Reds Offense By Lineup Position, or, How Worthless Can Your 1- and 2-hole Hitters Be?

by Slyde on Sep 14, 2009 12:41 PM EDT in Features Comment 103 comments

I appear to have come down with the flu. Not sure of the letter/number combination of the disease, but it's definitely put me in an unpleasant state. Since misery loves company, I decided to show you just how bad the Reds 1 and 2 hitters have been this season. Here's the Reds numbers by batting position:

Split	PA	BB	SO	BA	OBP	SLG	OPS	sOPS+
Batting 1st	667	39	122	.247	.293	.328	.621	65
Batting 2nd	645	51	98	.237	.301	.360	.661	74
Batting 3rd	634	73	121	.276	.365	.479	.844	102
Batting 4th	617	41	92	.271	.328	.443	.771	87
Batting 5th	609	62	111	.245	.328	.409	.738	88
Batting 6th	596	61	119	.235	.317	.410	.727	89
Batting 7th	587	54	97	.259	.331	.425	.756	108
Batting 8th	564	54	91	.211	.297	.281	.578	65
Batting 9th	546	29	149	.187	.238	.299	.537	88
Bat1-2,non-P	1312	90	220	.242	.297	.343	.640	70
Bat3-6,non-P	2455	237	442	.257	.335	.436	.771	92
Bat7-9,non-P	1384	130	244	.238	.317	.366	.683	95

Provided by Baseball-Reference.com: View Original Table
Generated 9/14/2009.

As you can see, the Reds top 2 hitters in the order, the two players that are guaranteed to get the most at bats in a game, are batting worse than the 7-9 hitters. And ridiculously, the Reds' lead-off hitters have just 10 more walks than the 9th spot in the order, in 121 more plate appearances. It's an embarrassment.

We've only compared them to their own teammates so far, too. Look how bad they are in comparison to the league:

Rk		PA	BB	SO	BA	OBP	SLG	OPS	sOPS+
1	COL	1350	132	285	.267	.342	.453	.795	109
2	WSN	1337	117	191	.302	.373	.412	.785	108
3	PHI	1340	106	148	.275	.335	.443	.778	105
4	ARI	1347	113	195	.278	.341	.431	.773	104
5	ATL	1348	112	190	.279	.346	.425	.771	104
6	MIL	1321	114	223	.274	.342	.417	.759	100
7	NYM	1326	129	152	.285	.357	.391	.747	99
8	STL	1319	99	190	.279	.336	.408	.743	97
9	CHC	1325	119	227	.261	.336	.405	.741	96
10	LAD	1373	107	173	.278	.341	.394	.735	95
11	FLA	1360	124	250	.277	.347	.388	.734	95
12	PIT	1285	102	223	.269	.330	.401	.731	93
13	HOU	1302	96	203	.280	.338	.389	.728	93
14	SDP	1321	118	176	.260	.332	.368	.701	86
15	SFG	1300	83	231	.253	.308	.363	.671	78
16	CIN	1312	90	220	.242	.297	.343	.640	70
	TOT	21266	1761	3277	.272	.338	.402	.740	96

Provided by Baseball-Reference.com: View Original Table
Generated 9/14/2009.

They are 30 OPS points behind the Giants, who are terrible in the 1and 2 spots in the order. It's ridiculously unfathomable how bad the Reds are in these two spots. If there is a question about what needs to be fixed about the offense for 2010, it should start and end with those two spots in the order. Of all of the failures of this team, this one is the most glaring.

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i love me some statsy slyde

good work, would you be willing to be the GM of this franchise?

Bloop

by justin007000 on Sep 14, 2009 12:44 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

It's most glaring

BECAUSE GODDAMN COREY PATTERSON WAS OUR LEADOFF HITTER IN 2008! He was historically bad and they FAILED to upgrade over him this year. UNCONSCIONABLE!

Sports have made me very angry.

by Brendanukkah on Sep 14, 2009 12:46 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

I hear you brother.

I was thrown out of the sports bar I was in Saturday night after screaming about how my two favorite sports teams are coached by two idiot fucktards who simply refuse to change in the face of overwhelming common sense.

You ever been to the South side of Milwaukee?

by chesirecat on Sep 14, 2009 4:35 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Ok

Who gets to tell Dusty?

Wear something sexy to my funeral.

by Pops Daniels on Sep 14, 2009 12:49 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Dusty doesn't like those baserunners clogging up the bases

First time I shot her, shot her in the side.
Hard to watch her suffer, but with the second shot she died...

by btcoop71 on Sep 14, 2009 1:06 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

My tribute to our fair leader

is here. Enjoy.

Wear something sexy to my funeral.

by Pops Daniels on Sep 14, 2009 4:53 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

what. the. hell.

by Charlie Scrabbles on Sep 14, 2009 5:17 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

that was hilarious

although I could not tell you what the fuck the point was.

by Dave from Louisville on Sep 14, 2009 10:58 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

wow

i love Joey Votto. more than i ever knew.

by Charlie Scrabbles on Sep 14, 2009 12:50 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Am I going to get the flu since I was in a car with you for 4 hours?

by jsl413 on Sep 14, 2009 12:55 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

well, it looks like BK has the same thing

so yeah.

Definitely a good argument.

by Slyde on Sep 14, 2009 12:56 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I feel okay right now though..

by jsl413 on Sep 14, 2009 12:59 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Yes.

Although, I’m not entirely sure what I have is the flu yet.

"We, as for me all seasons you are affected peculiarly in the edge of my seat and are happy concerning the fact that the Adam Dunn fan has been mixed up exactly." - Reynard-san

by BK on Sep 14, 2009 12:59 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Well, now I'm upset

I guses now better than when class starts in a week though.

by jsl413 on Sep 14, 2009 1:01 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

colleges are swine flu heaven

Young adults appear to be among the most vulnerable (probably because older people have been exposed in previous outbreaks – the Spanish flu, the Hong Kong flu in the ’50s, and swine flu outbreak in the ’70s). Cornell has over 500 students sick with the flu. One died.

Some schools have even been forced to cancel games because their teams are too sick to play.

All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?

by BubbaFan on Sep 14, 2009 1:14 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

my school already has a swine flu policy:

“If you have symptoms, please stay the hell away from us.”

Everybody's a jerk. You. Me. This jerk.

by andromache on Sep 14, 2009 1:17 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

i got an email like that from my corporate office last week

only it had more swears.

by Charlie Scrabbles on Sep 14, 2009 1:17 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

ditto

Only no cursing, since it was posted on our Intranet page. They haven’t decided whether they’ll offer swine flu shots, like they do regular flu shots, but they did ask people to stay home if they feel sick.

It’s looking like the epidemic will be over by the time the vaccine is available anyway. There won’t be any more people left to infect.

All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?

by BubbaFan on Sep 14, 2009 1:23 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I got one to the same effect.

Time to start pumping vitamins

by jsl413 on Sep 14, 2009 1:25 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

try vitamin d

There’s a theory that vitamin d deficiency is responsible for all kinds of immune system problems. The government is debating raising the RDA for vitamin d.

It’s especially a problem in the north, where people get less sun exposure. Especially with people using sunscreen so much these days.

Could turn out to be a crock, but it won’t hurt, and it’s relatively cheap.

All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?

by BubbaFan on Sep 14, 2009 1:29 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I was just gonna take a multivit and some emergen-C stuff

by jsl413 on Sep 14, 2009 1:33 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I agre on the D

I’ve found it to be the most potent immune booster. It could be placebo, but it’s worth a shot

by Red_Poodle on Sep 14, 2009 3:35 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Agre? Me too on the LSD

It is the ultimate placebo

One tequila, two tequila, three tequila, floor.
George Carlin

by Madville on Sep 14, 2009 4:20 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Ultimate Placebo

You’re pretty good if you just own Without You, I’m Nothing.

by Brendanukkah on Sep 14, 2009 4:33 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

yeah- it's in my dorm...

they pretty much need to just quarantine everyone who’s sick…

People Don't Kill People. Burning Couches Kill People.

by crolfer on Sep 14, 2009 2:21 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

that's racist

by Charlie Scrabbles on Sep 14, 2009 2:22 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

That's what we've been doing

about 1/10 have had it here, including all 3 of my roommates. I leave campus every chance I can get.

You ever been to the South side of Milwaukee?

by chesirecat on Sep 14, 2009 4:31 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Its good that you're leaving campus and sharing the bug with the outside world

One tequila, two tequila, three tequila, floor.
George Carlin

by Madville on Sep 14, 2009 4:34 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

yeah chesire

you dick.

Bloop

by justin007000 on Sep 14, 2009 7:22 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

What symptoms do you have?

by jsl413 on Sep 14, 2009 1:05 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I had a sore throat yesterday

and was lethargic. Today, I’m achy all over with some dizziness and chills. My throat is still raw and I have a little bit of drainage and coughing, though not much.

Definitely a good argument.

by Slyde on Sep 14, 2009 1:18 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Hm.

Well, I’m going to play golf. I’m tired, but that’s because I only got 5 hours of drunk sleep. I have some drainage and congestion, but it’s not that bad and could probably be otherwise explained.

I’m going to trick myself into not getting sick.

by jsl413 on Sep 14, 2009 1:25 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I played golf yesterday morning

DUN dun dun

Definitely a good argument.

by Slyde on Sep 14, 2009 1:28 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Golf is a symptom.

Everybody's a jerk. You. Me. This jerk.

by andromache on Sep 14, 2009 1:30 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs

Tiger Woods has the worst known case of swine flu ever!

Definitely a good argument.

by Slyde on Sep 14, 2009 1:31 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

What I have sounds like that

I figured I was just really hungover all day yesterday, and then I woke up this morning all congested. Until about 11 or so, I felt like I had just run a marathon.

"We, as for me all seasons you are affected peculiarly in the edge of my seat and are happy concerning the fact that the Adam Dunn fan has been mixed up exactly." - Reynard-san

by BK on Sep 14, 2009 1:51 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Feeling fine after a round of golf with some drainage.

I feel pretty good… tired, but I only slept 5 hours.

I feel a cough might be coming on… guess I’ll start medicating early.

by jsl413 on Sep 14, 2009 6:36 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Drainage from what part of your body....I mean what with all this illness and STDs and stuff

One tequila, two tequila, three tequila, floor.
George Carlin

by Madville on Sep 14, 2009 10:09 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

i doubt jsl needs to worry about that

and

goes the

Bloop

by justin007000 on Sep 14, 2009 10:55 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

time to put you down

Bloop

by justin007000 on Sep 14, 2009 2:25 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Dusty's not gonna change at this point

We have to work with him, and get a SS and CFer with a good OBP.

Drew Stubbs should be our starting CFer. I am deathly afraid that we’re going to get Willy Taveras instead.

Not sure what to do about SS. Dusty did eventually move A-Gon down the lineup, but he seems to be back in the SS=2-hole rut again.

All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?

by BubbaFan on Sep 14, 2009 1:09 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

FWIW, it's the hitters not the lineup position that is killing the team

The most optimized lineup given the numbers above would only net about 14 more runs for the season. The problem isn’t really where the players are batting, it’s the actual players that are batting there.

Definitely a good argument.

by Slyde on Sep 14, 2009 1:16 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

right

just imagine how much better this team would be if those sOPS+ figures were closer to 100. we dont need all-stars, just average players.

by Charlie Scrabbles on Sep 14, 2009 1:20 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

so

Is there anyone down on the farm who might be average?

All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?

by BubbaFan on Sep 14, 2009 1:24 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I'm ruing the Jeff Keppinger trade a lot more than I ever thought I would

by Brendanukkah on Sep 14, 2009 1:33 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

where would he play?

Definitely a good argument.

by Slyde on Sep 14, 2009 1:38 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

He would have been preferable to Gonzalez at shortstop, I think

by Brendanukkah on Sep 14, 2009 1:44 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

that's not saying much

i’d rather have shortstopv2 at SS than Gonzo.

by Charlie Scrabbles on Sep 14, 2009 1:45 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Right

It’s more an indictment of Gonzalez than any real longing I have for Keppinger to play shortstop. The Astros have primarily used him as a third baseman. I wonder if we would have done likewise, and then not made the Rolen trade.

Mostly, Keppinger was good for giving you a quality at-bat, and getting wood on the ball. He shouldn’t have been a starter here, but he would have been a good bench option. I’ve just been a little underwhelmed by Drew Sutton so far.

by Brendanukkah on Sep 14, 2009 1:48 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

im not going to vocifierously defend Sutton

because i dont think he’s really anything more than Keppinger to begin with. but Sutton hasnt been given much of a chance, and his minor league track record suggests he could put up decent OBP if given the chance. he wont get the chance here in Cincy though, so he’s probably doomed to be a AAAA/utility guy for the next 3 seasons before washing out.

by Charlie Scrabbles on Sep 14, 2009 1:51 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

no

Keppy was terrible at SS. I’d rather have Janish, stick or no stick.

I could live with Kepp at 3B.

All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?

by BubbaFan on Sep 14, 2009 2:00 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Yeah

With Janish, there’s at least a chance he could hit just enough. With Kepp there’s no chance at all that he’ll field well enough to play SS.

by ken on Sep 14, 2009 2:29 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

...or hit enough to be Derek Jeter

by Charlie Scrabbles on Sep 14, 2009 2:30 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

but will Jeter ever disease enough

to be Lou Gehrig?

People, please. We're all frightened and horny, but we can't let some killer dolphins keep us from living and scoring

by Man Mountain on Sep 14, 2009 2:46 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

via Slyde's connections at the CDCP

They’re looking into getting a strand named Herpes Symplex J.

by Brendanukkah on Sep 14, 2009 3:10 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Dude's been with Jessica Biehl and Scarlett Johansson

I’d say he’s the luckiest man on the face of this earth.

by ken on Sep 14, 2009 3:12 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Huh?

This guy? The Jeff Keppinger that played for the Reds last year? The guy who, in his only season approaching full-time had an OPS+ the same as the dreaded 1-2 hitters we’ve had? The guy who was dreadful last year as a SS, only to be moved to 3B with his new team and upgrade his defense to merely bad?

You really rue trading him?

"You never know how you look through other people's eyes"

by sidnancy on Sep 14, 2009 6:46 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

But how many possible "lineups" would be worse?

14 runs isn’t small when you consider the limited extent a manager can effect a lineup’s run production.

Everybody's a jerk. You. Me. This jerk.

by andromache on Sep 14, 2009 1:24 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

there are worse lineups listed in the linke

they are all in the 3.5 R/G range, which would be a MUCH larger drop off than the increase, though they all have the pitchers leading off, which no one would do.

Definitely a good argument.

by Slyde on Sep 14, 2009 1:30 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

THANK YOU

I understand the Dusty bashing, but this is a roster construction problem. Outside of Dickerson, there just isn’t anyone hitting 7th who should be hitting 1st or someone on the bench who should be. The team has no lead-off batter, which is a problem it had when 2008 ended. it has no SS, which is a problem it had when 2008 ended. It has no offensive catcher, which would be less of a problem if SS and CF were not black holes. The team attempted to fix that by signing the ghost of Ramon Hernandez.

Blaming this on Dusty’s very evident faults is like blaming the flu virus Slyde has for making him sick. Sucky rosters lose.

Hall o Famer Hal in his last pre-season prediction said this was a fifth place team. He was dead on right.

by timb116 on Sep 14, 2009 6:37 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

hey my shift+C is back!

thanks Slyde!

by Charlie Scrabbles on Sep 14, 2009 1:38 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Silly Charlie.

You have to type shift+wishbone C. Just any old C could be mistaken for the Cubs and you’d have 100 years of losing posts.

We Are ... Marshall!

by Thundering Turtle on Sep 14, 2009 2:26 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

clever!

by Charlie Scrabbles on Sep 14, 2009 6:05 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Never Fear,

El Nino Destructor is on his way here! Also Bruuuuuuuuuce is back.

Find me on MySpace- http://www.myspace.com/mixfmkyle

by MixFMKyle on Sep 14, 2009 1:58 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

ROAR.

"We, as for me all seasons you are affected peculiarly in the edge of my seat and are happy concerning the fact that the Adam Dunn fan has been mixed up exactly." - Reynard-san

by BK on Sep 14, 2009 2:07 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

That's it?

No Valaika? No Heisey? No LeCure?

All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?

by BubbaFan on Sep 14, 2009 2:07 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I don't think they have a place for Heisey to play, especially with Bruce back

Valaika and LeCure don’t deserve callups right now, especially Valaika. He looked not so good at the plate the other night. LeCure didn’t look bad, but would they be able to get him any innings?

"We, as for me all seasons you are affected peculiarly in the edge of my seat and are happy concerning the fact that the Adam Dunn fan has been mixed up exactly." - Reynard-san

by BK on Sep 14, 2009 2:14 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Agreed, Heisey could come up and mop T-Virus' brow after he sprints back to the dugout after King

other than that, he wouldn’t get much action. As it is, I doubt Francisco gets much either. I hope he does though, It’ll be really interesting to see in a small sample size if he can hit MLB pitching at all.

BK, did you get my email with the attachments? No hurry to respond, just wanted to make sure you got it.

Baseball must be a great game to survive the fools who run it.— Bill Terry

by nycredsfan on Sep 14, 2009 2:18 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

meant K-ing

Baseball must be a great game to survive the fools who run it.— Bill Terry

by nycredsfan on Sep 14, 2009 2:18 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Apparently Juan is listed as an IF/OF

and Fay thinks he’ll get some starts in LF.

I’m down with that as long as he’s taking ABs from McFlurry, not Gomes or Wlad.

Baseball must be a great game to survive the fools who run it.— Bill Terry

by nycredsfan on Sep 14, 2009 2:20 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

i dont think Gomes or Wlad are any more integral to the future success of this team than The END is

and i’d rather see him get ABs just for the spectacle of it.

by Charlie Scrabbles on Sep 14, 2009 2:22 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

That's probably true,

but the sheer absurdity of starting McDonald AND END in the same OF would make my head explode.

Baseball must be a great game to survive the fools who run it.— Bill Terry

by nycredsfan on Sep 14, 2009 2:57 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I did

I haven’t been around at all over the weekend.

"We, as for me all seasons you are affected peculiarly in the edge of my seat and are happy concerning the fact that the Adam Dunn fan has been mixed up exactly." - Reynard-san

by BK on Sep 14, 2009 3:07 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I suppose

Plus, it costs money to add more players to the roster.

Still…if Stubbs earned a callup, so did Heisey. (I know. We’re going to get the return of Taveras instead.) I thought they might want to give Valaika a look; he’s got a better stick than Janish. LeCure is already on the 40-man roster, and is probably more likely to be on the roster next year than Kip Wells. (I hope.)

All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?

by BubbaFan on Sep 14, 2009 2:42 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I definitely agree that Heisey deserves a callup

But then again, maybe giving him a few weeks before the AFL starts isn’t a bad thing either. And, he’s not on the 40-man yet, so I doubt they’d feel the need to rush him. I have no idea what they think of Valaika, as he fell off a freaking cliff this year prospectwise. I’d still say they’re higher on Janish than they are Valaika, and they don’t like Janish that much.

The Wells over LeCure move is perplexing, but if you’ve been following this team, you can’t be surprised. After seeing him in action, I can say that he probably isn’t worse than Maloney, and I like him better than Ram-Ram as the long man in the ’pen at the end of the season.

The one guy who I’d be interested to see is Yonder Alonso, coming up in a PH/backup 1B role. Give him a start a week to finish out the year, see what he can do. He looked great in Louisville, and is already on the 40-man. I understand not wanting to bring him up with Joey needing starts, but giving him a cup of coffee up here wouldn’t be the worst thing in the world, would it?

"We, as for me all seasons you are affected peculiarly in the edge of my seat and are happy concerning the fact that the Adam Dunn fan has been mixed up exactly." - Reynard-san

by BK on Sep 14, 2009 3:29 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

From Mark Sheldon's article in the Reposter, it doesn't look like they'll call up Yonder

Arb clock issues could be a reason why.

by ken on Sep 14, 2009 3:44 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Makes sense, and that's a perfectly good reason not to

But he’s just as ready as any of the others, if not moreso.

"We, as for me all seasons you are affected peculiarly in the edge of my seat and are happy concerning the fact that the Adam Dunn fan has been mixed up exactly." - Reynard-san

by BK on Sep 14, 2009 3:51 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Valaika

He missed a lot of the season with an injury, which might explain his struggles.

I don’t think Heisey not being on the roster yet means anything about their plans for him. Stubbs wasn’t, either, until they decided to call him up. Neither of them needed to be on the roster; they weren’t eligible for the Rule 5 draft, and they did not have major league contracts.

Valaika and Heisey are now eligible for the Rule 5 draft. So they have to be added to the 40-man roster anyway, whether or not they are called up.

All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?

by BubbaFan on Sep 14, 2009 6:13 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

i dont think im OK with this

though his OBP was up this year, it was still only .328. he has major work to do on his discipline before he’s going to be ready. im afraid this only shows that the Reds dont give a shit about that.

or perhaps Jocko is more foxy than i give him credit for, and this is all just to try to showcase him for a trade.

by Charlie Scrabbles on Sep 14, 2009 2:20 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

This doesn't mean he is here to stay

It is a cup of coffee. Why not? The Reds most likely don’t have a spot in 2010 to start him at MLB, unless there are some trades this offseason.

Find me on MySpace- http://www.myspace.com/mixfmkyle

by MixFMKyle on Sep 14, 2009 2:25 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

yeah it's just a cup o' coffee

and im not really angry about him getting the call. im more angry about what i perceive as an organization that values him more than Todd Frazier.

by Charlie Scrabbles on Sep 14, 2009 2:28 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I think more or less it is the fact Fransisco is on the 40-Man

and Frazier is not. I know we have open spots and such, but maybe Walt has future plans.

Find me on MySpace- http://www.myspace.com/mixfmkyle

by MixFMKyle on Sep 14, 2009 2:31 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

i hope it's that simple

i really do

by Charlie Scrabbles on Sep 14, 2009 2:34 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I think that's it, too

IIRC, Frazier is not eligible for the Rule 5 draft until after next season. So the Reds don’t have to add him to the 40-man yet.

Heisey and the soul-sucker, Ben Jukich, have to be added before the rule 5 roster deadline if the Reds want to keep them. Stubbs would have had to be added, if he wasn’t already called up this year. LeCure and Francisco were already on the 40-man.

All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?

by BubbaFan on Sep 14, 2009 2:48 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I hope I'm wrong, but I've long been afraid

that Francisco is Wily Mo all over again. Somewhat different circumstances, I know, but that lack of plate discipline is scary.

We Are ... Marshall!

by Thundering Turtle on Sep 14, 2009 2:28 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I haven't been real high on Francisco because of his lack of plate discipline

we have played this game over and over again, plate discipline is not an easy skill to learn at the big league level.

Bloop

by justin007000 on Sep 14, 2009 2:29 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

i was high on francisco one time

when i watched a dragons game while listening to dark side of the moon. they matched up perfectly.

by GrooveLeg on Sep 14, 2009 4:44 PM EDT up reply actions 2 recs

Francisco and Brue and a lot of young players have to become more disciplined

It is part of making the jump from facing minor league hard throwers and MLB pitchers.

AS far as the 1 and 2 hitters go..you are p[reaching to the choir Rev. Dr. Slyde…Amen and Amen.

One tequila, two tequila, three tequila, floor.
George Carlin

by Madville on Sep 14, 2009 2:35 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Quick GABP question

are you allowed to bring in small, soft coolers to the park?

by Red_Poodle on Sep 14, 2009 4:26 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Direct from the GABP website

Plan on purchasing bottled water or peanuts before you enter the ballpark. The Reds allow soft-sided coolers that meet major league baseball requirements, 16 by 16 by 8 inches, but no glass or cans. Any drink you bring in must be unopened. Vendors on the sidewalks sell peanuts and water for a fraction of the price you pay inside.

Here’s what I use: DO NOT TELL ANYONE THAT I TOLD YOU THIS OR I WILL HAVE TO KILL YOU
http://i111.photobucket.com/albums/n143/gnostic203/Summer%20Trip%202007/Cooler.jpg

One tequila, two tequila, three tequila, floor.
George Carlin

by Madville on Sep 14, 2009 4:39 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

LOL

that is pretty amazing. Thnks for the info, I have a small cooler I think I’ll stuff a few small drinks in it and some candy bars. They might be necessary.

I ot some unexpected free tickets (not surpirsing that nobody jumped for them) so I’ll make an attempt at going down tonight.

by Red_Poodle on Sep 14, 2009 4:56 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Fix that batting order

Not enough HR power hitters, not enough timely hits, not enough RBI men, average # of hits to score a run is much higher than winning teams, base running errors; …. you name it Reds have it. We already know Taveras, Dickerson, ….. are not leadoff hitters. So what is the optimal battling order? May be Slyde (or some other numbers guy) can crunch more statistics with the ultimate objective to maximize run production. Dusty thinks Philips is his clean up batter, but Philips is not. Neither should Rolen be hitting behind the cleanup in the 5th spot. Rolen is not a power HR hitter nor an .300 hitter.

What about hitting Votto behind Bruce? Votto a better average hitter may give Bruce better looks at pitches that he can muster for HR. There is a power shortage here.

by Richard L on Sep 14, 2009 8:51 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

The problem is not the RBI guys (at least that's not the start of the problem)

the problem is that this team has a .313 OBP. Get more runners on base and they will naturally score by osmosis, or something.

Definitely a good argument.

by Slyde on Sep 14, 2009 9:43 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Ummm the problem is both the the OBP and the SLG

Even when this team gets guys on base so very often they just rot there.

One tequila, two tequila, three tequila, floor.
George Carlin

by Madville on Sep 14, 2009 10:12 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

sure, but fixing the slugging alone does a lot less than fixing the OBP alone

Get players who can get on base and Votto, BP, Bruce, and Rolen will drive them in.

Definitely a good argument.

by Slyde on Sep 14, 2009 10:23 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

obviously that means that BP and Bruce need to learn how to get on base too

Definitely a good argument.

by Slyde on Sep 14, 2009 10:23 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

that might be expecting too much

of Brandon “I don’t believe that on-base percentage stuff” Phillips.

All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?

by BubbaFan on Sep 14, 2009 10:37 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Career high in walks this year

He’s also been swinging at a lot less out of the zone.

by ken on Sep 15, 2009 8:44 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Are we sure Dickerson isn't a leadoff hitter?

by Brendanukkah on Sep 14, 2009 11:19 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Dickerson or Stubbs, I go for Stubbs. These young guys need to ride more stationary bikes in the summer or won’t last the season.

by Richard L on Sep 15, 2009 2:41 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I think I lean Dickerson

Mostly because we could then ease Stubbs into the Majors by playing both of them somewhat equally in CF.

This scenario, however, depends on Dusty’s use of both logic and the 4 million dollar man. Neither of which I’m confident he will use correctly.

by sharks on Sep 15, 2009 3:18 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I go for Dickerson, since he's actually...you know...done it at the MLB level

by timb116 on Sep 15, 2009 10:38 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

glad I'm not sick.

It’s times like this that I am glad we all know each other through this strange networks of tubes. Glad I decided to take a year off grad school, fuck swine flu. Hope you guys fell better.

I don’t mind Janish, I also wouldn’t mind making a move for Hardy and starting Gomes in RF next year.

I also wouldn’t mind signing Brandon “grew up a Reds fan” Webb to a one year flier.

by Dave from Louisville on Sep 14, 2009 11:20 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs