RR Community Prospect Rankings: ROAR!
by BK on Jan 12, 2010 7:00 AM EST
in Community Prospect Rankings
85 comments
Juan Francisco is #6 on your list. Even with the recent emphasis on pitching, us Reds fans still swoon over a player that can hit the long ball, and when he's not eating children, El Nino Destructor can certainly do that. As one of the international signings of the past that seems to be panning out, Francisco will be doing his part to help our new chap get acclimated to the Queen City.
For the next poll, we'll just keep it simple and keep the same list, minus END. Someone not on the list that should be? Say so in the comments.
Travis Wood, LHSP:
Baseball America rank: 7
2009 RR CPR rank: NR
Age: 23
Draft/Acquisition Details: 2nd Round (pick 60), Reds, 2005
Highest Level Played: AAA (Louisville)
2009 Statistics:
Carolina (AA): 19 GS, 9-3, 1.21 ERA, 119 IP, 103 K, 37 BB, .97 WHIP
Louisville (AAA): 8 GS, 4-2, 3.14 ERA, 48.2 IP, 32 K, 16 BB, 1.21 WHIP
Zachary Cozart, SS:
Baseball America rank: 10
2009 RR CPR rank: NR
Age: 24
Draft/Acquisition Details: 2nd round (pick 79), Reds, 2007
Highest Level Played: AA (Carolina)
2009 Statistics:
Carolina (AA): 131 G, 462 AB, 10 HR, 59 RBI, 10 SB, .262/.360/.398/.758
Peoria (AFL): 13 G, 50 AB, 2 HR, 10 RBI, 3 SB, .340/.393/.560/.953
Yorman Rodriguez, CF:
Baseball America rank: 6
2009 RR CPR rank: 13
Age: 17
Draft/Acquisition Details: Signed in 2008 out of Venezuela
Highest Level Played: Rookie (Billings)
2009 Statistics:
GCL Reds (Rookie): 21 G, 82 AB, 0 HR, 2 RBI, 5 SB, .280/.348/.329/.677
Billings (Rookie): 46 G, 183 AB, 3 HR, 17 RBI, 5 SB, .219/.259/.344/.603
Brad Boxberger, RHP:
Baseball America rank: 9
2009 RR CPR rank: NR
Age: 21
Draft/Acquisition Details: 1st round (pick 43), Reds, 2009
Highest Level Played: College (USC)
2009 Statistics:
USC (Pac-10): 14 GS, 6-3, 3.16 ERA, 94 IP, 99 K, 50 BB, 1.27 WHIP
Chris Valaika, 2B/SS:
Baseball America rank: NR
2009 RR CPR rank: 5
Age: 24
Draft/Acquisition Details: 3rd round, (84th pick), Reds, 2006
Highest Level Played: AAA (Louisville)
2009 Statistics:
Louisville, (AAA): 95 G, 366 AB, 6 HR, 36 RBI, 1 SB, .235/.271/.344/.615
Matt Maloney, LHSP:
Baseball America rank: 8
2009 RR CPR rank: NR
Age: 26 (on January 16)
Draft/Acquisition Details: 3rd round (97th pick), Phillies, 2005
Highest Level Played: MLB (Reds)
2009 Statistics:
Carolina (AA): 1 GS, 0-0, 1.29 ERA, 7 IP, 5 K, 2 BB, .71 WHIP
Louisville (AAA): 22 GS, 9-9, 3.08 ERA, 143 IP, 105 K, 24 BB, 1.17 WHIP
Cincinnati (MLB): 7 GS, 2-4, 4.87 ERA, 40.2 IP, 28 K, 8 BB, 1.25 WHIP
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I don't think Valaika should be on the list yet
I think these players are more worthy of consideration right now: Soto, Hamilton, Maloney, Mesoraco, Klinker, and Sulbaran.
by Snake the Jake on Jan 12, 2010 7:57 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
Duh...Maloney is already a candidate
by Snake the Jake on Jan 12, 2010 8:08 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
oh yeah he is
Bailey, Chapman, Cueto, Leake, and Volquez; the future is so bright I have to wear sunglasses.
by justin007000 on Jan 12, 2010 11:06 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Doesn't mean I'm going to vote for him
I LIVE IN AMERICA!
Start SEEing motorcycles
by Excalib8 on Jan 12, 2010 1:46 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Valaika had a down year last year
But so did Soto and Mesoraco, in lower levels, and those two weren’t hurt for most of the year. Klinker and Sulbaran are both late round guys who haven’t had the high-level success Valaika already has. Hamilton hasn’t played above Billings and hasn’t convinced me that he can hit at all.
This brings up a valid question though. When looking at prospects, does one down year in AAA take a decent upside guy like Valaika off of most prospect boards? Should it?
"look at me! im hablahing espanyoll!" - Charlie Scrabbles
by BK on Jan 12, 2010 9:48 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Depends on circumstance
Becaused of injury – no. If he would have been overmatched, yes.
So, I don’t take him off the board based on his 2009. He’ll slide down a few spots because of the presence of others, but should still be well-regarded.
Also, it looks like he was #5 in last year’s RR CPR
by GregD on Jan 12, 2010 9:55 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Nice catch.
Don’t know how that got messed up, but it’s fixed.
"look at me! im hablahing espanyoll!" - Charlie Scrabbles
by BK on Jan 12, 2010 10:04 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
that was my fault
lazy cutting and pasting from the last post yesterday, I think.
by nycredsfan on Jan 12, 2010 11:04 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Yep.
RR’s greatest minds at work!
"look at me! im hablahing espanyoll!" - Charlie Scrabbles
by BK on Jan 12, 2010 11:10 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Well, I have been called a Young Einstein
by nycredsfan on Jan 12, 2010 11:18 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Yahoo! Finally a funny joke!
Made from 100% Recycled Awesome,
by 'tHan on Jan 12, 2010 1:02 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Soto and Mesoraco are both younger. Also, they played in the FSL, which depresses hitting a lot. According to minorleaguesplits.com, their years weren’t so bad last year. They both have more upside than Valaika IMO based on their ages, scouting reports, and performance so far.
Hamilton is a high upside guy too. According to some, he was the best athlete in last year’s draft.
Sulbaran was only a late round pick because he was supposed to attend the University of Florida. I believe he received a $600,000 bonus.
Klinker just had a great year last year.
Valaika struggled before his injury last year. He injured himself by punching a water cooler. I don’t think he should be dropped completely but think other guys have more potential and are better prospects.
by Snake the Jake on Jan 12, 2010 10:01 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I'm not saying those guys aren't prospects
Just saying that I think Valaika is a better prospect than you’re giving him credit for. I like all the guys you talk about a great deal, and they’ll be on soon. Would you have put any of the guys you listed over everyone on this list for the #7 prospect?
"look at me! im hablahing espanyoll!" - Charlie Scrabbles
by BK on Jan 12, 2010 10:10 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I think everyone listed would be a decent pick for the 7th spot except for Valaika
I still like Valaika but he’s not a top 10 prospect, for the reasons stated above.
by Snake the Jake on Jan 12, 2010 10:24 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I took Yorman.
I think the guy’s gonna be a stud. Reminds me a bit of Alex Rios… in many ways.
"People don't kill people. Burning oreo packages kill people."
by crolfer on Jan 12, 2010 10:32 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
You don't have to vote him in the top 10
Remember, the point of the poll isn’t “who shouldn’t be on the list”, it’s “out of who’s left, who’s the best”. If you don’t like him on the list, don’t vote for him. There are 4 people so far that think he’s the best on the list above. (And I’m sure Mr. and Mrs. Valaika appreciate us including him…)
"look at me! im hablahing espanyoll!" - Charlie Scrabbles
by BK on Jan 12, 2010 10:34 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I agree, the point is “out of who’s left, who’s the best.” I’m arguing about the “out of who’s left” question.
I hope Mr. and Mrs. Valaika don’t take me off of their Christmas card list.
I voted for Yorman btw.
by Snake the Jake on Jan 12, 2010 10:45 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
really?
He injured himself punching a water cooler?
What an idiot, if that’s true.
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
by BubbaFan on Jan 12, 2010 5:22 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
always punch with your glove hand
Bailey, Chapman, Cueto, Leake, and Volquez; the future is so bright I have to wear sunglasses.
by justin007000 on Jan 12, 2010 6:09 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Pascal Perez?
" 'than's pussy looks better than your cock." -- BubbaFan to ZJiff30
by jch24 on Jan 13, 2010 12:20 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
i hate juan francisco
the reds should trade him immediately
Made from 100% Recycled Awesome,
by 'tHan on Jan 12, 2010 8:47 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
You've angered him.
Remember, when you hear the ROAR it will be too late.
by fourrunhomer on Jan 12, 2010 9:54 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
when you hear the ROAR it will be the END
/shakes head
Made from 100% Recycled Awesome,
by 'tHan on Jan 12, 2010 10:07 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
/throws tomato
"look at me! im hablahing espanyoll!" - Charlie Scrabbles
by BK on Jan 12, 2010 10:10 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
the end when he BITES YOUR HEAD OFF
by Daedalus on Jan 12, 2010 11:46 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
call you butter, cuz you're on a roll
"look at me! im hablahing espanyoll!" - Charlie Scrabbles
by BK on Jan 12, 2010 11:49 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
wheres that awesome picture BubbaFan found a while back?
We need it now.
"And then there was the USAID guy in Kandahar who drove a giant pink Cadillac, which the locals set on fire one day. If you wanted to destroy something symbolic during a riot, you just could not do better than that. Good stuff." - Ghosts of Alexander
by Cy Schourek on Jan 12, 2010 12:12 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
What do people think about Boxberger?
I haven’t seen him at all, is he legit?
"People don't kill people. Burning oreo packages kill people."
by crolfer on Jan 12, 2010 10:47 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
Throws pretty fast, (BA ranked his FB best in the organization)
also has an averageish CB, an above average slider, and an average changeup. So clearly he has the stuff to be a starter.
His control is very inconsistent, and it’s questionable if he’ll have the stamina to start. If he can be a starter he’s definitely a top 10 guy, if he’s a reliever, he’s still a good prospect but clearly not as high.
I’m pretty sure the org is going to try and make him a starter, a’la Zack Stewart.
by nycredsfan on Jan 12, 2010 11:14 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Throws pretty fast...
Do we know if he’s got any movement on the fastball?
"People don't kill people. Burning oreo packages kill people."
by crolfer on Jan 12, 2010 11:18 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I would imagine so,
I think he only throws it 90-93, can touch 95.
With that velocity it probably has a fair bit of movement on it too if BA rated it the best.
Well, either that or, pre Chapman (yay!) our system was crazy weak on fastball guys.
by nycredsfan on Jan 12, 2010 11:21 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Awesome.
Thanks for the info. I like movement a lot- any Major Leaguer can time a fastball- I don’t care if it’s 100 MPH or not- add in some movement though, and a 90 MPH pitch can be way better.
"People don't kill people. Burning oreo packages kill people."
by crolfer on Jan 12, 2010 11:24 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
i just can't wrap my head around having yorman in my top 10.
i always get hung up on readiness and how close they are to making the club. if i’ve learned anything from this series, it’s that everyone has their own idea of what makes a good prospect.
i voted travis wood.
by GrooveLeg on Jan 12, 2010 11:05 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
the only way "readiness" should play into your voting is because the more "ready" guys have probably performed at higher levels
Yorman has, by far, more and better tools than anyone left on the list, and probably more than anyone voted above him too (save maybe Chapman)
He runs super fast, should play a great CF, has a rocket arm, and showed, as a 16 year old boy amongst men, that he could hold his own at the plate.
It’s only really a question of if he’ll continue to hit as he progresses. If that’s a big deal to you, don’t vote for him, otherwise, he’s the clear choice here.
by nycredsfan on Jan 12, 2010 11:08 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Exactly
You have to consider that he was 4 years younger than most of the players in the league he played in, and put up respectable numbers. And I echo everything nyc said about his tools being very good.
"look at me! im hablahing espanyoll!" - Charlie Scrabbles
by BK on Jan 12, 2010 11:24 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
yeah, I think he's my #8 prospect
looks like Wood is running away with this one.
It’s funny how Wood seems a lot more “meh” now that GABP is around, and how Valaika is really just a meh version of frazier. Either of those two looked a lot more exciting before the emergence of the other
"And then there was the USAID guy in Kandahar who drove a giant pink Cadillac, which the locals set on fire one day. If you wanted to destroy something symbolic during a riot, you just could not do better than that. Good stuff." - Ghosts of Alexander
by Cy Schourek on Jan 12, 2010 12:13 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I think this is way too high for wood personally
like the results, don’t like the tools
by sharks on Jan 12, 2010 4:38 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
1) Best changeup in the system
2) average to above average fast ball:
“Well, an average fastball in the major leagues is 90-91, and for a left-hander, it’s closer to 87. If you grade pitches out, on the same scale, lefties do not throw nearly as hard as righties.”
3) He already has established great control.
4) All he needs is to refine his cutter and be able to rely on a breaking pitch and he’s ready.
A full year in AAA will do him well.
by mdccclxix on Jan 12, 2010 5:05 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
agree with you on the full year in AAA
and interesting point on average FB for a lefthander and control, good points 1-4 really.
but maybe I should refine my statement: don’t like the tools compared to the other guys in the system’s tools.
it’s not that think he’s a bad prospect, I just think we’re overvaluing him because of his results this season, an average FB and only one plus pitch doesn’t put him ahead of cozart or yorman in my mind, possibly even doesn’t put him ahead of boxberger. I like wood overall, I think he will be useful as a lefty #4 once he makes it to the bigs, but he doesn’t have the upside to get picked over some of these guys IMO.
by sharks on Jan 12, 2010 5:15 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I think you have to trust the scouts a bit on this one
And the fact that at age 16/17, he is already showing signs of on-base skills in the pros to bolster his readily apparent raw talent / defense.
Yeah, those guys and the Cincinnati Reds. They're a terrible football team. / Because they're a baseball team? / Exactly. You know who's the worst football team? The Philadelphia Flyers. - Best Show
by RijoSaboCaseyWKRP on Jan 12, 2010 11:15 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I took Matty Maloney
because well he really will be the next Randy Johnson.
Bailey, Chapman, Cueto, Leake, and Volquez; the future is so bright I have to wear sunglasses.
by justin007000 on Jan 12, 2010 11:07 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
If you mean
that he’ll be the next to retire.
Before the curse of stastics fell upon mankind we lived a happy, innocent life, full of merriment and go and informed by fairly good judgement.
-Hilaire Belloc
by poojols on Jan 12, 2010 12:35 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
he'll be the next to retire
retire every batter he faces.
Yeah i’ll stop.
Bailey, Chapman, Cueto, Leake, and Volquez; the future is so bright I have to wear sunglasses.
by justin007000 on Jan 12, 2010 3:09 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I really think it
Yeah, those guys and the Cincinnati Reds. They're a terrible football team. / Because they're a baseball team? / Exactly. You know who's the worst football team? The Philadelphia Flyers. - Best Show
by RijoSaboCaseyWKRP on Jan 12, 2010 11:19 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
I just really think it... in general... about everything
“Enter” fail
It seems fairly likely that we’re going to be singing Jocketty’s praises over the next 5 years for bringing about a renaissance in the Reds’ talent base. Combining international signings, shrewd draft picks and Wlad-style players who other teams have sold short on seems like a winning formula.
Yeah, those guys and the Cincinnati Reds. They're a terrible football team. / Because they're a baseball team? / Exactly. You know who's the worst football team? The Philadelphia Flyers. - Best Show
by RijoSaboCaseyWKRP on Jan 12, 2010 11:27 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
2011 baby.
It’s only a year away.
"People don't kill people. Burning oreo packages kill people."
by crolfer on Jan 12, 2010 11:29 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
barry larkin should get into the Hall that year
by Daedalus on Jan 12, 2010 11:49 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
You know what happened the last time we got a star infielder into the Hall?
I believe that was 1990… Hmmm. World Series Champions. 2011. It’s gonna happen.
"People don't kill people. Burning oreo packages kill people."
by crolfer on Jan 12, 2010 11:54 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I like the way you think, sir
"look at me! im hablahing espanyoll!" - Charlie Scrabbles
by BK on Jan 12, 2010 11:59 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Should be a banner year
Banner-raising, in fact.
Yeah, those guys and the Cincinnati Reds. They're a terrible football team. / Because they're a baseball team? / Exactly. You know who's the worst football team? The Philadelphia Flyers. - Best Show
by RijoSaboCaseyWKRP on Jan 12, 2010 11:57 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
2010 is only a couple months away
wait, ummm, well, baseball anyway.
Point is, I think we can have a very good season this year. Probably not at the beginning, but Heisey, Frazier, and Alonso (and maybe Cozart) can potentially provide a huge influx of offensive talent at some point during the season.
As long as Walt doesn’t do anything stupid, and it’s looking increasingly like he won’t, the team should do pretty well this year and be primed to be dang good in 2011.
Funny how one signing breeds so much optimism
by nycredsfan on Jan 12, 2010 12:01 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Wayner and DanO helped too
Walt will just be the man who is here to see it come to life. Really I hated DanO when he ran the organization, the Milton singing wasn’t good, but landing Bruce and Bailey really helped right the organization. He was a good GM to begin to rebuild the franchise.
Bailey, Chapman, Cueto, Leake, and Volquez; the future is so bright I have to wear sunglasses.
by justin007000 on Jan 12, 2010 3:11 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I voted Cozart.
I’m relatively confident in his ability to be at least an average big league shortstop, and I think that has a lot of value. I considered Yorman for his upside, but I at least wanna see him play some full-season ball first. After that I’d go Wood, Boxberger, Soto, Valaika, Maloney.
by Geki on Jan 12, 2010 1:08 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
same here
i voted Yorman yesterday, but flipped my vote to Cozart for today.
by Charlie Scrabbles on Jan 12, 2010 1:24 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
eh
they are basically interchangeable on my list. i was just trying to be nice is all.
by Charlie Scrabbles on Jan 12, 2010 2:13 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Yorman Rodriguez
His tools are better than anyone in the system, including Chapman’s. He is an elite runner. He has a plus arm. His defense is above average already despite very limited experience. When he was in the GCL he showed he had a solid understanding at the plate (when he started seeing college guys in the Pioneer League he was over matched, but also 16 against 20-23 year old college pitchers for the most part). The guys upside is an Eric Davis/Carlos Beltran type of player. No one else on this list can come close to matching that on upside. There are a lot of good prospects who are close, but this is a potentially great prospect who is far away. I will take the great upside guy here without a second thought on it.
by dougdirt on Jan 12, 2010 1:32 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Is he back at Billings you think? I'd like to catch him on a road trip.
I want to see what a 17 year old Eric Davis might look like in person.
by mdccclxix on Jan 12, 2010 1:46 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Travis Wood is the awesomist player ever to be awesome.
That’s why I’ve been voting for him like a son.
BA listed him at 6 ft, which places him an inch taller than that short shit, Pedro Martinez. He is also now considered eligible for the HOF since nobody gets in under 6 foot these days.
If I keep voting hard enough, we may find Wood 6’1" by May sometime.
Now for my #8 pick, Darnell McDonald!!!!
by mdccclxix on Jan 12, 2010 1:44 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
do you need some hard Wood?
Bailey, Chapman, Cueto, Leake, and Volquez; the future is so bright I have to wear sunglasses.
by justin007000 on Jan 12, 2010 3:12 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
perhaps
unless you’ve got some of Maloney’s bologna
by mdccclxix on Jan 12, 2010 3:20 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
or Chapman's walkman.
"People don't kill people. Burning oreo packages kill people."
by crolfer on Jan 12, 2010 7:15 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
this has probably
… been covered on other threads by other bloggers, but in a phrase, can somebody tell me:
Is the Reds farm system
a. better than most
b. competitive
c. lacking
or the iconoclastic (d.)
“depends on what you are talking about”
I see a pretty good list of young guys who could tend to excite the fans for a long time.
I also remember Willie Greene.
Don't try to win every game, just the last one.
by johnu1 on Jan 12, 2010 1:45 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
it's probably one of the top 10 best systems in the league
with Chapman aboard.
by Charlie Scrabbles on Jan 12, 2010 1:52 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
best 10 out of 16
That could mean one or two things but I think your implication is that overall, it’s on the (b.) range, competitive.
That would be a positive for me.
Don't try to win every game, just the last one.
by johnu1 on Jan 12, 2010 1:54 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
best 10 outta 30
30 teams in the majors now. this aint 1922!
by Charlie Scrabbles on Jan 12, 2010 2:01 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
well, your post said "league"
Only 29 teams.
One of them doesn’t really count.
anyway, upper third is a high level (b.).
Don't try to win every game, just the last one.
by johnu1 on Jan 12, 2010 2:08 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
they were in the bottom half before chapman, mostly because of a lack of premiere prospects
Chapman probably puts them above average, but I’m not sure I’d go upper third, maybe right on the edge of upper third. I think we have a solid system.
by sharks on Jan 12, 2010 4:44 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
another thing
I don’t see any catchers on these lists.
Do we just hope Alex Trevino unretires?
Don't try to win every game, just the last one.
by johnu1 on Jan 12, 2010 1:49 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Devin Mesoraco is the best catching prospect
And he’s still kind of far down the line. There is also lots more depth and better players at other positions.
"look at me! im hablahing espanyoll!" - Charlie Scrabbles
by BK on Jan 12, 2010 2:22 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
valaikia and maloney with more votes than boxberger?
my response: :P
I’d also like to see hamilton and soto on the next list.
by sharks on Jan 12, 2010 4:50 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
that's klinky
Bailey, Chapman, Cueto, Leake, and Volquez; the future is so bright I have to wear sunglasses.
by justin007000 on Jan 12, 2010 6:10 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Yorman
"I expected much better than that".....tHan
by obc2 on Jan 12, 2010 9:20 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
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