Cactus League Game 9 Thread: White Sox at Reds
by Slyde on Mar 14, 2010 11:30 AM EDT
in Spring Training
Email
PrintMatt Maloney gets his first start of the spring today. He has pitched 2.1 innings so far, allowing 4 runs on 4 hits with 2 walks and 3 strikeouts. Nobody has really stepped up to take control in the 5th starter race (unless you consider Aroldis Chapman, Travis Wood, or Mike Leake legitimate candidates), so Maloney can still make his case with a couple of good outings. Following Maloney will be two other candidates for the spot, Justin Lehr and Kip Wells, along with Arthur Rhodes and Daniel Ray Herrera.
The Reds are also playing a "B" game this morning against the Indians. Aaron Harang will be starting and will be followed by Nick Masset and Jared Burton and a few others. There may not be any coverage of that game online, but I'd guess the tweeting beat writers will give us updates since there is no travel involved. That's why I've gone ahead and posted this thread early today. That game kicks off at noon ET.
Because I scheduled the thread early, I have no other information on the lineups and such. Please post them in the thread when you see them.The afternoon game versus the White Sox will be carried on 700WLW or you can follow along on Gameday.
175 comments
|
0 recs |
Do you like this story?
Comments
who's playing in that game?
The baseball-bat collision is violent and involves large forces which act over a very short time and which compress the ball to a fraction of its normal size. -- Alan M. Nathan
the cats would have been better off losing
then maybe they would have gotten duke’s cupcake bracket
Alway the optimist...I like your think kid...
and how is that the best team ends up a #2?
by Charlie Scrabbles on Mar 14, 2010 7:40 PM EDT up reply actions
The Fay has the lineups
B game vs. Indians (1 p.m. Cincinnati time)
Josh Anderson cf
Paul Janish ss
Laynce Nix lf
Juan Francisco 3b
Yonder Alonso 1b
Chris Burke 2b
Chris Heisey rf
Devin Mesoraco dh
Wilkin Castillo c
Aaron Harang p.
Harang will go four, followed by Arthur Rhodes, Jared Burton, Daniel Ray Herrera and Enerio Del Rosario for one each.
A game lineup vs. White Sox (4 p.m., WLW 700)
Drew Stubbs cf
Orlando Cabrera ss
Joey Votto 1b
Brandon Phillips dh
Scott Rolen 3b
Jay Bruce rf
Jonny Gomes lf
Ramon Hernandez c
Aaron Miles 2b
Matt Maloney p
Maloney is scheduled to go three, followed by one from Kip Wells, Justin Lehr, Sam LeCure and Jordan Smith.
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
I think Wood is a legitimate candidate
He may be a long shot but I think if he seriously out pitches Maloney and Lehr he will open up in Cincinnati. Wood has thrown more minor league inning than Cueto, and bare in mind that Cueto has only pitch 22 innings at AAA level. That being said I still think the spot is Maloney’s to lose given that he is older and has nothing left to prove at AAA and has reached the point in his career when he has to put up or shut up.
Volquez, Bailey, Cueto, Chapman, and Leake. The future is so bright I have to wear sunglasses.
you're such a big meanie head
It doesn't matter what you think, or what I think. It's what Dusty thinks that matters, and he's a knucklehead.
by PeteyHendrix on Mar 14, 2010 4:28 PM EDT up reply actions
I could be a day late, a dollar short
… I just got the chance late last night to see the Chapman performance against LaLa.
Seems to me that if the coaches can control his enthusiasm, he’s ready. That’s a pretty smooth delivery.
The baseball-bat collision is violent and involves large forces which act over a very short time and which compress the ball to a fraction of its normal size. -- Alan M. Nathan
END hit another HR in "B" game
That’s 3 in 2 days.
Red Reporter or follow on Twitter: @redreporter
by Slyde on Mar 14, 2010 2:03 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
E.N.D. getting hard to ignore
SSS,etc but:
Louisville (114 ABs): .351/.372/.605
Reds (25 PAs): .429/.520/.619
DWL (182 AB): .302/.352/.566
Spring 2010 (11 AB): .364/.417/1.000 and another HR today
Yeah, those guys and the Cincinnati Reds. They're a terrible football team. / Because they're a baseball team? / Exactly. You know who's the worst football team? The Philadelphia Flyers. - Best Show
by RijoSaboCaseyWKRP on Mar 14, 2010 2:06 PM EDT reply actions
3-0
Sounds like Harang is doing pretty good. I think he’s done.
Red Reporter or follow on Twitter: @redreporter
by Slyde on Mar 14, 2010 2:15 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
He had a 123 fourth inning, then pitched to extra hitters to get more work in
4 IP, no runs, a couple hits, couple walks, no idea on Ks
It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it. -Aristotle
all this technology
you would hope we could be up to date …
The baseball-bat collision is violent and involves large forces which act over a very short time and which compress the ball to a fraction of its normal size. -- Alan M. Nathan
I know comparables for END are completely unheard of
But I get good vibes nonetheless. His bat control has been impressive whenever I’ve seen him and I think he can hit for a fairly high average even if he only has minimal improvement in his strikeout and walk rates. I don’t think it’s out of the realm of possibility for him to turn into a pretty monstrous hitter. His power is off the chain, yo.
Here's my concern
there is very little scouting done in AA, probably in AAA too, and definitely not in DWL. In ST guys are just working on things, so they aren’t necessarily going after a hitter in a certain way.
I fear that after a month in the bigs, pitchers will realize he can’t hit nor layoff breaking balls out of the zone, and you’d see him strikeout about every third at bat, while never walking.
It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it. -Aristotle
talk about a confidence crusher!
The baseball-bat collision is violent and involves large forces which act over a very short time and which compress the ball to a fraction of its normal size. -- Alan M. Nathan
I could see that happening too
That said, I’ve gotta think that even if scouting isn’t remotely extensive in the minors, I’ve gotta think word probably gets around on a guy after a bit. Whether or not minor leaguers are capable of executing on a level to get him out is a completely different story, but I think they probably know that Juan Francisco is likely to hack at whatever they throw him. I dunno, I’ve just been impressed by the little bit I’ve seen of him so far. My current theory is he’s gonna strike out a solid 25-30% of the time in the majors, but he should be able to push his walk rate up a decent amount when pitchers start to respect his prodigious power and he gains some experience in laying off the breaking ball. I’m reminded of early-career Tony Batista, except Francisco doesn’t dabble in the middle infield and I think he’s got more power potential. Pitchers did seem to adjust to Batista (or he simply fell off a cliff for other reasons), but I think Juan can at least have a couple years of really blasting some homers in the majors as a starter.
Striking out 25 percent of the time
Why is this better than Taveras? I know we’re high on this kid’s potential and all of us are hoping he gets better.
There isn’t any proof that will happen, but I hope it does. In any case, if the Reds think this guy can improve, it would seem that they’d be working on that now. If they aren’t, I guess I wonder why they don’t think they are in a rush.
Maybe his walk rate will improve, which would instantly upgrade him over The Virus.
The baseball-bat collision is violent and involves large forces which act over a very short time and which compress the ball to a fraction of its normal size. -- Alan M. Nathan
Why are you comparing him to Taveras?
A 25% strikeout rate isn’t awful. Votto was close to 23% last year and he hit alright. Mark Reynolds had a great year and was at an almost unheard of 38.6%. Tons of great hitters strike out more than 30% of the time, pretty much all of them guys with big-time power, ala Francisco.
Taveras, Schmaveras
It came to mind. His strikeout rate doesn’t worry me. Getting on base the rest of the time is more important.
The baseball-bat collision is violent and involves large forces which act over a very short time and which compress the ball to a fraction of its normal size. -- Alan M. Nathan
Yeah, I get it, it's just that in his biggest sample size last year, AA, he only OBPed .317
His power was enough that he still was a good player, but I just think that an OBP of .317 won’t really play in the majors. Also, it’s a lot to ask of a guy to increase his walk rate in the bigs. If he can get the BB/K ration up to about .30 or .35 (it was .22 this year, a career high), he can be decent. And he’s only 22, so there’s hope he will.
I’m just saying as he is today, he wouldn’t be a very good MLBer.
It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it. -Aristotle
I'm not saying he's ready to do that right now.
He’s barely got any experience above the AA level, and though he’s been impressive, he should get some more time in the minors. But I think he’s been showing steady improvement in most facets of his game and he doesn’t turn 23 until the end of June. He’s got plenty of time to improve his discipline to a passable MLB level (and he’s not that far away from that with his other skills). I’m more concerned about his defense at 3B, actually. I’m reminded a little of Edwin in that regard, in that he appears to have all the tools to be a good 3B but can’t stop making ridiculous errors. If he moves to the OF or 1B, his bat doesn’t play as well and I’m a bit less confident in his ability to be a quality MLB regular.
His defense wouldn't play at 3B currently either
and we don’t know what to expect from him in the OF. But his recent numbers show that his power should translate to the majors. So if you can get him to lay off some pitches, he seems to be making good contact. The contact and marginal increase in BBs could make his OBP more tolerable. Taken with the prodigious power and arm (he has a good arm, right?), he could be very lucrative in LF within a year.
Yeah, those guys and the Cincinnati Reds. They're a terrible football team. / Because they're a baseball team? / Exactly. You know who's the worst football team? The Philadelphia Flyers. - Best Show
by RijoSaboCaseyWKRP on Mar 14, 2010 2:57 PM EDT up reply actions
Chicks dig the long ball
… getting this guy to lay off bad pitches is going to be how difficult? If at all?
He already knows the big contracts are not in taking a bunch of walks.
Seems like we have a bit of a problem. He can’t play third base, probably isn’t any good in the outfield, strikes out too much and can’t take a walk.
Um … define “prospect” in more general terms.
The baseball-bat collision is violent and involves large forces which act over a very short time and which compress the ball to a fraction of its normal size. -- Alan M. Nathan
He doesn't really strike out too much.
His strikeout rate isn’t bad by itself, it’s just not at all ideal when compared to his extremely low walk rate. We also don’t know that he can’t play 3B — he’s obviously not ML ready right now, but he’s still plenty young and many players who end up being great defenders start off by making a lot of errors. I don’t see any reason to conclude he probably isn’t any good in the outfield, either. He’s fairly athletic, his arm is strong, and a corner outfield spot isn’t that hard to pick up. He won’t be a plus in an outfield spot, but he’ll almost certainly be passable.
methinks
you have a pig in a poke and have it for sale.
The baseball-bat collision is violent and involves large forces which act over a very short time and which compress the ball to a fraction of its normal size. -- Alan M. Nathan
I will tell you what it means
You completely agreed with me on every single point but turned right around and said none of that mattered, since the guy could conceivably, possibly be taught to get better. Read what I wrote and what you replied. You are saying I am right about this, but that doesn’t matter because we will pretend something else.
That’s what is known as trying to sell a pig in a poke, a sack full of bullshit and a contrived set of warped data.
The baseball-bat collision is violent and involves large forces which act over a very short time and which compress the ball to a fraction of its normal size. -- Alan M. Nathan
FTR, he didn't agree with you, but still
the point is, with all of his shortcomings, a 22 year old with that much power is extremely rare, and it behooves the Reds to give this kid every chance to improve. If he can, he could be a great player. We’re talking top 5 or top 10 power in the entire minor leagues here.
It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it. -Aristotle
i would argue
top 3. Mike Stanton and who else?
by Charlie Scrabbles on Mar 14, 2010 3:18 PM EDT up reply actions
I'd say
Jesus Montero and Pedro Alvarez both have more practical power right now. (Maybe not raw power, but it’s showing up in games more for them)
But you’re right, probably not many others.
It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it. -Aristotle
He didn't?
Read it again.
The baseball-bat collision is violent and involves large forces which act over a very short time and which compress the ball to a fraction of its normal size. -- Alan M. Nathan
I don't want to get into this, but...
you said
He can’t play third base, probably isn’t any good in the outfield, strikes out too much and can’t take a walk.
and Geki said
He doesn’t really strike out too much…We also don’t know that he can’t play 3B… I don’t see any reason to conclude he probably isn’t any good in the outfield, either. He’s fairly athletic, his arm is strong, and a corner outfield spot isn’t that hard to pick up.
It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it. -Aristotle
Let's see here
His strikeout rate isn’t bad by itself, it’s just not at all ideal when compared to his extremely low walk rate.
Contriving data here … strikeout rate is bad, but only not as bad if we compare it to his low walk rate, meaning he strikes out too much and doesn’t get enough walks.
We also don’t know that he can’t play 3B — he’s obviously not ML ready right now, but he’s still plenty young and many players who end up being great defenders start off by making a lot of errors.
I agree that he might someday be a third baseman but for now, Geki agrees that he makes too many errors, but we can abide that because he is still “plenty” young. Yeah, and …?
I don’t see any reason to conclude he probably isn’t any good in the outfield, either. He’s fairly athletic, his arm is strong, and a corner outfield spot isn’t that hard to pick up. He won’t be a plus in an outfield spot, but he’ll almost certainly be passable.
No reason to conclude he can’t play OUT even though we concede that he won’t be a “plus” out there.
I’d say that’s agreement.
The baseball-bat collision is violent and involves large forces which act over a very short time and which compress the ball to a fraction of its normal size. -- Alan M. Nathan
OK
I think you are ‘contriving the data.’
Geki is saying he doesn’t K too much. If he keeps his current K rates, but walks more, he’s fine. That doesn’t mean he should K less, just walk more. Those are two different things.
You can’t look to much at minor league errors. Zach Cozart committed a ton of errors this season, and he’s considered a great defender at SS. The point is he’s got some work to to at 3B, but that doesn’t mean he can’t play it.
Just because someone isn’t “plus” at their position doesn’t mean they can’t play there. We know he won’t be Jay Bruce in a corner OF spot, but that doesn’t mean he’ll be Adam Dunn either. That’s what Geki is saying.
At the end of the day, we get it, you don’t like Francisco, but don’t twist what others are saying to make your point.
It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it. -Aristotle
sorry you overreacted
apparently Geki can’t explain his own posts.
I don’t dislike Francisco, and to be honest, couldn’t care less.
How any of this relates to Dunn, Bruce, Cozart or the Statue of Liberty escapes me.
Francisco strikes out too much and doesn’t take enough walks. That has been established.
He makes too many errors. That has been established. I didn’t contrive any of that data.
To whitewash it by saying, well compared to falling off the side of a tall building, it’s not all that bad.
I have no idea why I can’t look at minor league errors. Just because they are in the minors, they aren’t errors? Exactly how is a throwing error less or more an error in Chattanooga?
I have no reason to plus or minus END. I can say that if he hits .187 and plays defense like I would, you can say he still has a lot to learn.
Debate is interesting. Stay on the topic.
The baseball-bat collision is violent and involves large forces which act over a very short time and which compress the ball to a fraction of its normal size. -- Alan M. Nathan
Well
It hasn’t been established that he Ks too much. You are the only one saying that.
The reason you shouldn’t think too much about MILB errors is that, for one, the Carolina field is notoriously brittle and difficult, and two, guys can be expected to cut down on them as they grow and develop. The question is, how are his range and arm? His arm is great, range, hard to tell.
Again, no one is agreeing with you that he’d play defense poorly in LF either. He might, but we don’t know yet, and with his good arm, he could be pretty good.
It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it. -Aristotle
No disagreement on some of this
read back on my original post about getting him the help he needs to improve. All I am on record right now as believing is … if the guy has this many holes in his game, he’s much more of a suspect than a prospect.
I know he can hit a ball a long way. So could a lot of guys who ended up driving a truck.
I know the guy has some of the tools.
But I was a bit taken aback by the notion that everything I wrote was dismissed as wrong only because somebody rewrote the comments in a more passive way.
“He isn’t great at third base” isn’t much different from saying “he’s bad at third base,” now … is it?
The baseball-bat collision is violent and involves large forces which act over a very short time and which compress the ball to a fraction of its normal size. -- Alan M. Nathan
Well, I didn't dismiss your opinion as wrong. FTR, I'm not a believer in him yet either.
I just felt like you were misconstruing him and being a bit confrontational about it.
And yes, I think all of the 3B who are better than Edwin Encarnacion but not as good as Rolen would argue there’s a big difference between “not great” and “bad”.
It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it. -Aristotle
Debate
On a forum board often is misleading.
Let me finalize my thoughts:
I don’t think that the “we don’t know yet” attitude about this kid should be pretty well past us.
Sorry, but I believe that if we are still guessing about this guy, then I can explain in two words what is wrong with the Cincinnati Reds.
THEY’RE CLUELESS.
If that’s the case, I hazard on the side of being realistic … he can’t help this team until he can help this team. So far, he can hit home runs in spring training.
The baseball-bat collision is violent and involves large forces which act over a very short time and which compress the ball to a fraction of its normal size. -- Alan M. Nathan
Agreed,
see, wasn’t all of that silly?
It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it. -Aristotle
lets just never debate on this forum again!
ANd John is the master-debater!
Volquez, Bailey, Cueto, Chapman, and Leake. The future is so bright I have to wear sunglasses.
by justin007000 on Mar 14, 2010 4:19 PM EDT up reply actions
I disagree :-)
It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it. -Aristotle
don't
argue with your Granny.
The baseball-bat collision is violent and involves large forces which act over a very short time and which compress the ball to a fraction of its normal size. -- Alan M. Nathan
this does not address the weirdness question
but I think all of you folks are weird and I have the scratch marks to prove it.
The baseball-bat collision is violent and involves large forces which act over a very short time and which compress the ball to a fraction of its normal size. -- Alan M. Nathan
i was drunk and i'm sorry
Volquez, Bailey, Cueto, Chapman, and Leake. The future is so bright I have to wear sunglasses.
by justin007000 on Mar 14, 2010 4:24 PM EDT up reply actions
may the pigeons pick the flesh from your bones and leave them gleaning in the sun.
The baseball-bat collision is violent and involves large forces which act over a very short time and which compress the ball to a fraction of its normal size. -- Alan M. Nathan
nyc pretty much already said all that I would have anyways
But the kid is 22 and has already had a taste of success in the high minors/majors. He’s certainly not a sure thing, but if you find a prospect without any holes in his game, he’s not a prospect, he’s a major league superstar. His holes, at least to me, seem largely correctable. He obviously won’t ever have a great eye, but he doesn’t need to with his other skills. The kid just destroys the ball, he’s been trending upward for the past several years in the minors, and he’s plenty young. There are plenty of questions, but to call him a non-prospect is just ridiculous.
he's prospective
that is exactly what I said. Aren’t you happy you and I agreed on this?
The baseball-bat collision is violent and involves large forces which act over a very short time and which compress the ball to a fraction of its normal size. -- Alan M. Nathan
I believe you used the term "suspect"
whereas I, on the other hand, think Juan Francisco is off the chain. I do not agree.
i feel like suspect really shouldn't be used for people with talent
Justin Lehr was a suspect last year.
Volquez, Bailey, Cueto, Chapman, and Leake. The future is so bright I have to wear sunglasses.
by justin007000 on Mar 14, 2010 4:31 PM EDT up reply actions
Old people are not weird.
The baseball-bat collision is violent and involves large forces which act over a very short time and which compress the ball to a fraction of its normal size. -- Alan M. Nathan
why not RF?
aside from the obvious, i mean. he could end up drawing some pretty convincing Vlad Guerrero comparisons with his arm in RF.
by Charlie Scrabbles on Mar 14, 2010 3:11 PM EDT up reply actions
how did Willy Moe Pena do at laying off bad pitches?
Volquez, Bailey, Cueto, Chapman, and Leake. The future is so bright I have to wear sunglasses.
by justin007000 on Mar 14, 2010 3:31 PM EDT up reply actions
he's not with the Reds now, so ... does it matter?
The baseball-bat collision is violent and involves large forces which act over a very short time and which compress the ball to a fraction of its normal size. -- Alan M. Nathan
i'm just saying it isn't always easy to just teach a guy to lay of bad pitches
Volquez, Bailey, Cueto, Chapman, and Leake. The future is so bright I have to wear sunglasses.
by justin007000 on Mar 14, 2010 3:34 PM EDT up reply actions
then I guess he doesn't make the bigs
The baseball-bat collision is violent and involves large forces which act over a very short time and which compress the ball to a fraction of its normal size. -- Alan M. Nathan
I will say that I hope Juan Francisco makes it
but I am weary to death of reading still another long spring training documentary on how still another potentially great baseball player is in our midst.
The baseball-bat collision is violent and involves large forces which act over a very short time and which compress the ball to a fraction of its normal size. -- Alan M. Nathan
Also
Wlad quietly had a pretty good first week of spring. If he could approximate his numbers in the minors, you’d have power, decent on-base skills and probably acceptable defense in the OF.
Yeah, those guys and the Cincinnati Reds. They're a terrible football team. / Because they're a baseball team? / Exactly. You know who's the worst football team? The Philadelphia Flyers. - Best Show
by RijoSaboCaseyWKRP on Mar 14, 2010 3:12 PM EDT up reply actions
I still think he should be the everyday LFer
but with the Gomes signing it ain’t gonna happen.
It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it. -Aristotle
The Gomes signing complicates matters
Balentien and Dickerson might spend most of their time on the bench, though in my mind they can provide more value than anyone of the team save for Votto, Bruce or BP. Stubbs is a difficult case. His bat could go cold in the first half and deep-six the team. His and Heisey’s performance will go a long way in determining who gets traded.
It’s a big leap from wishing McDonald off the team and complaining that Nix isn’t playing cuz he hit some doubles in May.
Yeah, those guys and the Cincinnati Reds. They're a terrible football team. / Because they're a baseball team? / Exactly. You know who's the worst football team? The Philadelphia Flyers. - Best Show
by RijoSaboCaseyWKRP on Mar 14, 2010 3:33 PM EDT up reply actions
and by "who gets traded"
I mean Wlad, C-Dick, Gomes or Heisey.
Yeah, those guys and the Cincinnati Reds. They're a terrible football team. / Because they're a baseball team? / Exactly. You know who's the worst football team? The Philadelphia Flyers. - Best Show
by RijoSaboCaseyWKRP on Mar 14, 2010 3:37 PM EDT up reply actions
Agreed,
Since last year, we were pissed that Gomes was sent to AAA and McFlurry was the opening day starter, and this year if Wlad is on the bench, it’s because a legit major leaguer is in LF.
Much better situation.
It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it. -Aristotle
Is Gomes getting to see righties?
Seems we knew he could hit lefthanders but against righties, not so clear. He’s been crushing the ball so far this spring so I am hoping that means something.
The baseball-bat collision is violent and involves large forces which act over a very short time and which compress the ball to a fraction of its normal size. -- Alan M. Nathan
he showed signs last season of hitting righties better
but given his defensive liabilities, I’d probably rather see CDick in LF against righties anyway.
It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it. -Aristotle
Not sure how this helps
Do we need a better left fielder against righties than we do against lefties?
The baseball-bat collision is violent and involves large forces which act over a very short time and which compress the ball to a fraction of its normal size. -- Alan M. Nathan
not sure what you mean
but I’m saying that even if Gomes hits righties better, CDick will probably hit them about the same while playing much better defense.
I’m OK with a LF platoon with those two, but I’d still prefer Wlad.
It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it. -Aristotle
He plays pretty good defense in LF, has the most upside of any of the 3 candidates
and has huge power potential. Obviously I wouldn’t anoint him no matter what, all season, but I’d give him 2 months playing there everyday to see what he could do.
I think he’s the best bet of the 3 to be significantly above average in LF.
It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it. -Aristotle
quite possibly
we’re talking about a guy who hit .291/.362/.509 in AAA as a 22/23 year old. He’s got a lot of power, and has cut down on his Ks and walks a lot (and plays pretty good LF defense)
He’ll only be 25 to start the year. I’m not saying it WILL happen, but I’d really like to see him get a shot.
It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it. -Aristotle
classic case of rushing a guy up, burning his options, and then giving up on him
if you look at his game logs last season, he was striking out a TON and not walking in Seattle, then got to Cincy and turned it around quite a bit. Normally you’d say that’s an aberration, but what he did in Cincy is much closer to his minor league averages.
It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it. -Aristotle
Platoon is fine with me
The baseball-bat collision is violent and involves large forces which act over a very short time and which compress the ball to a fraction of its normal size. -- Alan M. Nathan
The division of labor is probably going to piss us off
But Gomes plays 30% of the time in LF, Wlad could take about 40% and Dickerson could take 30% in LF and 10-20% in CF. That would get decent mileage out of all three and play to their strengths.
The key is Stubbs not sucking (alongside Bruce not sucking). Because Stubbs is going to play regardless – and he needs to play fulltime. And if he can figure it out, his upside is high – excellent defense, speed and a little power. 3-5 WAR isn’t out of the question.
Yeah, those guys and the Cincinnati Reds. They're a terrible football team. / Because they're a baseball team? / Exactly. You know who's the worst football team? The Philadelphia Flyers. - Best Show
by RijoSaboCaseyWKRP on Mar 14, 2010 3:45 PM EDT up reply actions
I think 5 is
3.5-4 is probably his absolute ceiling.
It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it. -Aristotle
Got a little carried away maybe
But what would a full season (650-700 PAs) of .275/.355/.450 , 20+ steals and first-rate CF defense mean? I think that’s very reachable for him, though it may happen over PAs from July 2010-2010, rather than April-September of 2010.
Yeah, those guys and the Cincinnati Reds. They're a terrible football team. / Because they're a baseball team? / Exactly. You know who's the worst football team? The Philadelphia Flyers. - Best Show
by RijoSaboCaseyWKRP on Mar 14, 2010 3:52 PM EDT up reply actions
UZR is tricky
but that’d probably be about 4 WAR I guess. and I do think the slash line you put up is his absolute, perfect world ceiling.
It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it. -Aristotle
If his defense is as good as he showed last year
and as good as scouts have advertised, a slash line like that would almost certainly be a WAR over 5. If he manages to put up a Nyjer Morgan/Franklin Gutierrez type year defensively while hitting for that slash line, he’d be a 6+ WAR player pretty easily. I’d agree that hitting like that is his ceiling, but if he does he’s gonna put up huge WAR numbers.
True, I'm just assuming that UZR numbers tend towards the middle the longer you play
As in, it’s easier to be +15 in 50 games than it is in 150
Obviously that’s not always the case, but it seems tough to put up +15 or 20 runs over a full season.
It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it. -Aristotle
If Stubbs sucks, then things get really muddy
How long do you let him play? Do you start giving Dickerson more time there? Chris Heisey? Who is Josh Anderson? How does Dickerson factor into LF? If he becomes primarily a CF, does Wlad platoon or does he start fulltime? Do you bring someone up?
Stubbs really is the central figure to the team’s success this year, Bruce notwithstanding.
Yeah, those guys and the Cincinnati Reds. They're a terrible football team. / Because they're a baseball team? / Exactly. You know who's the worst football team? The Philadelphia Flyers. - Best Show
by RijoSaboCaseyWKRP on Mar 14, 2010 3:49 PM EDT up reply actions
I don't know
that’s assuming Stubbs will play everyday no matter what, which, given Dusty’s history isn’t a terrible assumption.
But still, there are other good options for CF if Stubbs blows it. I think Dickerson or Heisey could be worth 2-3 WAR there this season too. The question is, how long would Stubbs be allowed to suck?
It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it. -Aristotle
I wonder
The Reds are probably planning to platoon Gomes and Dickerson in LF.
But assuming they keep Wladdy, that leaves them with only Dickerson as a backup CFer. Not sure they’d go with that. I think that was the reason they went with Nix and McFlurry out of spring training last year – they wanted backup OFers who could play CF.
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
do you really need 3 CFers?
and besides, Bruce could play there in a pinch.
I hope they don’t keep Nix or Anderson (God forbid) just to have 3 CFers on the team.
It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it. -Aristotle
I dunno
I’m just saying…the Reds cut Gomes last year, apparently because they wanted players who could handle CF. And they had Bruce and Dickerson last year, too.
They do have Heisey this year, which could make them more willing to go with corner OFers as backups.
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
Taveras was out sick for the first couple days of last season
That was supposedly the reason McFlurry made the team, though I think it was more of a Dusty Baker charity call-up than anything else.
can wlad come out of ST not on the 25-man roster?
does he have options?
Running out to frontyard laughing! -Fat Vegas Alan
He's out of options
Yeah, those guys and the Cincinnati Reds. They're a terrible football team. / Because they're a baseball team? / Exactly. You know who's the worst football team? The Philadelphia Flyers. - Best Show
by RijoSaboCaseyWKRP on Mar 14, 2010 3:41 PM EDT up reply actions
nope
that’s how we got him from Seattle. They put him on waivers because they couldn’t option him
It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it. -Aristotle
I thought they traded Mehmet Manuel for him?
yup, thats what happened
I think that’s gonna look really stupid for the Mariners. You don’t trade outfielders for relievers generally, and certainly not for mediocre relievers
"And then there was the USAID guy in Kandahar who drove a giant pink Cadillac, which the locals set on fire one day. If you wanted to destroy something symbolic during a riot, you just could not do better than that. Good stuff." - Ghosts of Alexander
well
they put Wladdy on waivers because they were fed up with him, and the Reds offered Manuel for him. im sure they got a few offers for him, but it was either trade him or lose him to waivers.
by Charlie Scrabbles on Mar 14, 2010 7:26 PM EDT up reply actions
Let's not get too selective
OBP by month for END:
.363 in June
.320 in August
.400 in August
.373 in September (minors)
This was due to high batting averages, but I think his bad first two months really pulled everything else down, the bulk being at AA (thus the .317). He was new to AA and he adjusted well, and kept it going. If he hits a bad spell in the bigs, maybe he can adjust with good support from the staff/film/etc.. I think people are treating him like he is approaching a ledge. I don’t have a problem with hearing trade offers, nor for anyone else, but we should appreciate how extremely successful he has been so far.
Yeah, but for a big chunk of the year, his AVG. (which drove his OBP) was driven by an unsustainable BABIP
I think END is one of those guys who will always have a higher than usual BABIP, since he crushes the ball, but it was over .400 in AAA.
That said, if he can OPS over .830 in AAA for a few months, I’ll be more of a believer. (He only OPSed .818 in AA last season. Not bad at all, but not amazing either)
It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it. -Aristotle
A guy I know who pitched in the SL last year
said END was in for some trouble if he didn’t tighten up his strike zone. So this comes from a pro pitcher. Now he’s not the end-all-be-all for knowledge but he knew more about this than I did.
The baseball-bat collision is violent and involves large forces which act over a very short time and which compress the ball to a fraction of its normal size. -- Alan M. Nathan
I know it doesn't mean much
but it’d be nice if our #1, #3 and #4 hitters this season weren’t hitting .063, .067 and .000
Yeah, those guys and the Cincinnati Reds. They're a terrible football team. / Because they're a baseball team? / Exactly. You know who's the worst football team? The Philadelphia Flyers. - Best Show
by RijoSaboCaseyWKRP on Mar 14, 2010 4:06 PM EDT reply actions
thanks
i am in the airport so i can’t listen. I appreciate that.
Volquez, Bailey, Cueto, Chapman, and Leake. The future is so bright I have to wear sunglasses.
by justin007000 on Mar 14, 2010 4:14 PM EDT up reply actions
He's an RBI man!
It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it. -Aristotle
how did he learn to be that?
The baseball-bat collision is violent and involves large forces which act over a very short time and which compress the ball to a fraction of its normal size. -- Alan M. Nathan
awesome!
Volquez, Bailey, Cueto, Chapman, and Leake. The future is so bright I have to wear sunglasses.
by justin007000 on Mar 14, 2010 4:16 PM EDT up reply actions
i don't like the storms that are forming around richmond
Volquez, Bailey, Cueto, Chapman, and Leake. The future is so bright I have to wear sunglasses.
sorry that was supposed to not go here,
Volquez, Bailey, Cueto, Chapman, and Leake. The future is so bright I have to wear sunglasses.
by justin007000 on Mar 14, 2010 4:19 PM EDT up reply actions
wasn't*
good lord
Volquez, Bailey, Cueto, Chapman, and Leake. The future is so bright I have to wear sunglasses.
by justin007000 on Mar 14, 2010 4:19 PM EDT up reply actions
go away
Volquez, Bailey, Cueto, Chapman, and Leake. The future is so bright I have to wear sunglasses.
by justin007000 on Mar 14, 2010 4:27 PM EDT up reply actions
how 'bout that nail in the coffin from Wall?
you could say it was almost Turner-esque. almost.
by Charlie Scrabbles on Mar 14, 2010 4:36 PM EDT up reply actions
Evan Turner is the national player of the year. Hands down.
John Wall may not even be the best player on his team.
"Red Reporter - An elitist clique full of like-minded douchebags." - BK
so my flight crew just walked up to the gate
and are shocked that the plane isn’t at the gate, and they are trying to figure out where it is…
Volquez, Bailey, Cueto, Chapman, and Leake. The future is so bright I have to wear sunglasses.
no, not the missing plane fiasco again.
The baseball-bat collision is violent and involves large forces which act over a very short time and which compress the ball to a fraction of its normal size. -- Alan M. Nathan
Volquez, Bailey, Cueto, Chapman, and Leake. The future is so bright I have to wear sunglasses.
by justin007000 on Mar 14, 2010 4:27 PM EDT up reply actions
Glodglove team leader
Volquez, Bailey, Cueto, Chapman, and Leake. The future is so bright I have to wear sunglasses.
by justin007000 on Mar 14, 2010 4:23 PM EDT up reply actions
Rolen planned that play
he wanted Maloney to work on his pick off move.
TEAM LEADER!!!
Volquez, Bailey, Cueto, Chapman, and Leake. The future is so bright I have to wear sunglasses.
by justin007000 on Mar 14, 2010 4:24 PM EDT up reply actions
Joey Votto is still good
Joey Votto is still good
Joey Votto is still good
Joey Votto is still good
Joey Votto is still good
Yeah, those guys and the Cincinnati Reds. They're a terrible football team. / Because they're a baseball team? / Exactly. You know who's the worst football team? The Philadelphia Flyers. - Best Show
by RijoSaboCaseyWKRP on Mar 14, 2010 4:26 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
nice work Matty
Volquez, Bailey, Cueto, Chapman, and Leake. The future is so bright I have to wear sunglasses.
by justin007000 on Mar 14, 2010 4:29 PM EDT up reply actions
Is Maloney supposed to pitch 3 innings today?
Volquez, Bailey, Cueto, Chapman, and Leake. The future is so bright I have to wear sunglasses.
by justin007000 on Mar 14, 2010 4:34 PM EDT up reply actions
Miles breaks into ST with a backwards K
It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it. -Aristotle
Owings hurt his back when he feel on cement wearing his spikes
Volquez, Bailey, Cueto, Chapman, and Leake. The future is so bright I have to wear sunglasses.
magical early season DL to give Maloney a look-see?
I think so
"And then there was the USAID guy in Kandahar who drove a giant pink Cadillac, which the locals set on fire one day. If you wanted to destroy something symbolic during a riot, you just could not do better than that. Good stuff." - Ghosts of Alexander
If that's like falling on your back on a front step covered in ice
I sympthathize. That shit hurts.
by Brendanukkah on Mar 14, 2010 9:49 PM EDT up reply actions
Bring on train talk
Volquez, Bailey, Cueto, Chapman, and Leake. The future is so bright I have to wear sunglasses.
by justin007000 on Mar 14, 2010 4:40 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
And I think he's done for the day
It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it. -Aristotle
Jo-eh!
Ground rule double!
It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it. -Aristotle
Bruce
a real RBI man
It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it. -Aristotle
2-3 today
I love it that he’s so good at hitting lefties
It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it. -Aristotle
igreat to hear
to hear that he is 2-3. Actually I just flipped on the radio (first chance I got) a few mins ago and heard him get a single. Then Phillips walked, even in spring training, the bases loaded 2 out situation gets your adrenaline going a bit.
The Browns just traded Brady Quinn for a sack of baseballs
and have signed Jake Delhomme to be their starting quarterback.
great organization they’re running up there…
Delhomme with two broken legs > Healthy Brady Quinn
"Red Reporter - An elitist clique full of like-minded douchebags." - BK
silly Browns
What are they going to do with a sack of baseballs?
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
Throw them at Brady Quinn as he walks through the airport.
"Red Reporter - An elitist clique full of like-minded douchebags." - BK
Wait, really?
That Jake Delhomme? Good lord.
by Brendanukkah on Mar 14, 2010 9:50 PM EDT up reply actions
Are you calling him an oreo?
THAT’S RACIST!
"People don't kill people. Burning oreo packages kill people."
are they playing extras?
Or just calling it a tie?
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
Comments For This Post Are Closed
Secondary Sidebar
User Tools
FanPosts
Community blog posts and discussion.
Recommended FanPosts
Recent FanPosts
In Association With
Big League Stew - MLB - Yahoo! Sports
- Josh Hamilton on public relapse: ‘It was just wrong. That’s all it comes down to.’
- Photo: The Marlins’ ridiculous-looking home run sculpture is almost complete
- Yankees GM Brian Cashman lures alleged stalker into police dragnet
- Report: Josh Hamilton had a relapse with alcohol
- Happy Birthday Boy! Wes Ferrell, the best-hitting pitcher of all-time, would be 104
Certain photos copyright © 2012 by Associated Press or Getty Images. Any commercial use or distribution without the express written consent of Associated Press and Getty Images is strictly prohibited.
