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Around SBN: NFL Owners Vote to Change Trade Deadline

Hot Stove League Rankings: Short Stop

For your consideration, a companion piece to riverfront76's BAFTA, Cable Ace and Darwin Award-nominated Compare & Contrast series. Here we look forward to 2011 at the handful of positions in which the Reds have potential openings to fill during the off-season and may tap a fresh face as Opening Day starter, whether by free agency, trade or promotion from within.

I'll be returning to this list throughout the offseason to add /drop players and  provide a range of salary and trade bounty estimates as we know more about the Reds' payroll and the league-wide market. That information will effectively eliminate some names from the list.

Ranking explained: This list only ranks players on their projected value in 2011 and that projected value is based on my own guesswork, biases, and deep-seated resentments. This ranking will probably fluctuate when the off-season projections start dropping. Some of these guys may have residual value tied up in being under team control for additional years, but the only thing I've considered at this stage is how much each possible acquisition might improve the Reds chances to return to the playoffs in the next year, while not somehow starting to hurt its chances starting in '12. Zach Cozart has shown promise at the position, but is not currently expected to be much of a factor for the big league team next season. Juan Uribe may be asking for more money and years than the Reds can afford, but he's still likely to be an upgrade over Janish or Cabrera. A better sense of Uribe's asking price and the Reds cash-on-hand could bump him down a few spots.

Criteria: Gotta be a free agent or have modicum of buzz  - in a halfway reputable news source -  as a candidate to switch teams this off-season via trade, declined option or possible non-tender. Jose Reyes, for example, is not currently on this list because there is nothing yet to suggest his option won't be picked up. Derek Jeter also is not on this list anywhere.

Current Standings:

After the jump.

Star-divide

Rank Name June 2011 Age Contract Details 2010 slash line 2010 WAR 2010 Value ($) Average value, last 3 yrs ($)
1 Stephen Drew 28
Arb-eligible .272/.332/.448 (633 PA)
5.1
$20.5M $13.3M
2 Hiroyuki Nakajima
28
EDIT: MLBTR reports Nakajima will not be posted .309/.398/.493 (560 AB)
N/A
N/A N/A
3 Jason Bartlett
31
Arb-eligible .254/.324/.350 (532 PA)
0.7
$2.8M
$11.0M
4 Juan Uribe 31
FA .248/.310/.440 (575 PA)
3.2
$12.9M
$8.83M
5 Sean Rodriguez 26
Pre-arb .251/.308/.397 (378 PA)
1.9
$7.6M
N/A
6 JJ Hardy 28
Arb-eligible
.268/.320/.394 (375 PA)
2.4
$9.5M
$12.5M
7 Paul Janish
28
Pre-arb .260/.338/.385 (228 PA)
1.0
$3.9M
N/A
8 Marco Scutaro 35
$5M in '11, $6M club option/$3M player option ($1.5M buyout) in '12
.275/.333/.388 (695 PA)
2.1
$8.6M
$13.8M
9 Miguel Tejada 37 FA .269/.312/.381 (681 PA) 1.3
$5.3M
$10.8M
10 Orlando Cabrera 36
$4M mutual option ($1M buyout of player exercises and club declines, $0.5M buyout if player declines) .263/.303/.354 (537 PA)
1.3
$5.4M $8.23M
10(T)* Everth Cabrera 24
Pre-arb
.208/.279/.278
-0.1
N/A
N/A

 

* Because they have the same last name.

Also receiving votes: Cristian Guzman, Brandon Wood, Ryan Theriot, Edgar Renteria. This fraternity of shortstops could yield an affordable platoon player, back-up or Cinderella.

Analysis: To my mind, this all boils down to Value Above Janish (popularly known as VAJ). If the Reds can afford someone who's a noticeable upgrade on Janish, and better yet, young, with upside - they should do it. But that's a small universe: if the Reds don't land someone in the Top Six here, it's probably not worth the effort. Playing Cabrera over Janish, even at $2MM, is a downgrade, while chasing someone like Scutaro is a lateral move at best, given age and salary.

If the Reds are going to take on more salary at SS, it should pay for a reasonable improvement over Paul Janish, while not hampering the overall improvement of the team in the near future. Uribe could easily be a win or two more productive than Janish, but if his salary precludes a bigger potential improvement in LF and/or ties up money needed to pay the first year of a contract extension, it's probably not worth it.

Comment 64 comments  |  0 recs  | 

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Winter Meetings: Want/Have

Dec 2010 by RijoSaboCaseyWKRP - 276 comments

Comments

Display:

not sure I'd rank Nakajima that high

Too much of a question mark, not to mention the posting fee. It’s not clear he can stick at SS in MLB.

Renteria’s stock is probably heading up, with his postseason performance.

All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?

by BubbaFan on Oct 29, 2010 12:38 PM EDT reply actions  

I haven't really considered the posting fees/salary asks yet

but your point is well taken. I’ve heard he could be more of a 2B, but he supposed to be good defensively and hits to the whole field.

At any rate, he could be headed down the rankings. He’s not really an option for the Reds, but this list should give everyone a sense of “the field.”

Need the number of that store where they make ceramics in an oven made out of damaged circus supplies. It's called Rumpled Stilts Kiln. - Jon Wurster

by RijoSaboCaseyWKRP on Oct 29, 2010 12:42 PM EDT up reply actions  

Whoops!

No one expects the 12:30 Reposter. Feel free to run it whenever. I’ve had this in the works for a while, but it’s my opening volley.

Need the number of that store where they make ceramics in an oven made out of damaged circus supplies. It's called Rumpled Stilts Kiln. - Jon Wurster

by RijoSaboCaseyWKRP on Oct 29, 2010 12:55 PM EDT up reply actions  

and you say you don't like DMB ;-)

see what I did there with uzr? it’s like a LOL cats saber-pun combo.--Verka Serduchka

by nycredsfan on Oct 29, 2010 1:37 PM EDT up reply actions  

hey

did i say my hat was backwards? did i?

by Charlie Scrabbles on Oct 29, 2010 2:06 PM EDT up reply actions  

I can just tell

It also probably says “Gamecocks” or “Beavers” too

see what I did there with uzr? it’s like a LOL cats saber-pun combo.--Verka Serduchka

by nycredsfan on Oct 29, 2010 3:17 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

actually, mine says "Ping"

i likes my double entendre hats, but not the overplayed, obvious ones.

by Charlie Scrabbles on Oct 29, 2010 3:27 PM EDT up reply actions  

I'm just sad no one's wearing two polo shirts at once any more

What I’m I going to do with all these polo shirts I sewed together? And embroidered “Two at once, bitch” on?

Need the number of that store where they make ceramics in an oven made out of damaged circus supplies. It's called Rumpled Stilts Kiln. - Jon Wurster

by RijoSaboCaseyWKRP on Oct 29, 2010 3:30 PM EDT up reply actions  

Give them to Raven Riley, duh.

"just a couple of weeks ago a first year student in my program told me i was charming and charismatic, it was a guy, but the point still stands.: -- justin007000

by jch24 on Oct 29, 2010 3:44 PM EDT up reply actions  

YYEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

"just a couple of weeks ago a first year student in my program told me i was charming and charismatic, it was a guy, but the point still stands.: -- justin007000

by jch24 on Oct 29, 2010 4:09 PM EDT up reply actions  

Hope you don't mind, I also flipped the collars

Bart: "Dad, what's a Muppet?"
Homer: "Well, it's not quite a mop, not quite a puppet, but man... (laughs, then pauses) So, to answer you question, I don't know."

by ChiDa on Oct 29, 2010 4:50 PM EDT up reply actions  

What does SONAR and networking commands have to do with anything? ;)

"just a couple of weeks ago a first year student in my program told me i was charming and charismatic, it was a guy, but the point still stands.: -- justin007000

by jch24 on Oct 29, 2010 3:44 PM EDT up reply actions  

AND

Now MLBTR is saying he won’t be posted. So he’s probably off the list entirely.

Need the number of that store where they make ceramics in an oven made out of damaged circus supplies. It's called Rumpled Stilts Kiln. - Jon Wurster

by RijoSaboCaseyWKRP on Oct 29, 2010 12:44 PM EDT up reply actions  

Forgive a stupid question, but

what does “post” mean in this context. I don’t think I’ve ever seen that before.

by the finest muffins on Oct 29, 2010 6:31 PM EDT up reply actions  

it's a Japanese thing

It’s explained here.

Basically, it’s a way Japanese teams can get compensation for losing their players to MLB (and a way players can come here before they’re free agents in Japan). A player may be “posted” by his team, and MLB teams must bid for the right to talk to him.

The Red Sox notoriously bid $51,111,111.11 to talk to Daisuke Matsuzaka. (Yes, really. They must spend too much time on eBay.)

All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?

by BubbaFan on Oct 29, 2010 6:43 PM EDT up reply actions  

Matsuzaka

got a $52 million contract. That’s in addition to the posting fee paid to his team. To get him to sign for that amount, the Sox agreed to pay for several members of his entourage. A translator, a masseuse, a trainer, etc. Also a bunch of first class tickets to Japan, tickets to games, use of a car, a housing allowance, etc.

Matsuzaka’s posting fee was shockingly high. Nakajima wouldn’t be as expensive. Still…for a team on a budget, having to pay a posting fee as well as a salary is not ideal.

All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?

by BubbaFan on Oct 29, 2010 7:00 PM EDT up reply actions  

Out of curiousity, how much was paid for Ichiro?

"just a couple of weeks ago a first year student in my program told me i was charming and charismatic, it was a guy, but the point still stands.: -- justin007000

by jch24 on Oct 29, 2010 7:11 PM EDT up reply actions  

$13,125,000

According to the Wikipedia link above.

by the finest muffins on Oct 29, 2010 7:13 PM EDT up reply actions  

links are for suckas :)

Hard to believe Dice-K went for almost four times as much.

"just a couple of weeks ago a first year student in my program told me i was charming and charismatic, it was a guy, but the point still stands.: -- justin007000

by jch24 on Oct 29, 2010 7:15 PM EDT up reply actions  

it was

three times the payroll of his entire team.

No one expected it to be that high. The Sox really, really wanted him. The Mets bid $40 million, the Yanks $30 million.

They really did think he was going to be a stud. Also, he was younger than the usual Japanese player, because he started at such a young age.

All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?

by BubbaFan on Oct 29, 2010 7:34 PM EDT up reply actions  

Gotta remember that Ichiro was the first position layer to come over

A lot of people doubted he’d make it. Daisuke also benefitted from the WBC exposure, which didn’t exist when Ichiro was playing in Japan.

by ken on Oct 30, 2010 1:51 PM EDT up reply actions  

Hahahaha, I knew it was ~$50 mil

Was that the exact number? Ridiculous.

"just a couple of weeks ago a first year student in my program told me i was charming and charismatic, it was a guy, but the point still stands.: -- justin007000

by jch24 on Oct 29, 2010 7:11 PM EDT up reply actions  

JJ Hardy

I think Minnesota would be willing to part with him, his value is somewhat depressed, it’s time to buy now.

Only difference between astronauts and old folks bein' that you never see one astronaut spoon feedin' dollar chilli to a worse-lookin' astronaut at Wendy's

by RoastBeefKazenzakis on Oct 29, 2010 2:48 PM EDT reply actions  

We didn't try to pick him up off Waivers IIRC

I don’t think he’s undervalued right now either.

by jsl413 on Oct 29, 2010 5:57 PM EDT up reply actions  

The obvious signing is Edgar Renteria.

Come on. Old guy. Played for multiple Winners. Declining skills. Once a Cardinal. Has hit leadoff.

This has Dusty’s shortstop written all over him.

by Brian B on Oct 29, 2010 2:48 PM EDT via mobile reply actions   1 recs

ack

All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?

by BubbaFan on Oct 29, 2010 3:00 PM EDT up reply actions  

ehhh

He’s above the .250 BA, too high for Dusty.

But, I wouldn’t mind having Edgar

What Would Joey Votto Do?

by OGC Reds on Oct 29, 2010 3:03 PM EDT up reply actions  

Don't forget Miguel Tejada

Basically the same player, with even more veteran presence. Even could play 3B to back up Rolen.

What, me? Being negative? No. Never.

by Paul Householder on Oct 30, 2010 3:59 PM EDT up reply actions  

Nope. Never played for a winner.

Never “been there,” never played for the Cardinals, doesn’t lead off. Totally different player.

by Brian B on Oct 31, 2010 1:43 AM EDT up reply actions  

Wow, good points

don’t know how I could have overlooked them. I woulda just made a big mistake!

by kcgard2 on Oct 31, 2010 9:24 AM EDT up reply actions  

um, didn't Tejada play for the A's

when they “won” for what, 3 years in a row?

Set the gearshift to the high gear of your soul.

by Kevin Mitchell is Batman on Nov 1, 2010 12:53 PM EDT up reply actions  

What did Large Ken Rosenthal say?

Need the number of that store where they make ceramics in an oven made out of damaged circus supplies. It's called Rumpled Stilts Kiln. - Jon Wurster

by RijoSaboCaseyWKRP on Oct 29, 2010 4:42 PM EDT up reply actions  

Terrific.

The Reds are just gonna have to fork up a couple million extra to lure him back to the game then, aren’t they?

by Brian B on Oct 29, 2010 7:13 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

Godlord

It’s a good thing I don’t write legal briefs on my iPhone.

by Brian B on Oct 29, 2010 7:15 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

Renteria is not the SF shortstop I would want

Unfortunately Uribe’s postseason heroics have probable pushed him out of the Reds’ price range.

"just a couple of weeks ago a first year student in my program told me i was charming and charismatic, it was a guy, but the point still stands.: -- justin007000

by jch24 on Oct 29, 2010 7:16 PM EDT up reply actions  

Renteria

He’s been decent-ish when healthy this year (decent BB rate, still competent at SS) but he’s been pretty injured which is why he’s been considering retirement.

Buster Posey>
"I thought he was going to punch me and I was totally accepting of it. I was planning a reason to thank him if he did." Brian Wilson on Buster Posey

by Gobroks on Oct 30, 2010 2:06 AM EDT up reply actions  

Nice Little Article about your fav. GM Krivsky talking about the Hailton-Volquez trade

http://content.usatoday.com/communities/gameon/post/2010/10/josh-hamilton-rangers-reds-trade/1

I dont know how Krivsky hasn’t realized that he is bad yet, he is part of the Mets organization now, that’s usually the end.

What Would Joey Votto Do?

by OGC Reds on Oct 29, 2010 3:08 PM EDT reply actions  

That article is ridiculous.

Sure, it may end up being a bad trade when both careers are in the books. But I don’t think we’re even able to call it “bad” with certainty yet, let alone start talking Milt Pappas. Silliness.

by the finest muffins on Oct 29, 2010 6:35 PM EDT up reply actions  

haha

Milt

What Would Joey Votto Do?

by OGC Reds on Oct 29, 2010 7:37 PM EDT up reply actions  

It all boils down to VAJ

Wise words indeed

Without deviation from the norm, progress is not possible.

by Unmitigated Audacity on Oct 29, 2010 3:23 PM EDT reply actions   2 recs

if scutaro is on here i think lowrie should be too

he may cost a little more in terms of prospects but i dont see why he shouldnt be able to be had either

by vottomatic on Oct 29, 2010 5:59 PM EDT reply actions  

How about other positions

This is a good evaluation. Personally I would like to see Janish be given an opportunity to become an everyday starter to see if he can excel. I believe he can do it. I am sure it was a surprise to Janish that the Reds went out and got Cabrera last winter. If the Reds decline option but Cabrera wants to return anyway and signs for less, then this is a dead issue because Reds would be paying less for the services of both. For Janish, I would like to see more power from him but not at the expense of playing a better defense on the field. Eventually, he should be a good replacement for Phillips at 2nd. For whatever money that the Reds can save here at ss, they’ll need to upgrade Votto, Bruce, etc.

by Richard L on Oct 30, 2010 4:05 AM EDT reply actions  

I do not understand any love or preference for Jason Bartlett

His 2009 season was great, but everything points to that being a fluke. He was worse in every slash area than Janish this year, with presumably worse defense, and is older, and costs more, and would have to be gotten via trade. I see no good reason to push for him over Janish.

by ThePensive on Oct 30, 2010 4:32 AM EDT reply actions  

He's on the Rays!

He’s so often referred to as a premium trade chip. I didn’t realize he had such an exciting slash line. Rays seem to win with guys like that. Garza and Shields also carry shiny reputations.

by ol Pete on Oct 30, 2010 9:58 AM EDT up reply actions  

Garza and Shields are good pitchers

Bartlett is a little tough to figure out. I think a switch from AL East to NL Central would come with a nice boost in offensive production.

by kcgard2 on Oct 30, 2010 10:48 AM EDT up reply actions  

and for that matter

where’s Reid Brignac? Sean-Rod and Bartlett are on here, but I’ve always thought Brignac would be the best target in the Rays’ org.

Set the gearshift to the high gear of your soul.

by Kevin Mitchell is Batman on Oct 30, 2010 3:17 PM EDT up reply actions  

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