral.
by Pops Daniels on Dec 18, 2011 6:55 PM EST up reply actions
nevermind
i didn’t realize the steelers had the same record as the ravens.
also, they’re battling the patriots for home field.
the bengals are screwed
Lions trying to make this a game
"Good luck, National League managers – I have no idea how you’re supposed to get this guy out." - Dave Cameron on Joey Votto
by Grahamophone on Dec 18, 2011 6:57 PM EST up reply actions
Let us hope.
Wear something sexy to my funeral.
by Pops Daniels on Dec 18, 2011 6:58 PM EST up reply actions
Lions engineering a miracle
"Good luck, National League managers – I have no idea how you’re supposed to get this guy out." - Dave Cameron on Joey Votto
by Grahamophone on Dec 18, 2011 7:14 PM EST up reply actions
Anyone watching the Blue Jackets?
I know, they are fucking terrible… But they are on FSO
crashtestnipplechip citymoron
Tebow is a total asshat
"Good luck, National League managers – I have no idea how you’re supposed to get this guy out." - Dave Cameron on Joey Votto
by Grahamophone on Dec 18, 2011 7:00 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah. I'm okay with disliking the willfully ignorant.
His problem, much like politicians that I would normally ignore, is that he has a groundswell of support from the folks in this country that I hold in the highest disdain. He’s not at fault for that, but I don’t care.
Wear something sexy to my funeral.
by Pops Daniels on Dec 18, 2011 7:04 PM EST up reply actions
It is an irrational dislike, admittedly.
Wear something sexy to my funeral.
by Pops Daniels on Dec 18, 2011 7:04 PM EST up reply actions
I agree with what you said, but I think he is somewhat at fault.
The “Tebowing” craze is his fault. If he really was so humble and did love God so much he would act like a fucking professional and play football without any type of display.
"Good luck, National League managers – I have no idea how you’re supposed to get this guy out." - Dave Cameron on Joey Votto
by Grahamophone on Dec 18, 2011 7:08 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah, but I'm a hypocrite.
I hate him specifically because he’s the new evangelical talking point. Those people are my American enemies.
Wear something sexy to my funeral.
by Pops Daniels on Dec 18, 2011 7:18 PM EST up reply actions
I don't understand this.
He’s not doing it in a showy way. He’s just giving thanks for what he perceives as a blessing from God.
"Red Reporter - An elitist clique full of like-minded douchebags." - BK
This thread is a behemoth
"Good luck, National League managers – I have no idea how you’re supposed to get this guy out." - Dave Cameron on Joey Votto
by Grahamophone on Dec 18, 2011 7:02 PM EST up reply actions
red reporter's hottest threat is omg
Club owner RijoSabo has built a fantasy world that answers the question, "Thisss?" This place has everything: geeks, trolls, a bald kid with a blanket sucking his thumb , thread after thread of ridiculous nonsense, and look over there in the corner – is that Mick Jagger? No. It’s jch impregnating your mom. His knees look like biscuits and he’s ready to party."
by 'tHan on Dec 18, 2011 7:26 PM EST up reply actions 7 recs
in all fairness
they do look like biscuits
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 18, 2011 7:33 PM EST up reply actions
I know what the fuck
and I just gave him a hardcore fistbump. Funny shit, ’tHan.
by Charlie Scrabbles on Dec 18, 2011 7:33 PM EST up reply actions
That's when you know it's gonna get at least six recs
He’s easily the best character on that show in years.
by Charlie Scrabbles on Dec 18, 2011 7:35 PM EST up reply actions
I lost it at the "knees look like biscuits" line
A++++++++++++ will rec again
"Aroldis Chapman is a seven course meal followed by four hours of sex on the table with a nymphomaniac model heiress who owns her own brewery." - jch24
by BK on Dec 18, 2011 8:07 PM EST up reply actions
Holy crap.
You, sir, are a living RR legend.
"Red Reporter - An elitist clique full of like-minded douchebags." - BK
Yup.
Wear something sexy to my funeral.
by Pops Daniels on Dec 18, 2011 7:21 PM EST up reply actions
"And all of a sudden, the Raiders are knocking on the door"
It’s been so long since I’ve heard tHom say that…
Go Colts Dammit!
Awesome.
Wear something sexy to my funeral.
by Pops Daniels on Dec 18, 2011 7:22 PM EST up reply actions
no, he got /NdamukongSuh'd
"Good luck, National League managers – I have no idea how you’re supposed to get this guy out." - Dave Cameron on Joey Votto
by Grahamophone on Dec 19, 2011 2:06 AM EST up reply actions
Go Lions!
Yesssss
"Good luck, National League managers – I have no idea how you’re supposed to get this guy out." - Dave Cameron on Joey Votto
Guys, the rotation is gonna look like this this year!
How badass is that?
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
I love that you're the one to break things down via pictures, it just feel so right
"Wait, you think I'm being mean to the pretend orangutan?" -- battlekow
It gets more badass than that
"Aroldis Chapman is a seven course meal followed by four hours of sex on the table with a nymphomaniac model heiress who owns her own brewery." - jch24
by BK on Dec 18, 2011 8:08 PM EST up reply actions
that is like a seven course meal followed by fours of sex on the table with a nymphomaniac model heiress who owns her own brewery
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
that is like a seven course meal followed by fours of sex on the table with a nymphomaniac model heiress who owns her own brewery
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
that is like a seven course meal followed by fours of sex on the table with a nymphomaniac model heiress who owns her own brewery
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
no worse than #3 in our rotation, folks
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 18, 2011 8:31 PM EST up reply actions
I think it's gonna be a long long time till Aroldis Chapman is a rocket man
he’s not the man you think he is at all.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
I'm gonna be really disappointed if he's not in the rotation out of ST Camp
I guess I would accept semantics between 3 or 4 or 5, but if they are going to feed us the line of BS about him starting in 2012, then let’s see it
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 18, 2011 8:51 PM EST up reply actions
if it's in AAA, then it's torches and pitchforks time
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 18, 2011 8:56 PM EST up reply actions
when are you going to accept the likelihood
that Chapman will spend some time time next year either in AAA or in the bullpen?
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
unless he's the closer, he's wasted in the bullpen
and why lie to us about him starting if he’s gonna be in AAA?
he pitched in winter ball and he’ll pitch in ST
he’s faced MLB hitters before, shouldn’t be a hard concept unless I’m complete off base, which could very well be the case
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 19, 2011 9:36 PM EST up reply actions
I think Chapman understands the concept of what he is suppose to do
but he needs to consistently pitch 5-6 innings, which he will struggle to do right now. He struggles to throw strikes and as a result will throw a ton of pitches.
Why waste his service time, and hurt the Reds, by having him learn to throw strikes in the big leagues?
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
by Yossarian22 on Dec 20, 2011 10:53 AM EST up reply actions
I don't think service time is any longer an issue with his contract.
IIRC
this post has some syntax and apostrophe issues - jutsin
by PeteyHendrix on Dec 20, 2011 3:07 PM EST up reply actions
Yes it is
Players cannot apply for free agency until they have 6 years of MLB service time. So if his contract ends before he reaches 6 years of service time, the Reds can offer him arbitration.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
by Yossarian22 on Dec 21, 2011 10:41 AM EST up reply actions
so did Johnny Cueto
as well as Edinson Volquez.
Every international non-drafted player started out as a free agent.
It is just most don’t get the attention Chapman received.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
by Yossarian22 on Dec 21, 2011 10:52 AM EST up reply actions
If you do not believe me
Check Cueto’s Baseball-Reference page.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
by Yossarian22 on Dec 21, 2011 10:54 AM EST up reply actions
yes
Hannigan was signed as an undrafted amateur free agent as well.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
by Yossarian22 on Dec 21, 2011 11:00 AM EST up reply actions
Whether a team acquires a player via the draft or intl free agency
that player is subjected to six years of team control at the big league level. This applies to every player, though IIRC there have been a few Japanese players who have negotiated the reserve clause out of their initial contracts.
by Charlie Scrabbles on Dec 21, 2011 11:12 AM EST up reply actions
Yeah
Nomo was signed as a free agent, rather than an Amatuer free agent. Which is fair, as they were big league players in Japan.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
by Yossarian22 on Dec 21, 2011 11:16 AM EST up reply actions
Eh
That’s an entirely different conversation. The relationship MLB has with NPB is seriously messed up.
by Charlie Scrabbles on Dec 21, 2011 11:25 AM EST up reply actions
Yeah
I checked and Daisuke was not signed as a regular free agent. Which is ridiculous given his age and prior success in a league which seems to be somewhere between AAA and MLB in talent.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
by Yossarian22 on Dec 21, 2011 11:31 AM EST up reply actions
IIRC, Chapman signed a 6-year MLB contract.
And that once that contract is up, he becomes a FA regardless of service time. They only had to keep him in the minors until June of 2010 for the service time to not be an issue.
Anyone informed wanna chime in here?
this post has some syntax and apostrophe issues - jutsin
by PeteyHendrix on Dec 21, 2011 5:29 PM EST up reply actions
He signed a six year contract
but he still has to serve six years with the Reds per the reserve clause.
by Charlie Scrabbles on Dec 21, 2011 6:40 PM EST up reply actions
Thanks!
And I just saw that I am older than every Red, including Miguel Cairo.
First time I’ve seen that, and it’s plenty humbling. :)
this post has some syntax and apostrophe issues - jutsin
by PeteyHendrix on Dec 21, 2011 7:46 PM EST up reply actions
you believe Charlie and not me
when he said the same thing I did?
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
by Yossarian22 on Dec 21, 2011 11:03 PM EST up reply actions
I didn't phrase any of this well...my bad.
I wanted to point out that Chapman’s contract was possibly different due to the complications involving vesting in later years that led to his postponed initial call-up in 2010 in order to change the status of the 6th year of his deal, and I was seeking clarification given that complicated set of circumstances that may have circumvented the standard rules which you were applying in this case. We had a series of complex discussions in 2010 in this regard, and I wanted to verify that your codicil was apropos, rather than standard application of existing contractual normalcy.
Sorry about that.
this post has some syntax and apostrophe issues - jutsin
by PeteyHendrix on Dec 21, 2011 11:45 PM EST up reply actions
he throws a ton of pitches b/c he also strikes out a lot of people
I think he can consistently go 6, but maybe that’s just me, and I’m ok with that..
I don’t see how him being on the Reds hurts the Reds, if it’s in the rotation or in the pen. Do I want him in the pen? Not really, but I want all our best assets on the big club. Is that selfish of me? Probably, but after trading for Lay-tose, I wanna make sure we have the best team around our best players (Cueto, Lay-tose, Votto, Bruce, Phillips)..
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 20, 2011 8:49 PM EST up reply actions
If he pitched in Winter Ball this year
I missed it. Or did he manage to get in about 12 innings? Either way, Winter Ball and ST combined are not NEARLY enough prep to get him to a starter’s workload. Are you going to hike his innings by 100 next year? Because if not, he’s gonna spend some time in Louisville or in the bullpen.
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
I thought he pitched in Winter Ball
maybe I was wrong.. it’s happened a lot lately
I think he could give us 120 innings in the rotation next year, as I see us using basically a 6 man rotation over the course of the year to manage innings for guys, to maximize matchups, etc..
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 20, 2011 8:50 PM EST up reply actions
Why are all the breweries in Saint Louis closed on sundays
:-(
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
b/c (insert RR poster du jour) touches himself at night
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Dec 18, 2011 8:32 PM EST up reply actions
my buddy posted a link about Il's death, with a caption that read "So sad before Christmas"
so Facebook placed it with 11 other posts about Christmas.
Contributing little more than than snark and wittiness to SBN since 2007.
by Yossarian22 on Dec 19, 2011 12:49 AM EST up reply actions 2 recs
Ha! One of my FB friends posted the same thing
I don't know why my kids call me that. I think I'm a pretty nice mom.
I wish there was a delete on here so I could re-post this in the right place.
I don't know why my kids call me that. I think I'm a pretty nice mom.
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