Red Reporter: An SB Nation Community

Navigation: Jump to content areas:


Pro Quality. Fan Perspective.
Login-facebook
Around SBN: MLB Trade Deadline: Phils, Astros complete Roy Oswalt deal

Jay Bruce is Young and Talented, But He Still Has Some Adjustments to Make

In many ways, Jay Bruce is well developed for a 22-year old player.  His 14 home runs are tied with Johnny Bench for the 2nd most in the last 50 seasons by a 22-year old hitter in a team's first 50 games.  His isolated power (slugging percentage minus batting average) ranks behind only Evan Longoria and Justin Upton this season for players under the age of 25.  And his 35 home runs in his first 157 games played are the 5th most by a player who is 22 years old or younger in the last 55 years.

But even with all of that power, Bruce still has a lot of work to do to develop his game.  I've noticed a handful of articles over the last couple of days telling us not to worry about Bruce.  And they all have a theme similar to Jason Grey from ESPN.com:

However, there are good reasons to think that average is going to be on the way up in the future. Bruce is simply too talented to hit in that range for long, especially in light of the improvements in his approach at the plate. The other reason is purely statistical. Bruce has an extremely unlucky .221 batting average on balls in play (as opposed to a .298 mark his rookie season, which was right around the norm).

How unlucky is that number? It is the third-worst BABIP mark in baseball, behind only Brian Giles and Garrett Atkins, and that's likely to even out over the balance of the season.

Grey tells us not to worry because Bruce has been one of the most unlucky players in the league.  This excites Brad Spieser at Twin Killing dot com:

I'm not sure why some of you are on Bruce's case, but hopefully the BABIP statistic will help. Just think of it like this: If Bruce's BABIP were somewhere around .280 (still below league average, but significantly better) his batting average would likely be in the .265 range and his RBI total would be closer to 40 than 30. Translation: This city would look like it was sponsored by Jay Bruce jerseys.

On the surface, these statements seem reasonable.  Once a ball is put into play, the results can be much harder to predict, especially if it's not going carry out over the wall.  However, it's not so cut-and-dry that Bruce's BABIP should be .300, just like the league average, or even .280 like Spieser simply estimates.  The fact is that while BABIP does have some luck involved, there is more that goes into it than just luck.

One thing for instance is the type of batted balls the hitter puts into play.  Here is the breakdown of BABIP by batted ball type for the last 3 seasons in the Majors:

Year GB FB LD
2007 .235 .135 .723
2008 .246 .142 .718
2009 .238 .142 .726

As you can see, how you hit the ball most definitely matters when it comes to BABIP.  And if you are wondering why flyball BABIP is so low, it's mainly because the majority of hits off of flyballs go for home runs, which are removed from BABIP.

Now let's look at Bruce's batted ball type breakdown this season:

GB FB LD
Rate 36.2% 50.4% 13.5%
BABIP .283 .036 .556

So it does indeed appear that Bruce has been somewhat unlucky, especially on flyballs and line drives.  However, Bruce's flyball percentage is in the top 10% in the Majors, while his line drive rate is the 8th lowest.  So, adjusting strictly on "luck" (i.e. setting his batted ball BABIPs to league average numbers) only gives Bruce 7 more hits on the year for a .258 batting average.  I'm sure we'd all take those 7 extra hits, but the point is that for Bruce to really make improvements in his game, it's not a matter of just waiting around for his luck to turn.  His lack of luck isn't what is killing his batting average.  His lack of line drives is.

The good news is that, as Doug Gray shows us, Bruce is slowly improving on a couple of key peripheral stats.  An increased walk-rate and a decreasing strikeout rate will go a long way toward making Bruce a more complete player.  But there is still much work to be done as neither the 8.8% walk rate or the 21.8% strikeout rate are particularly impressive. 

The biggest problem for Bruce right now appears to be strike zone recognition.  And I think Bruce understands this, at least in thought, as he told Jason Grey:

I have a plan, pitchers have a plan; it's really about who executes theirs better. It's not about taking pitches; it's about taking pitches you can't do anything with. It's about taking balls and swinging at drivable strikes.

He's still learning what those pitches are though, as he's swinging at 28.7% of the pitches out of the strike zone, but only making contact with 48% of those pitches.  Only Ryan Howard swings at more pitches out of the zone AND makes less contact.  Look for Bruce to continue to try to shrink down that strike zone to pitches he can handle as he matures.  If he can manage to do that, then he should blossom into the star we all hope he can be.

7 recs  |  Comment 32 comments |

Story-email Email Printer Print

Comments

Display:

This is an awesome post

I see so much flailing at the low and away breaking ball, but I also noticed he’s going deeper in the count. Way to break down numbers so I can hope through my tears.

by timb116 on Jun 3, 2009 1:24 PM EDT reply actions  

As usual

Fantastic Post. One would think the Reds or another MLB team would try and hire you to be their Stats analyst..

Find me on MySpace- http://www.myspace.com/mixfmkyle

by MixFMKyle on Jun 3, 2009 1:39 PM EDT reply actions  

thanks for the compliment

but there are much more advanced thinkers out there than me that should be hired by teams. I don’t have nearly enough statistical background to be considered for such a position anyway.

"It seems like we're not hitting because we're not getting hits." - Dusty being Dusty

by Slyde on Jun 3, 2009 1:45 PM EDT up reply actions  

Really, really interesting stuff

rec’d

"We, as for me all seasons you are affected peculiarly in the edge of my seat and are happy concerning the fact that the Adam Dunn fan has been mixed up exactly." - Reynard-san

by BK on Jun 3, 2009 1:48 PM EDT reply actions  

Bruce and LD's

I think its just about impossible for him to go through a season with a rate as low as it is now. He just hits the ball too hard for that to happen. And while he does have a low LD rate, his BABIP should still be 40-50 points higher than where it is currently sitting at, which would put him roughly at .253/.325/.516 if he only picked up the singles that would make up that difference.

by dougdirt on Jun 3, 2009 1:51 PM EDT reply actions  

Great stuff Slyde.

I’m confident Burce will be a great player. Thanks to your information and the way you present, now I understand more of why I think that.

We Are ... Marshall!

by Thundering Turtle on Jun 3, 2009 1:56 PM EDT reply actions  

Great Post

I just wanted to say this is one of the best posts I’ve read in a very long time. Great work putting this together. I hope Jay starts getting a little more luck soon. I’ve been living and dying with every at bat of his. Make that every pitch thrown to him.

by TheNaturalMevs on Jun 3, 2009 1:59 PM EDT reply actions  

This is a great post.

Maybe Mads should forward this to the guys he works with that are starting to call Bruce “Adam Bruce”.

It does seem that Jay has hit a lot of balls hard this year with not enough to show for it. Last night’s game being a good example, from what I heard from Marty.

I don't need a hot breakfast to have a good time.

by 3 Fast 3 Furious on Jun 3, 2009 2:30 PM EDT reply actions  

The guys I work with presently tell me over and over that there are only 5 stats to be concerned with;

1. Batting Average
2. On Base Per Centage
3. Slugging Percentage
4. Clutch hits (I’m not kidding – when I asked how to calculate that, one guy said I should just watch the games for god’s sakes…its not brain surgery) Included are RBIs and Home Runs (?)
5. W’s – the only stat that really matters.

One of the biggest Bruce detractors here (who also a President Obama basher) got in my face today and told me the following -
Jay Bruce needs to either benched or sent to AA (double) ball and told get his shit together.They (the Reds) out to bring Norris Hopper up and start getting ‘em on, move’ over and get ‘em in. He also wants Walt and bob to find a way to hire tony LaRusa while they’re at it.

"I just wanted to be like my dad, Jesus. He was a good shortstop.
Johan Santana

by Madville on Jun 3, 2009 4:04 PM EDT up reply actions  

Hmm

There is nothing wrong with bashing the President when he does dumb things. I too wouldn’t have an issue with bring in LaRussa if he brought along Dave Duncan.

by dougdirt on Jun 3, 2009 4:24 PM EDT up reply actions  

These guys spend hours bashing almost everything that Obama does

They are irrational in their dislike of him and get such a kick out of calling him Barrack Hussein Obama…I too take issue with some of the presidential goofs that Obama makes but i also give him credit when he does something that I think is a good thing.

I, on the other hand have an irrational fear of Tony LaRussa!!!!

"I just wanted to be like my dad, Jesus. He was a good shortstop.
Johan Santana

by Madville on Jun 3, 2009 4:35 PM EDT up reply actions  

You need to quit.

Eighty-five percent of the f*ckin' world is working. The other fifteen percent come out here. A f*ckin' playground for the cocks*ckers.
-Lee Elia on Cubs fans

by Farneyismycopilot on Jun 3, 2009 4:59 PM EDT up reply actions  

Will you pay me 6 figures to be the weird old man on RR?

Draw up the contract and I’ll sign it and turn in my resignation today.
But this consultancy will be over by the end of August and I’ve already been contracted to over haul an Art Gallery in the fall..

Really most of the guys here are regular old Red’s fans. They play softball and coach T-ball and support the Reds by going to games religiously. For the most part they are a nice group of men and women who are doing the best they can for their families…baseball is sacred in a sense for these guys. The game is to be ‘played the right’ – no debate – no questions asked.

"I just wanted to be like my dad, Jesus. He was a good shortstop.
Johan Santana

by Madville on Jun 3, 2009 5:09 PM EDT up reply actions  

Don't ask me man.

I’m looking for a new job myself.

Eighty-five percent of the f*ckin' world is working. The other fifteen percent come out here. A f*ckin' playground for the cocks*ckers.
-Lee Elia on Cubs fans

by Farneyismycopilot on Jun 3, 2009 5:12 PM EDT up reply actions  

Ahh, finally.

Whenever I read ‘fantasy advice’ articles, they always say things like “yada yada, this pitcher is due to have a beneficial correction because his high BABIP shows he’s just been unlucky.” This ignores the obvious fact that certain pitchers just get hit hard, with lots of strong contact, an ‘extended BP’ of sorts (see: Belisle), whereas the good ones get weak grounders or flaccid popouts. That correlation of BABIP to contact type is quite nice, and the consistency of those statistics, over the last 3 years at least, really says something.

He sits alone...Reds are not home.

by Gapper on Jun 3, 2009 3:16 PM EDT reply actions  

most interesting use

of the word ‘flaccid’ I think I’ve ever seen.

Isn't there a slanket somewhere you should be filling with your farts?

by nycredsfan on Jun 3, 2009 6:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

Honest to God.....

I’d do anything it took that a fan could possibly do to get Jay Bruce some more hits in the box scores….. I want this kid to succeed in a big way (and I know he will eventually) but the future is now. I want him to somehow end up at .270

by TheNaturalMevs on Jun 3, 2009 3:20 PM EDT reply actions  

literally

I’d eat a spoonful of poop if it would get Bruce on a hitting streak.

by TheNaturalMevs on Jun 3, 2009 3:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

with cheese?

Will you stop it with the vegetables

by Man Mountain on Jun 3, 2009 3:35 PM EDT up reply actions  

Rimshot!

He sits alone...Reds are not home.

by Gapper on Jun 3, 2009 3:44 PM EDT up reply actions  

no, he requested a spoon

Will you stop it with the vegetables

by Man Mountain on Jun 3, 2009 3:48 PM EDT up reply actions  

woah.

you just blew my mind. that’s good stuff.

He sits alone...Reds are not home.

by Gapper on Jun 3, 2009 4:21 PM EDT up reply actions  

Great stuff Slyde.

This was eye-opening. Having watched Bruce this year it always seemed like he was lofting a lot of balls for lazy flyouts, but now looking at the statistics it’s even more than I thought. I’m wondering if it’s something in his mechanics.

Eighty-five percent of the f*ckin' world is working. The other fifteen percent come out here. A f*ckin' playground for the cocks*ckers.
-Lee Elia on Cubs fans

by Farneyismycopilot on Jun 3, 2009 5:10 PM EDT reply actions  

what's weird is that Jason Grey seems to think it's totally a good thing
That focus is allowing him to do more with the pitches he’s swinging at. Bruce’s fly-ball rate has shot up more than 15 percent this season, which is driving his power surge. With his swing plane, more solid contact on the barrel means more balls in the air, and more balls with a chance to leave the yard.

I’m not totally opposed to his increased fly ball rate, but I wish it wasn’t at the expense of his line drive rate. I don’t expect that his line drive rate will remain so low though. I imagine baseball is such that you can really only work on one thing at a time, and if he’s trying to work on his control of the strike zone, that should be his focus. Once he gets better at that, then he focus on adjust his swing plane a bit to not loft the ball so much. Personally, I think managing the strike zone is much more important for him anyway.

"It seems like we're not hitting because we're not getting hits." - Dusty being Dusty

by Slyde on Jun 3, 2009 5:59 PM EDT up reply actions  

Agreed

only swinging at hittable pitches is bound to mean more solid contact, therefore more line drives and fly balls that leave the yard.

I was wondering after reading your post why he would have such a huge drop in average from his minors career, but not in his power. He’s still crushing strikes, but I’m guessing MLB pitchers are painting the corners much more than he’s seen and also throwing near strikes much more than guys in the minors.

Also, his LD% was 22% last year, so that’s reason to be hopeful too.

Isn't there a slanket somewhere you should be filling with your farts?

by nycredsfan on Jun 3, 2009 6:27 PM EDT up reply actions  

Slyde, you sir, are a fountain of information

I agree that working on managing the strike zone should be his top priority, but all the highflys with no outcome = bad news. Here’s hoping he gets in sync.

Eighty-five percent of the f*ckin' world is working. The other fifteen percent come out here. A f*ckin' playground for the cocks*ckers.
-Lee Elia on Cubs fans

by Farneyismycopilot on Jun 3, 2009 6:58 PM EDT up reply actions  

even with all the possible negatives

its hard not to be glass half full with this guy.

by OURob on Jun 3, 2009 5:44 PM EDT reply actions  

Can't say it better than those before me

VERY, very nice work, Slyde. You’ve gone back-to-back with this and the LF-hex post!
Bravo Zulu!

"Whether you like it or not, history is on our side. We will bury you!"

by "Red" Moskau on Jun 3, 2009 7:49 PM EDT reply actions  

Pffft

He sure looks like Kingman.

Sincerely,

Pronto

by ken on Jun 3, 2009 8:24 PM EDT reply actions  

deja vu

another night, another game in which bruce leads off the game with a shot that ends up an out. this sucks

by TheNaturalMevs on Jun 3, 2009 8:39 PM EDT reply actions  

Comments For This Post Are Closed


User Tools

Welcome to the SB Nation blog about Cincinnati Reds. Community Guidlines
Start posting about the Reds »

Join SB Nation and dive into communities focused on all your favorite teams.

Connect_with_facebook

FanPosts

Community blog posts and discussion.

Recent FanPosts

Herve_small
OFF DAY DOPPLEGANGER PARTY!!
12755_172185683753_502418753_2742536_4790236_n_small
Reds vs Cardinals: Who's got the Edge
Vada_jersey_small
This Day in Reds History - July 29
Small
Recap of GABP Visit
Vada_jersey_small
This Day in Reds History - July 28
Vada_jersey_small
This Day in Reds History - July 27
Reds_small
Some Bats That Could Be Available?
Vada_jersey_small
This Day in Reds History - July 26
Vada_jersey_small
This Day in Reds History - July 25
Small
Where's the love for Mike Leake?

+ New FanPost All FanPosts >

FanShots

Quick hits of video, photos, quotes, chats, links and lists that you find around the web.

Recent FanShots

Getting Autographs at Cincinnati Reds Games
Oswalt to Phillies, via Rosenthal
Reds-Dodgers rivalry is back ON, son!
If Oswalt Becomes a Cardinal, I might Poop my Pants a Little
Available?
James Gammon, played Lou Brown in 'Major League,' dies at 70
Reds have easiest remaining schedule in the majors
Cordero is a Coronary Waiting to Happen
Braves better with Gonzales? Really?
Reds' Votto dislikes Cubs, disses All-Star Teammate Byrd

+ New FanShot All FanShots >

SBNation.com Recent Stories

HOUSTON - JULY 24:  Pitcher Roy Oswalt #44 of the Houston Astros throws against the Cincinnati Reds in the first inning at Minute Maid Park on July 24 2010 in Houston Texas.  (Photo by Bob Levey/Getty Images) +13 updates

Done Deal: Roy Oswalt Traded To Phillies, Will Make Debut Friday Night In Washington

Washington Nationals' third base coach Pat Listach shakes Adam Dunn's hand who rounds third after hitting a solo home run during the eighth inning of a baseball game against the Atlanta Braves, Thursday, July 29, 2010, in Washington. (AP Photo/Drew Angerer)

MLB Trade Deadline: Where Does Your Team Stand As Saturday Approaches?

Philadelphia Phillies' Cody Ransom, left, celebrates with Greg Dobbs (19) and Placido Polanco after Ransom scored on a single hit by Wilson Valdez against the  Arizona Diamondbacks to win the baseball game in the 11th inning Thursday, July 29, 2010, in Philadelphia. The Phillies won 3-2. (AP Photo/H. Rumph Jr)

Phillies Complete Sweep Of D'Backs With 11th-Inning Win

More from SBNation.com >


Manager

Redsmouth_small Slyde

Bench Coaches

Carly_gangsta_small jch24

How-thomas-the-tank-engine-works-11_small BK

Happyhanukkah_small Brendanukkah

417898_small Gray

Jinaz-reds-avatar_small JinAZ

Baseballbugs-thumb_small Charlie Scrabbles

Casey_small RijoSaboCaseyWKRP

Untitled_small nycredsfan

Beat Reporters

Ken_fish_called_wanda_small ken

Tinytim_small andromache

Small riverfront76