Predict the Offseason
by RijoSaboCaseyWKRP on Nov 15, 2011 10:15 AM EST
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PrintWe may have already seen the Reds' big offseason free agent signing, so this post might be coming too late. But I figured we could treat the offseason like the regular season and make a game of predicting how it might turn out.
The mantra of "the Reds have no money and are talking to no one" has cropped up again this year after the post-2010 offseason in which Fred Lewis and Edgar Renteria ended up the two primary outside acquisitions signed to major league deals. In fairness, the Jay Bruce and Johnny Cueto extensions look good, the Votto extension provided cost certainty (though no extra years) and Willis' minor league deal provided some surprising upside. Still, it was an underwhelming offseason that seems to be starting off this year in similar fashion.
The major difference over last winter, I think, is that this season's disappointment, marked by starting pitching woes, will be combined with pressure from the rest of the division - especially Walt's former employer - putting Jocketty under the gun to make an impact deal. Whether there will be one out there is another story.
Here are the guidelines for the predictions. The predictions should be what you think will happen, not what should. There's another thread coming on Walt Jocketty: RPG. Add yours to the thread below. Unfortunately, credit will not be given for predicting that Matt Maloney would be picked up by the Twins.
* Deadline: Sunday, November 20 at midnight
You won't get credit for predicting something that happens this week if your ballot is judged to be ex post facto (that is, after it's all but a certainty on the rumor mills), but the earlier you lock in your picks this week, the more likely you eliminate that possibility.
Name the free agent signings
(Maximum: 6 names)
For both major and minor league deals, name current free agent players the Reds will sign to contracts this offseason. Predict the type of contract, number of years and total money too. We'll give bonus points to the closest guesses, judged on Average Annual Value (rather than exact years and price tag). So you can put your answer like this:
Pierre, Juan; major league contract, $22.435 AAV
Name the trades
(Maximum: 4 trades)
What teams will the Reds pair with and what players will change hands on both sides? This won't be scored all-or-nothing. Some points for getting the team right, more points for each correct player and big points for getting the trade exactly right.
Departures
(Maximum 4 players)
Beyond Jared Burton and Matt Maloney, who else from the organization will leave the Reds (other than by way of trade) - free agency, non-tender, retirement, waivers, Rule 5 draft, 50+ game suspensions? With the exception of the Rule 5 Draft, we'll limit this to players on the 40 man on November 20th for ease of use. So if you think Neftali Soto won't be added to the roster and will get snatched up by another team, you can pick him. If you think he will, but he'll retire from baseball from some reason, you can also pick him. But if Neftali Soto is not added to the roster and is suspended for 50 games, you won't get credit.
Injuries
(Maximum: 4 players)
Name as many as 4 Reds players (current or speculative acquisitions) not currently on the DL that will be on the DL to start opening day. Bonus points for naming the body part (ie ankle) and further bonus points for the exact injury (ie "sprained ankle).
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Pineda and Figgins for Volquez and Frazier.
Reds resign Dontrelle.
That’s it. In fact, that’s pretty much it until 2015.
Powered by garbage, you say?
That technology is still 3 years away…
Follow on Twitter: @jluckhaupt. Buy The Wire-to-Wire Reds today!
by Slyde on Nov 15, 2011 11:01 AM EST via mobile reply actions
Hey,
that looks like my Krups coffee grinder. Do they offer a conversion kit?
by Joe Nolan's Neckbeard on Nov 15, 2011 11:42 AM EST up reply actions
And the Reds still have 3 years to win the WS before the Cubs do against a Miami team...
That was a disgraceful performance, in my opinion. We threw that game, we gave it away. We gave them the fucking game. In my opinion, that sucked. What's that? Playoffs? Don't talk about--playoffs? You kidding me? Playoffs?! I just hope we can win a game!
It was not just a movie
It was a documentary, and the events occurred in real time.
by Charlie Scrabbles on Nov 15, 2011 6:14 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Good point
- All free agents, whether with the Reds last season or not. I’ve expanded the limit to 6, so anyone who’s posted their predictions should feel free to edit. I think there’s two of you as of this comment.
Mgr., Red Reporter
"Bootsy, you're a superstar right?"
"Twinkle, twinkle, babble."
by RijoSaboCaseyWKRP on Nov 15, 2011 1:08 PM EST up reply actions
Free Agents
Dontrelle Willis, $1.5 mil AAV
Francisco Cordero, $5 mil AAV
Trades
Homer Bailey and Donnie Joseph for Carlos Quentin and $$
Departures
Kris Negron, Jordan Smith DFA’d
Injuries
Scott Rolen (back)
by Charlie Scrabbles on Nov 15, 2011 12:12 PM EST reply actions
You can't predict that Rolen will have a back problem!
That’s like predicting the sun will rise in the east tomorrow.
You heard it here first!!!
FA signings
Dontrelle Willis, $2 M AAV (1 year)
Ramon Hernandez, $4 M AAV (2 year)
Cesar Izturis, Minor league deal
Trades
Joey Votto, Ryan Hanigan, Todd Frazier, and Homer Bailey to Rays for James Shields and Matt Moore.
Edinson Volquez to Rockies for bag of charcoal and liter of lighter fluid.
No way the Rays would do that trade, right?
We're all mad. I'm mad. You're mad. Otherwise, you wouldn't have come here.
No way the Reds would do that trade, right?
by Charlie Scrabbles on Nov 15, 2011 1:00 PM EST up reply actions
No, and No.
Rays aren’t trading Moore, and the Reds aren’t trading Votto.
It feels so nice to be back to normal
I don't think it's realistic
I might do Votto for Shields and Moore, but no way am I throwing in anything else.
by Charlie Scrabbles on Nov 15, 2011 1:23 PM EST up reply actions
Matt Moore is going to be worth more than Votto over the next few years.
Mark it down.
It feels so nice to be back to normal
I'm totally for serious.
I love Votto, but Moore is going to be one of the best pitchers in baseball very soon. AND he’s making league minimum over the next 3 years.
If you offered Votto in exchange for Shields and Moore, the Rays would laugh at you. And look at who else was included. Frazier, Hanigan, and Bailey. None of those guys have all that much value by themselves. Added up it’s a pretty nice package, but Shields and Moore are both elite pitchers. I still think the Rays would blink first.
It feels so nice to be back to normal
I don't think Shields is an elite pitcher (3.88 career FIP, 3.69 SIERA)
and while Moore is all kinds of awesome, TINSTAAP. Votto is one of the 3 or 4 best players in all of baseball. I’m totally for serious when I say that I think you are underrating him.
by Charlie Scrabbles on Nov 15, 2011 1:43 PM EST up reply actions
Shields might not be a perennial all-star
but you’ve got to admit this nevergonnahappen trade would be a total win for the Reds.
The dropoff from Joey to Yonder would be dwarfed by the “holy shit we’re going to win the world series” rotation the Reds would be running out all season.
We're all mad. I'm mad. You're mad. Otherwise, you wouldn't have come here.
Yes, it would be a good deal for the Reds
but I think it’s fair value both ways. Prospects are valued at an all-time high right now (which is why the Rays would laugh at such an offer) but that doesn’t mean they are right to do so.
by Charlie Scrabbles on Nov 15, 2011 1:59 PM EST up reply actions
It's not fair value, though.
Votto is gonna be awesome for 2 years, but you have to pay $26 million for said awesomeness.
Shields and Moore are likely going to combine for more awesomeness than Votto over the next 2 years, and they’ll do so for a total of about $17 million.
Then, the Reds would get Shields for another year and Moore for 4 more, while Votto would be gone. That deal would be a highway robbery if it got done.
It feels so nice to be back to normal
OK...
So what would the Reds have to throw in to even it out? Mesoraco instead of Hanigan? Corcino too?
I don't know, because no deal involving Votto OR Moore is ever gonna happen.
It feels so nice to be back to normal
OMG he's serial!
Tequila and pancakes, anyone?
by Kevin Mitchell is Batman on Nov 15, 2011 1:54 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Also of note: Joey Votto is 28 years old, Matt Moore is 22
"Wait, you think I'm being mean to the pretend orangutan?" -- battlekow
also, BiBi Jones is 20.
Carry on.
Tequila and pancakes, anyone?
by Kevin Mitchell is Batman on Nov 15, 2011 1:58 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
She's gonna look a LOT worse at 28 than Votto does
"Wait, you think I'm being mean to the pretend orangutan?" -- battlekow
by jch24 on Nov 15, 2011 3:03 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
She's only 25.....amazing, no?
"Wait, you think I'm being mean to the pretend orangutan?" -- battlekow
I'd still treat her to a nice steak dinner.
Wear something sexy to my funeral.
by Pops Daniels on Nov 15, 2011 6:37 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Then we'd do a buncha blow
and rob a liquor store together. A first date of pure bliss.
Wear something sexy to my funeral.
by Pops Daniels on Nov 15, 2011 6:51 PM EST up reply actions 5 recs
Me too, definitely
But I like to think I could get her to settle down. You know, we would buy a little B&B in Hocking Hills and watch 30 Rock all over again on Netflix. I’d stare at her ass while she did the dishes and she’d be disapprove of my attempt to grow a moustache because it reminds her too much of those guys that one night.
by Charlie Scrabbles on Nov 15, 2011 7:53 PM EST up reply actions
Kinda like this guy tried to do.
Wear something sexy to my funeral.
by Pops Daniels on Nov 15, 2011 9:00 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I watched Machete over the weekend
No complaints about her performance from me, ya know, except for the half of it that she wasn’t topless.
"Aroldis Chapman is a seven course meal followed by four hours of sex on the table with a nymphomaniac model heiress who owns her own brewery." - jch24
by BK on Nov 15, 2011 6:44 PM EST up reply actions
Awwww man
/disappointed
"Aroldis Chapman is a seven course meal followed by four hours of sex on the table with a nymphomaniac model heiress who owns her own brewery." - jch24
by BK on Nov 15, 2011 6:52 PM EST up reply actions
chin up!
you can always look at her upcoming playboy spread that a hackneyed rehash of the marilyn monroe pictures.
you are correct. for some reason i was thinking miley cyrus did a monroe shoot as well
either way, i guess lohan is doing the monroe thing again. #yawn
should I have known who Michelle Williams is?
Because I still don’t.
A girl I dated in college had an eerie resemblance to teenage Marilyn Monroe. Had I known this at the time I probably wouldn’t have been as quick to cut it off.
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
Like the bottle of lotion gives a shit.
Wear something sexy to my funeral.
by Pops Daniels on Nov 15, 2011 6:52 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
...the fuck is wrong with her chest?
That was a disgraceful performance, in my opinion. We threw that game, we gave it away. We gave them the fucking game. In my opinion, that sucked. What's that? Playoffs? Don't talk about--playoffs? You kidding me? Playoffs?! I just hope we can win a game!
Someone posted a ginger pic on EDSBS that about made me throw up
Dayman, Fighter of the Nightman, Champion of the Sun
It was safe for work!
Shouldn’t have been deleted! I wouldn’t post anything that would get anyone fired.
Now, it was disturbing….
Dayman, Fighter of the Nightman, Champion of the Sun
Oh, it looked like hair when I wasn't paying much attention
That was a disgraceful performance, in my opinion. We threw that game, we gave it away. We gave them the fucking game. In my opinion, that sucked. What's that? Playoffs? Don't talk about--playoffs? You kidding me? Playoffs?! I just hope we can win a game!
Yeah, "elite" is a bit strong, but
He’s as safe a bet as there is in baseball to give you 200+ above average innings. And quite possibly those innings could be well above average.
And it’s not like Matt Moore is years away. He could walk into just about any rotation in baseball and be at least its second best pitcher. He’d immediately become the Reds ace.
Then there’s service time. You are getting 9 years of pitching goodness for 2 years of Votto. That’s not even close to being fair for the Rays.
It feels so nice to be back to normal
would you trade Alonso and Mesoraco for Moore?
Would the Rays?
Tequila and pancakes, anyone?
by Kevin Mitchell is Batman on Nov 15, 2011 2:14 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
In a heartbeat for the Reds.
Rays not so much.
Wear something sexy to my funeral.
by Pops Daniels on Nov 15, 2011 6:38 PM EST up reply actions
I'm just not as convinced as you are that Moore is going to step into a rotation tomorrow and be so incredible
There is so much volatility in young pitchers like him that you’d be foolish not to curb your projection of him because of it. TINSTAAP is a well-worn acronym for good reason: young pitchers are the most volatile commodities in baseball.
I’ll grant you that he looks excellent. He definitely has incredible stuff. But the likelihood that he pitches like Roy Halladay over the next three years is much less than the likelihood that he pitches like Homer Bailey or Edinson Volquez. He’s a very valuable player right now to be sure, but he’s not as valuable as Joey Votto.
by Charlie Scrabbles on Nov 15, 2011 2:16 PM EST up reply actions
Good point...
Suppose my proposed deal was for Shields and Hellickson instead of Shields and Moore. Would it be reasonable then? (Geez, I’m not even getting into Price. I hate the Rays.)
Hellickson is Moore, just a year older
I fucking hate the Rays.
by Charlie Scrabbles on Nov 15, 2011 2:20 PM EST up reply actions
Hellickson is not as good as Moore
in fact, Hellickson could be below average next year and I wouldn’t be too surprised.
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
See, I think you are underestimating Moore
Moore is Price, only possibly better.
I’m not just being starry eyed over a young pitcher. I’ve read and seen enough to think that Moore is going to be a multiply Cy Young winner, providing he stays healthy.
It feels so nice to be back to normal
I get that
but Hellickson was pretty much unanimously more highly regarded just one year ago.
by Charlie Scrabbles on Nov 15, 2011 2:54 PM EST up reply actions
I can't say for sure he was or wasn't
but Moore seems like a much more special pitcher.
And also, there’s nothing to say Hellickson won’t turn into a Cy Young candidate either. He did just win ROY.
It feels so nice to be back to normal
Right
but my point is that there is a new “multiple Cy Young winner” churned out every year, and rarely do they ever jump right in and do it, as you are suggesting Moore can.
Look, I’m not disagreeing with you that Moore is a fantastic prospect. My point rather is that prospects in general are being categorically overvalued in the market right now. I wish the Reds were anticipating that and taking advantage of it.
by Charlie Scrabbles on Nov 15, 2011 3:06 PM EST up reply actions
I definitely agree with that
I just think in the particular, fantastical scenario badenjr presented, the Reds would be getting back more than they would be giving up.
That’s all.
It feels so nice to be back to normal
Eh
It’s probably much closer than you think.
That’s all.
by Charlie Scrabbles on Nov 15, 2011 3:11 PM EST up reply actions
I'm with nyc
it’s crazy lopsided to the Reds
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
Well, that just makes me more confident
by Charlie Scrabbles on Nov 15, 2011 3:27 PM EST up reply actions
You're a meanie
and I wasn’t even wrong on whatever those links are to
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
Ahhh shit, bro
I was just clownin’. We bros, yeah?
And I really don’t think it’s all that lopsided. I mean, sure, it’s probably a win for the Reds in part because they have a suitable though inferior replacement for Votto in house. It’s really difficult for any team, even the Rays, to muster up the depth to replace 2/5 of their rotation.
by Charlie Scrabbles on Nov 15, 2011 3:55 PM EST up reply actions
every time on this site when people talk about Cy Youngs,
at first glance I think they’re talking about me.
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
He has more than incredible stuff
He’s like Volquez, only with a faster FB, a loopier curve, a similar changeup, and much better command and control.
And throwing out Halladay isn’t fair. No one is going to be Halladay over the next three years, but I’d say it’s a safe bet Moore is going to be much closer to Felix Hernandez than he will be to Bailey or Volquez.
It feels so nice to be back to normal
Would you trade Votto straight up for Moore?
"Wait, you think I'm being mean to the pretend orangutan?" -- battlekow
No.
But it wouldn’t take much Moore.
And I’d trade Votto for David Price straight up.
It feels so nice to be back to normal
by nycredsfan on Nov 15, 2011 3:21 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
the Rays wouldn't
The ends justify the means
by Highlifeman21 on Nov 16, 2011 11:40 PM EST up reply actions
Both teams would simultaneously hang up on each other.
Honestly, I think the Rays blink first. They never, ever trade players who are pre-arb. That goes doubly for players who are the top pitching prospect in baseball.
It feels so nice to be back to normal
I'm sure I'm not right about the trade, but...
At least I feel like I started a reasonable discussion. It would be fun to have a blockbuster deal like this happen in real life.
It'll never happen...
But the Rays supposedly would listen if Votto was on the table. Votto commands a haul – more than just Moore. They’d need pitching back, and Homer could use the change of scenery. Hanigan’s OBP fits well with the Rays’ need for catching and their sabermetric leanings, and Frazier’s versatility is also the type thing the Rays love. Sheilds and Votto are the headliners, and both are locked into contracts that don’t run as long as the teams would like. It could work.
I don't think that particular trade
But this bit from MLB Trade Rumors is interesting:
The Rays are concentrating on upgrading at first base, DH, and landing two relievers, tweets Joel Sherman of the New York Post. They want to hang on to their pitching depth, but that would change if Joey Votto of the Reds became available.
Jo-eh might like playing for the Rays. They’re only an hour or so from Sarasota.
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
Which has an airport that can fly him to Toronto?
I don’t get the connection.
Wear something sexy to my funeral.
by Pops Daniels on Nov 15, 2011 6:43 PM EST up reply actions
Pretty sure he lives in Sarasota in the offseason.
Toronto’s more like the family homestead.
by the finest muffins on Nov 15, 2011 6:44 PM EST up reply actions
Ah, I see.
Figures the ladies know these things. Stalkers.
Wear something sexy to my funeral.
by Pops Daniels on Nov 15, 2011 6:47 PM EST up reply actions
...
Let a man come in and do the Popcorn.
Crum-Bum Beat
by -ManBearPig on Nov 15, 2011 7:08 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
It gets mentioned a lot.
Like when he won the MVP and they interviewed him in his backyard. Or when he did his rehab stint in ’09 in Sarasota, they mentioned that it would be good because he could stay at home.
Maybe we just have better memories.
by the finest muffins on Nov 15, 2011 7:13 PM EST up reply actions
That's probably true.
My brain is an alcohol swiss cheese.
Wear something sexy to my funeral.
by Pops Daniels on Nov 15, 2011 7:14 PM EST up reply actions
He lives in florida, because he doesn't want to pay canadian taxes
Everyone knows these things, just ask Jeter
@DavefrmLville.....is fun to follow on twiiter!
by Dave from Louisville on Nov 15, 2011 9:19 PM EST up reply actions
or US taxes
A lot of my friends in the military also have claimed Florida for their home of record. No income tax!
Ditto Texas. For some reason, Texas is really popular with RVers. They live anywhere they want to, but get their mail in Texas. And file their tax returns as Texans.
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
is it true that military kids get in-state anywhere?
Even if you’re not in the military, but you grew up as a military brat?
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
That seems fair because it would be hard for them to establish a residency anywhere
of course it would be even more awesome if public schools just offered the same “low” tuition for all American citizens.
"Life is such a vapid world pool of nothing"-Eddie Pepitone
I don't know
but I’m pretty sure that DC high school grads get in-state tuition nationwide.
by the finest muffins on Nov 16, 2011 8:36 PM EST up reply actions
Oh, forgot departures and injuries...
Departures (besides the trades)
Cordero via FA
Injuries
Ramon Hernandez (Ankle – 6 weeks; position filled by Corky)
END (wrist – 2 weeks)
If END doesn't get his 5th rotation spot...
Then he doesn’t make the team. Another period.
I BLEED RED
i predict no trades and no type a or b fa signings
Departures: maloney, burton
"the only place they lost was the scoreboard"
by Ewok on Nov 15, 2011 1:04 PM EST via mobile reply actions
You really should've asked obc and jch before posting their pictures.
It feels so nice to be back to normal
by nycredsfan on Nov 15, 2011 2:10 PM EST up reply actions 5 recs
rec this man
"Aroldis Chapman is a seven course meal followed by four hours of sex on the table with a nymphomaniac model heiress who owns her own brewery." - jch24
by BK on Nov 15, 2011 6:30 PM EST up reply actions
It occurs to me that we should have a contest to predict the Opening Day 25-man roster...
Maybe we could make that a later contest. One point per correct player. Simple rules. Do it early, and the surprises would come from the trades, FA signings, and rookies to make it interesting.
That's a good idea
I think we did something similar last season, maybe in Jan or Feb? Can’t recall if it was a proper contest.
Mgr., Red Reporter
"Bootsy, you're a superstar right?"
"Twinkle, twinkle, babble."
by RijoSaboCaseyWKRP on Nov 15, 2011 1:12 PM EST up reply actions
Whether we did or not...
It would be better to do it before the FA season wraps up. If you wait until Spring Training, we’ll all know about 22-23 of the guys, and we’ll all have very similar guesses. Do it early, and there’s enough room for speculation that we should get an interesting set of guesses.
it was probably just another thread that got bombed with pictures of Lindsey Lohan and homoerotic pictures
@DavefrmLville.....is fun to follow on twiiter!
by Dave from Louisville on Nov 15, 2011 9:22 PM EST up reply actions
welcome to the internet, population: all of us.
Tequila and pancakes, anyone?
by Kevin Mitchell is Batman on Nov 15, 2011 9:32 PM EST up reply actions
put me down for some homoerotic
Hold the Lindsey Lohan.
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
hewegooo
FA: David DeJesus, 2yr $6 million; Ramon Hernandez, 1yr $5.5 million
Trades: Yonder Alonso, Ryan Hanigan, Homer Bailey for James Shields and Reid Brignac; Volquez, Dave Sappelt for Andrew Bailey.
Tequila and pancakes, anyone?
by Kevin Mitchell is Batman on Nov 15, 2011 1:35 PM EST via mobile reply actions
oh yeah
Willis for 1yr, $1.75 million.
Tequila and pancakes, anyone?
by Kevin Mitchell is Batman on Nov 15, 2011 1:36 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
yep, they were SOOOO GOOOD last year!
Tequila and pancakes, anyone?
by Kevin Mitchell is Batman on Nov 15, 2011 7:55 PM EST up reply actions
More like an ass fixation, amiright!!??
High five!!
by Charlie Scrabbles on Nov 15, 2011 7:57 PM EST up reply actions
I've got a link I could post here...
Tequila and pancakes, anyone?
by Kevin Mitchell is Batman on Nov 15, 2011 7:59 PM EST up reply actions
that'll do!
Tequila and pancakes, anyone?
by Kevin Mitchell is Batman on Nov 15, 2011 8:05 PM EST up reply actions
Mine
Free agent signings
Andrew Brackman – minor league deal
Ramon Santiago – 1 yr/$1M
Kerry Wood – 2 yr/$4.5M
Dontrelle Willis – 1 yr/$1.5M
Trades
TB: Alonso, Boxberger, Wood and Frazier for James Shields and Brandon Guyer
SD: Dave Sappelt and Josh Smith for Luke Gregerson
Injuries:
Aroldis Chapman, shoulder
Scott Rolen, shoulder
Jose Arredondo, shoulder
Logan Ondrusek, face?
Departures:
Kris Negron, waivers
Mgr., Red Reporter
"Bootsy, you're a superstar right?"
"Twinkle, twinkle, babble."
by RijoSaboCaseyWKRP on Nov 15, 2011 1:55 PM EST reply actions
Ramon Santiago and Kerry Wood make a lot of sense
that’s why they won’t happen :P
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
Dusty finally gets the chance
to finish off Kerry Wood.
by Joe Nolan's Neckbeard on Nov 15, 2011 3:56 PM EST up reply actions 4 recs
+Soto to the Shields deal
or someone.
Mgr., Red Reporter
"Bootsy, you're a superstar right?"
"Twinkle, twinkle, babble."
by RijoSaboCaseyWKRP on Nov 15, 2011 4:28 PM EST up reply actions
damn, Luke Gregerson, Kerry Wood, and Dontrelle Willis make one hell of a bullpen.
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
Zeros across the board
The Reds have no money and are talking to no one ©
Dayman, Fighter of the Nightman, Champion of the Sun
Anyone that is more familiar with BBRef know how I can
find leaderboards for individual players, by position, for Total Zone (2011 only)? I can only get it to show the top 5 in each league.
Let a man come in and do the Popcorn.
Crum-Bum Beat
Total Zone is a flawed statistic
"Wait, you think I'm being mean to the pretend orangutan?" -- battlekow
be that as it may, you didn't answer my question buttface.
Let a man come in and do the Popcorn.
Crum-Bum Beat
Question buttface?
You have a question buttface? What’s a question buttface?
by Charlie Scrabbles on Nov 15, 2011 3:16 PM EST up reply actions
Let a man come in and do the Popcorn.
Crum-Bum Beat
by -ManBearPig on Nov 15, 2011 3:18 PM EST up reply actions 3 recs
The Reds have released their spring training schedule
Also, opening day has been moved to Thursday. Thanks to the Marlins, who agreed to the change. Dunno how that worked. The players have to agree, and at this point, who knows who’ll be on the roster for that game.
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
I've been working on a training schedule for volunteers for spring semester here at work.
I didn’t notice until today that I titled it “spring training schedule.” I saw that in my recent documents list and my heart fluttered a little.
Anybody planning a trip to Goodyear this year?
by the finest muffins on Nov 15, 2011 4:05 PM EST up reply actions
I'm thinking about it
I’m not a decisive person, though, so I always end up making last-minute decisions.
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
Possibly
My father is probably going to fly out this year, and if he does, I’ll try to take a few days and join him for a couple of games. I’ve never been to Spring Training and I think that it would be fun.
by GreatAmericanRedsFan on Nov 15, 2011 4:33 PM EST up reply actions
OK, I'd like to fleece the Rays as much as the next guy
but that just doesn’t happen. Friedman knows what he’s doing pretty well.
FA: (bleh)
Jack Wilson – $1.5 million
CMM – $3.5 million AAV
Frank Francisco – $4 million AAV
Trade:
Alonso and Boxberger to A’s for Cahill, Craig Breslow, Bruce Billings
Bailey to Diamondbacks for JJ Putz and Wade Miley
Departure:
Kris Negron to whatever
Injuries:
Rolen (3rd week of season – back)
Frazier (fractured hand)
Bray (forearm sprain)
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
A trade with the As or one of several NL West teams for pitching
makes sense. My Shields trade is probably strictly wishful thinking. But they are supposedly looking for 1B, DH, RP.
Mgr., Red Reporter
"Bootsy, you're a superstar right?"
"Twinkle, twinkle, babble."
by RijoSaboCaseyWKRP on Nov 15, 2011 4:11 PM EST up reply actions
According to updated rules
Coco , FLewis, Renteria, and Dontrelle are departures as well, to FA.
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
I think he meant the moral character of this blog...
oh, wait.
Let a man come in and do the Popcorn.
Crum-Bum Beat
What are you referring to?
Are your comments being deleted? Is there a site error? Or is this a callback?
Mgr., Red Reporter
"Bootsy, you're a superstar right?"
"Twinkle, twinkle, babble."
by RijoSaboCaseyWKRP on Nov 15, 2011 4:12 PM EST up reply actions
He posted a hideous pic of a ginger "thing" which got deleted, and not he's complaining
"Wait, you think I'm being mean to the pretend orangutan?" -- battlekow
common, now
Let’s wait until we hear McQueary’s side of the story before we start with the name-calling.
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
by BubbaFan on Nov 15, 2011 4:32 PM EST up reply actions 5 recs
Game on, then
Mgr., Red Reporter
"Bootsy, you're a superstar right?"
"Twinkle, twinkle, babble."
by RijoSaboCaseyWKRP on Nov 15, 2011 4:24 PM EST up reply actions
I should mention
If you don’t put Cordero, Ramon or Willis in your FA list, you can get credit for him as a departure.
You should also make sure to include the names of any players you think will be non-tendered in your departure list.
Mgr., Red Reporter
"Bootsy, you're a superstar right?"
"Twinkle, twinkle, babble."
by RijoSaboCaseyWKRP on Nov 15, 2011 4:21 PM EST reply actions
Reds go all in
FA
Dontrelle – $2 mil AAV
Nick Punto – $1 mil AAV
Trades
HanRam (Marlins sign Reyes and are forced to sell a little low) for Bailey, Heisey, Henry Rodriguez, and David Vidal
James Shields for Alonso, Grandal, Cozart, and Frazier
Departures
Clutch Man Monie
Coco
Injuries
Scott Rolen – oldness/back
Hanigan – hand
Interesting pick on Punto
what sort of wizardry/sabotage do you have in mind to make that happen?
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
I thought the Cardinals already signed him to a contract
maybe I am wrong and will then accept being called an idiot for calling you out like this.
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
We're all wrong...
But I’m enjoying the back and forth over the whimsical trade ideas we all have. I’d love to be a real GM! (Of course, then I’d have to hear all of you belly-aching when I only got two Rays aces for Votto.)
Walt Jocketty is an isolationist.
We need the Diamondbacks to attack our training facilities in Goodyear. Maybe this will force our GM to enter into the battle for a championship.
by Joe Nolan's Neckbeard on Nov 15, 2011 7:34 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
Isolationist, or just leading from behind?
#DustyDoctrine
by Cuetotally Amazing on Nov 15, 2011 9:16 PM EST up reply actions
hrmm...
So the Reds have apparently inquired about Jair Jurrjens of the Braves.
Read down the comments a bit and you’ll find a Braves fan who’s interested in a Jurrjens for Heisey swap…and even references a Talking Chop conversation about him. Who knows what else it would involve, but if Walt manages to get Jurrjens without surrendering Alonso, Bailey, Wood, Grandal, Mesoraco, Frazier, END, or Volquez, he should be knighted. That would allow the Reds to go get a Shields type as well, and also let Sappelt/Frazier slide into the 4th OF role.
Tequila and pancakes, anyone?
by Kevin Mitchell is Batman on Nov 15, 2011 8:23 PM EST reply actions
GREAT SCOTT!
I’d imagine they’d also want one of the 3b/LF dudes (Chipper ain’t around for more than a couple more years, I reckon) and some sort of pitching depth…but yeah, that’d be nice.
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
Forget what I said about pitching depth, btw.
On the other hand, a GREAT challenge trade would be Delgado and Jurrjens for Alonso and Heisey.
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
I think they'd be interested in a lower level guy, like Corcino.
Heisey and Corcino for Jurrjens wouldn’t be too out of the question.
And yeah, if we could poach Delgado…schnikes!
Tequila and pancakes, anyone?
by Kevin Mitchell is Batman on Nov 15, 2011 8:31 PM EST up reply actions
I hereby volunteer to drive Juan Francisco to Atlanta if he's part of the deal
I’ll even let him choose what radio station we listen to.
"Wait, you think I'm being mean to the pretend orangutan?" -- battlekow
Driving down south
You’d likely/ appropriately hear something like this.
Wear something sexy to my funeral.
by Pops Daniels on Nov 16, 2011 12:41 PM EST up reply actions
This is going to happen
Departures
Cordero
Ramon
Signings
Willis 2 yr 4 mil
Trades
Jurrijens for Heisey, Corcino
Danks and Quentin for Volquez, Wood, Grandal, Alonso, Sappelt
I definitely think Sappelt and Grandal are the most likely to get traded of our prospects. With Alonso coming in at 3rd.
@DavefrmLville.....is fun to follow on twiiter!
by Dave from Louisville on Nov 15, 2011 9:55 PM EST reply actions
Quentin...?!
Tequila and pancakes, anyone?
by Kevin Mitchell is Batman on Nov 15, 2011 10:01 PM EST up reply actions
Quentin hitting between Votto and Bruce would be sick
in a good way. James projects him as .255/.343/.448 with 27 HRs
Cueto/Danks/Jurrijens/Arroyo/Bailey would be pretty damn solid. Willis and Leake as depth.
@DavefrmLville.....is fun to follow on twiiter!
by Dave from Louisville on Nov 15, 2011 10:29 PM EST up reply actions
Mike Leake is better than at least 2/5 of that rotation. Maybe more.
And Carlos Quentin is a more expensive Yonder Alonso. And we happen to already have Yonder Alonso.
It feels so nice to be back to normal
exactly.
Alonso/Heisey is better than Quentin, and they don’t cost $8 million bucks, aren’t injury prone, and neither is a year from being a FA.
Tequila and pancakes, anyone?
by Kevin Mitchell is Batman on Nov 15, 2011 10:35 PM EST up reply actions
2012 Quentin>2012 + 2013 Alonso
platoons suck (last 3 years as evidence) and this is Quentin’s walk year.
Mark it down-Quentin is a 4+ WAR player next year whether he’s on the Reds or not.
Why does noone else like trading for players in their walk year? Especially players with 4+ WAR potential.
Heisey = Chris Denorfia
@DavefrmLville.....is fun to follow on twiiter!
by Dave from Louisville on Nov 15, 2011 11:31 PM EST up reply actions
In a word
Fuck No.
Tequila and pancakes, anyone?
by Kevin Mitchell is Batman on Nov 15, 2011 11:33 PM EST up reply actions
as a side note
Heisey had more HR, RBI, and damn near hits last season than Denorfia had in his entire career.
Tequila and pancakes, anyone?
by Kevin Mitchell is Batman on Nov 15, 2011 11:36 PM EST up reply actions
1.5 vs. 1.6 WAR last year
Heisey = Denorfia but with a lower ceiling
Did you watch baseball in Jun and July last year? Heisey was the worst.
@DavefrmLville.....is fun to follow on twiiter!
by Dave from Louisville on Nov 15, 2011 11:42 PM EST up reply actions
Denorfia's almost 4 years older, too.
And yes, I watched every game.
Can I trade you a pair of 7’s for a 6-10 straight, too?
Tequila and pancakes, anyone?
by Kevin Mitchell is Batman on Nov 15, 2011 11:43 PM EST up reply actions
also
Denorfia’s posted roughly 4.5 WAR over 6 seasons, while Heisey’s put up 2.2 in 2 seasons.
Tequila and pancakes, anyone?
by Kevin Mitchell is Batman on Nov 15, 2011 11:50 PM EST up reply actions
Even if you don't like Heisey
it’s really tough to make the argument that Quentin is 16x better than Heisey is. Because that’s about how much more money he’s gonna make next year.
by Charlie Scrabbles on Nov 15, 2011 11:44 PM EST up reply actions
You guys think about money too much
We have a budget. Some players are cheap and good. Some players are cheap and suck. Then there are players who’s value on the field is comparable to their salary….and then there are albatrosses. The goal is to avoid players that suck and underperform.
Quentin has an 8 million salary next year and projects by Bill James to be worth about 15 million. That is a good use of resources.
@DavefrmLville.....is fun to follow on twiiter!
by Dave from Louisville on Nov 15, 2011 11:51 PM EST up reply actions
It isn't when you can get the same production for 1/16 the cost
Because then you can spend that $8 mil on getting a pitcher instead, which is what we really need.
by Charlie Scrabbles on Nov 15, 2011 11:54 PM EST up reply actions
I agree we need a pitcher first and foremost
But we do not have the internal talent to get 4+ WAR of LF.
This is also about getting a RH bat to protect Joey Votto in the 4 hole, Alonso can’t handle that and Heisey would probably hit 6th on the Louisville Bats.
@DavefrmLville.....is fun to follow on twiiter!
by Dave from Louisville on Nov 15, 2011 11:59 PM EST up reply actions
Your 4 WAR estimate is much higher than most anyone would project
Quentin hasn’t posted 4+ WAR since 2008. He’s also struggled with injuries and has never played more than 131 games. In both ’09 and ’10 he was basically a replacement player.
I understand you gotta thing for this fella, but I just don’t think he’s that good.
by Charlie Scrabbles on Nov 16, 2011 12:04 AM EST up reply actions
James has him improving on last year
and he was at 2.6 WAR (11+ milion)
Say it with me “CONTRACT YEAR”
@DavefrmLville.....is fun to follow on twiiter!
by Dave from Louisville on Nov 16, 2011 12:06 AM EST up reply actions
or you can have a guy who makes .5 million and is projected to be worth 15 million
and you can still afford to trade for James Shields.
I’m confused.
Tequila and pancakes, anyone?
by Kevin Mitchell is Batman on Nov 15, 2011 11:55 PM EST up reply actions
With a team like that we could win a WS!
With a payroll of 13.5 million with a projected value of 375 million we would beat everyone every year.
We need to make sure we trade all those guys for 3 or 4 AA prospects before they’re arb eligle….because that’s when they get expensive!
This is getting ridiculous
@DavefrmLville.....is fun to follow on twiiter!
by Dave from Louisville on Nov 16, 2011 12:04 AM EST up reply actions
no, it's not.
When Alonso is projected to have the same season as Quentin, and Alonso will be paid $400K and Quentin will be paid $8 million, it’s not ridiculous…
…it’s simple math.
Tequila and pancakes, anyone?
by Kevin Mitchell is Batman on Nov 16, 2011 12:06 AM EST up reply actions
Alonso does not project the same
@DavefrmLville.....is fun to follow on twiiter!
by Dave from Louisville on Nov 16, 2011 12:07 AM EST up reply actions
see Scrabbles' comment below.
Tequila and pancakes, anyone?
by Kevin Mitchell is Batman on Nov 16, 2011 12:08 AM EST up reply actions
Bill James projected wOBA for next season:
.346, .347, .351.
Which one is which? Trick question. Doesn’t matter. They are all the same.
by Charlie Scrabbles on Nov 16, 2011 12:07 AM EST up reply actions
I cna't wait until Quentin leads the 2012 WS Champion Reds
@DavefrmLville.....is fun to follow on twiiter!
by Dave from Louisville on Nov 16, 2011 12:09 AM EST up reply actions
all Bar Trivia was last night was 999 jokes and Sandusky jokes.
It was a pretty weak crowd.
"You said 'walks' twice."
"I like walks."
You think more highly of Leake than I do
Did he steal your heart?
@DavefrmLville.....is fun to follow on twiiter!
by Dave from Louisville on Nov 15, 2011 11:32 PM EST up reply actions
He's certainly better than Arroyo at this point, and more consistent than Bailey
I assume that’s the 2/5ths he was referring to
He has thrown over 300 innings of league average pitching before the age of 24.
He ain’t a star, but he’s a solid #3 pitcher. And we ain’t got many of those.
It feels so nice to be back to normal
I predict a Carlos Quentin trade as well
And I also think it would be sick. But not in the way you are thinking.
by Charlie Scrabbles on Nov 15, 2011 11:07 PM EST up reply actions
I agree, Carlos Quentin is something I think has a good chance of happening
for not too much of a good reason
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
I predict a Carlos Quentin trade as well
And I also think it would be sick. But not in the way you are thinking.
by Charlie Scrabbles on Nov 15, 2011 11:07 PM EST up reply actions
I predict a Carlos Quentin trade as well
And I also think it would be sick. But not in the way you are thinking.
by Charlie Scrabbles on Nov 15, 2011 11:07 PM EST up reply actions
don't be a hater X 3
Quentin and Danks would rock
@DavefrmLville.....is fun to follow on twiiter!
by Dave from Louisville on Nov 15, 2011 11:17 PM EST up reply actions
Has the site been weird for anyone else today?
No, it would not rock. As the other two totally radical and bodacious dudes said, Alonso and Heisey are a good bet to be just as good or better than Quentin. And cheaper.
Danks? Yeah, I could dig Danks if the price is right.
by Charlie Scrabbles on Nov 15, 2011 11:29 PM EST up reply actions
What do you think it would take to get Danks and Danks w/ Quentin?
@DavefrmLville.....is fun to follow on twiiter!
by Dave from Louisville on Nov 15, 2011 11:35 PM EST up reply actions
To get Danks?
Maybe Homer or Wood plus some secondary pieces. I dunno. With Kenny Williams you can never predict anything.
by Charlie Scrabbles on Nov 15, 2011 11:40 PM EST up reply actions
Danks would take a lot more than that I think
@DavefrmLville.....is fun to follow on twiiter!
by Dave from Louisville on Nov 15, 2011 11:54 PM EST up reply actions
I don't know
I’m struggling to think of a comparable pitcher who was traded recently. He has only one year of control remaining. Maybe Edwin Jackson? Danks is better than Jackson, but we know what teams got for Danks. With 1.5 years left, Jackson netted Daniel Hudson, which most people thought was a drastic overpay on the White Sox’ part.
So yeah, I don’t know. Cliff Lee brought back one good prospect and some secondary pieces with a year left on his deal, and Danks is not Lee. So yeah, I think my estimate is decent. But again, Kenny Williams is bonkers.
by Charlie Scrabbles on Nov 16, 2011 12:00 AM EST up reply actions
I sware to god everyone's favorite player on the Reds every year is a guy in the minors
Trade the prospects, win now.
@DavefrmLville.....is fun to follow on twiiter!
by Dave from Louisville on Nov 15, 2011 11:37 PM EST up reply actions
for Carlos Quentin?
Go get Carlos Lee while you’re at it. Sheesh.
Tequila and pancakes, anyone?
by Kevin Mitchell is Batman on Nov 15, 2011 11:38 PM EST up reply actions
'xactly
I’m all about cashing in these chips and playing the next two years with balls to the walls. Quentin just isn’t a very good baseball player though.
by Charlie Scrabbles on Nov 15, 2011 11:43 PM EST up reply actions
Word!
We’re blessed with an abundance of AAA/MLB level players. I’d rather overpay for a guy who we could control for a few years than try to low-ball a trade for a player who’s in his last year of control.
Tequila and pancakes, anyone?
by Kevin Mitchell is Batman on Nov 15, 2011 11:45 PM EST up reply actions
...or a player who sucks at playing baseball as much as Quentin does
by Charlie Scrabbles on Nov 15, 2011 11:46 PM EST up reply actions
Quentin doesn't suck
he’s a good hitter, who just happens to not be good at anything else.
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
So defensive! Also, you shouldn't sware. It's not nice.
If you read this site with any regularity I think you’ll find that pretty much everyone is cool with trading away some or a lot of the young talent for a big league upgrade, and for an attempt to “win now”.
The problem is, LF is probably 3rd or 4th on the list of team needs, and you are proposing to blow the team’s prospect wad on a guy who is, at best, a marginal upgrade. 4 WAR is never, ever happening. He’s too terrible at defense.
I don’t mind trading just about anyone, including Alonso, Meso, Grandal, Hamilton, Votto, whoever. But if we’re giving up major talent, I want someone much better than Carlos Quentin. Like Scrabbles keeps saying, he just isn’t that good.
It feels so nice to be back to normal
I predict a 450+ comment RR thread bemoaning the direction the franchise is going in, and I predict to Walt & Co. to never see that thread
"Wait, you think I'm being mean to the pretend orangutan?" -- battlekow
teh Fay
has a list of Redsfest guests.
Among those confirmed to attend FOX Sports Ohio Redsfest, presented by PNC on December 2-3 at Duke Energy Convention Center downtown are current players Yonder Alonso, Bronson Arroyo, Bill Bray, Jay Bruce, Aroldis Chapman, Zack Cozart, Todd Frazier, Chris Heisey, Jeremy Horst, Mike Leake, Sam LeCure, Devin Mesoraco, Logan Ondrusek, Scott Rolen (Friday only), Drew Stubbs, Chris Valaika, Joey Votto (Friday only) and Travis Wood.
Manager Dusty Baker and coaches Mark Berry, Brook Jacoby, Bryan Price, Chris Speier and Mike Stefanski; alumni Todd Benzinger, Jack Billingham, Tom Browning, Leo Cardenas, Clay Carroll, Eric Davis, Doug Flynn, George Foster, Wayne Granger, Chuck Harmon, Tommy Helms, Tracy Jones (Saturday only), Jim Maloney, Lee May, Ron Oester, Jim O’Toole, Ted Power, Chris Sabo and Mario Soto; top prospects Tucker Barnhart, Brad Boxberger, Yasmani Grandal, Billy Hamilton, Drew Hayes, Ryan LaMarre, Josh Smith; and broadcasters Jeff Brantley, Marty Brennaman, Thom Brennaman (Friday only), Jim Day, Jim Kelch, Jeff Piecoro and Chris Welsh…updated information can be found at www.reds.com/redsfest.
They promise more to come.
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
FOX Sports Ohio Redsfest
It damn well better be on TV if it’s called that.
That was a disgraceful performance, in my opinion. We threw that game, we gave it away. We gave them the fucking game. In my opinion, that sucked. What's that? Playoffs? Don't talk about--playoffs? You kidding me? Playoffs?! I just hope we can win a game!
I've changed my mind about trading for a player in the NL west
We should get that closer from the A’s, Billy Beane hasn’t won a trade in years.
@DavefrmLville.....is fun to follow on twiiter!
by Dave from Louisville on Nov 16, 2011 12:37 AM EST via iPhone app reply actions
This is silly talk
about Beane not winning trades
expectations are premeditated resentments - cheshirecat
Thanks Dave.
Your comments in this thread have saved me a bunch of time. Now I have no need to read the Fya’s comment section.
Wear something sexy to my funeral.
by Pops Daniels on Nov 16, 2011 8:51 AM EST up reply actions 3 recs
Elitist
@DavefrmLville.....is fun to follow on twiiter!
by Dave from Louisville on Nov 16, 2011 5:55 PM EST up reply actions
FA Signings -
Ludwick, Ryan; major league contract, $1.5m 1 yr
Counsell, Craig; minor league contract
OR
ALEX GONZALEZ!; 900k 1 yr
Trades -
ATL – Jurrjens, PTBNL CIN- Heisey, Corcino, Volquez
Departures -
Cordero
Renteria
Hernandez
twitter - MattAnderson19
by in_Votto_We_Trust on Nov 17, 2011 2:00 AM EST reply actions
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