The Greatest Reds: #23 - #21
23. Adam Dunn
| Played as Red | Primary Position | Career Rank | Peak Rank | Prime Rank |
| 2001-2008 | LF, RF | 24 | 22 | 19 |
| Percent Breakdown of Value | Best Season | Best player on Reds | ||
| Hit | Field | Pitch | 2004 | 2004, 2005, 2007 |
| 92% | 8% | 0% | ||
| Awards/Honors as a Red | Leading the League | On the Reds Leaderboard | ||
| All Star – 2002 | Walks – 2008 |
-1st in career AB/HR ratio |
||
The Big Donkey. Dunn was an incredibly divisive character during his time with the Reds, owing to his prodigious power, remarkably high strikeout totals, and disinterested defense. Although he was traded before the 2008 trade deadline, Dunn was consistent with his home run output, hitting 46 in 2004 before running off four straight seasons of exactly 40. However, despite the power (Dunn was also good for 25-35 doubles a year), Dunn’s run production was suspect, topping out at just 106 RBI in his peak year. The high strikeouts (led the league in each year from 2004-2006) belied a strong command of the strike zone, as Dunn was generally a lock for over 100 walks each year, leading to his on-base percentage with the Reds running 133 points higher than his career batting average. Ultimately, despite being the best Red of the first decade in the 21st century, Dunn was marked for what he couldn’t do, namely lead the Reds to a winning mark. He was traded in 2008 for Micah Owings and Wilkin Castillo.
22. Paul Derringer
| Played as Red | Primary Position | Career Rank | Peak Rank | Prime Rank |
| 1933-1942 | SP | 18 | 24 | 28 |
| Percent Breakdown of Value | Best Season | Best player on Reds | ||
| Hit | Field | Pitch | 1939 | 1935 |
| 0% | 0% | 100% | ||
| Awards/Honors as a Red | Leading the League | On the Reds Leaderboard | ||
| All Star – 1935, 1938, 1939, 1940, 1941, 1942 | Home Runs Per Inning – 1933 Games Started – 1936, 1938, 1940 Games Pitched – 1936 Innings Pitched – 1938 Complete Games – 1938 W-L Percentage – 1939 Strikeout / Walk Ratio – 1939 Walks Per Inning – 1939, 1940 |
-3rd in career wins |
||
The Reds traded two washed-up players and a never-would-be to the Cardinals for Derringer and a pair of others early on in the 1933 season. Derringer’s introduction was suspect: losing 25 games with the Reds despite a 105 ERA+. He lost over 20 games the next year as well, despite improving his rate stats. Through the 1937 season, Derringer was roughly an average pitcher, with a losing record compiled for a lousy team. Over the next three seasons, Derringer was a very good #2 pitcher for a much improved team, going 66-33 with a 2.97 ERA (126 ERA+) over 904 innings in that stretch. In the 1940 World Series, Derringer was rewarded with the Game 1 starting assignment. He was knocked out of the game before recording his 5th out, allowing 5 runs. He bounced back nicely, with complete game victories in games 4 and 7, the latter a stunning 2-1 thriller. Over his 10 seasons with Cincinnati, Derringer amassed 161 wins and threw for a 111 ERA+ in over 2600 innings.
21. Ken Griffey, Sr
| Played as Red | Primary Position | Career Rank | Peak Rank | Prime Rank |
| 1973-81, 1988-90 | RF, 1B, CF, LF | 19 | 26 | 24 |
| Percent Breakdown of Value | Best Season | Best player on Reds | ||
| Hit | Field | Pitch | 1976 | 1980 |
| 88% | 12% | 0% | ||
| Awards/Honors as a Red | Leading the League | On the Reds Leaderboard | ||
| All Star MVP – 1980 All Star – 1976, 1977, 1980 |
N/A |
-14th in career runs scored |
||
Presumably one of the best players ever selected in the 29th round of the amateur draft, Griffey went on to have a career that spanned 19 seasons. It’s difficult to tie together Griffey’s numbers with my standing perception of the player…it feels like something’s missing from the stats. For example, in Griffey’s first stint with the Reds, he played in a little over 1000 games. If the cumulative stats from those years are normalized to represent an average 162-game year, his stat line looks like this: 307/375/437 (125 OPS+), 162 games, 597 AB, 104 runs, 184 hits, 31 2B, 9 3B, 9 HR, 66 RBI, 23 SB, 65 BB. Good numbers, to be sure, but: A) he really only averaged 116 games played per year in that stint; and B) even bumped up to the 162 game normalization, the numbers don’t evoke visions of a starting right-fielder on one of the greatest offensive teams in baseball history. It’s possible I’m not taking the era enough into account, so maybe this is overly harsh. Additionally, the numbers seem to indicate a below-average fielder, despite Griffey’s legendary speed. Other notes: 1) in his career season of 1976, Griffey had his one great offensive season, hitting for a 140 OPS+ and adding 34 steals; 2) to his credit, Griffey’s decline was very slow, and he remained a useful hitter into his 40’s; 3) Griffey’s postseason performances were hit or miss, but overall they were on the weak side (.240 batting average, 661 OPS in 83 plate appearances); and 4) Senior had about 800 more plate appearances with the Reds than his son. And though there styles of play were as different as good be, Senior’s OPS+ with Cincy ended up at 123, just edging out Junior’s 122 mark. I’m sure this comes up a lot at family reunions, and not Junior’s lifetime 480 home run advantage.
The Top 15 Right Fielders in Reds history
1 Ken Griffey, Sr
2 Ival Goodman
3 Mike Mitchell
4 Curt Walker
6 Dusty Miller
7 Paul O'Neill
8 Dave Parker
9 Greasy Neale
10 Wally Post
11 Sam Crawford
12 Johnny Wyrostek
13 Tommy Harper
14 Dave Collins
15 Tommy Griffith
0 recs |
27 comments
|
Comments
I was really surprised to see how little of Griffey's value came from his defense
For as great of an offense as The Big Red Machine had, its defense was pretty incredible too, particularly up the middle. Bench, Concepcion and Morgan, and Geronimo patrolling CF. I always assumed Griffey was part of that equation, but it looks like maybe he wasn’t. What an interesting player. A ton of speed, but not many SB and nothing notable on defense. Not much power, but a higher OPS+ than his son. I sometimes wish that the Reds had kept him on the 1990 team all the way through the World Series, but alas.
How much of his value to the Reds comes from fathering one of the greatest baseball players of all time?
TotalZone doesn't like his defense much either
It puts him at -9 runs during his first stint with the Reds.
Definitely a good argument.
Posnanski's book The Machine
talks a lot about Griffey wasn’t happy because Sparky wouldn’t let him steal bases because he batted in front of Morgan, and Morgan didn’t like guys stealing in front of him because it distracted him.
Griffey supposedly was faster than Morgan. He would have had a ton of steals if he had the green light.
My fantasy football team this year? Lippincott's Shorts
by cesarhernandez on Nov 25, 2009 1:38 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah, I've read it
Griffey seems a lot like Dunn in that they were both very gifted players, but the Reds didn’t quite know how to maximize their abilities on the team.
by Brendanukkah on Nov 25, 2009 1:42 PM EST up reply actions
That's kind of a sorry list of right fielders too
I will really be looking forward to Jay Bruce rocketing up that chart.
i'm looking forward to seeing Austin Kearns rocket up that chart.
by Brian B on Nov 25, 2009 1:41 PM EST via mobile up reply actions 3 recs
that's what he said?
"There is no harder thing than to have Glenn Beck outlive your child."-The Onion
by justin007000 on Nov 28, 2009 1:16 AM EST up reply actions
Bruce is already top 5-6
Don't pick a fight with an old man. If he is too old to fight, he'll just kill you.
BTW
I’m really excited for the top 20, though I can only find 18 players that are missing, so I’m interested to find out who I missed.
Definitely a good argument.
you probably forgot these two
Paul Householder and Dann Billardello
by riverfront76 on Nov 25, 2009 4:29 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Juan Castro
His defensive reputation contributed 130%, which made up for the negative 30% on offense.
by Brian B on Nov 25, 2009 8:56 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Thinking back on the Adam Dunn trade is always a bummer
You can certainly make the case for not re-signing him last offseason – and therefore not offering arbitration and instead trading him at the deadline in ’08 – based mostly on his defense. It seems to have gotten worse, limiting him to 1.2 WAR last year. The real tragedy is what the Reds chose to do with the money freed up by not re-signing Dunn. $2.25MM to Taveras, $1.5MM to Lincoln, $2MM to Jerry Hairston and about a net $4MM to Ramon Hernandez. The Reds could have brought Weathers back and signed Arthur Rhodes and had around $7MM-$9MM to work with.
Yeah, those guys and the Cincinnati Reds. They're a terrible football team. / Because they're a baseball team? / Exactly. You know who's the worst football team? The Philadelphia Flyers. - Best Show
by RijoSaboCaseyWKRP on Nov 25, 2009 12:59 PM EST reply actions
did Hernandez make more than Freel?
"There is no harder thing than to have Glenn Beck outlive your child."-The Onion
by justin007000 on Nov 28, 2009 1:17 AM EST up reply actions
Is the final list going to be made a fixture on the main page?
Yeah, those guys and the Cincinnati Reds. They're a terrible football team. / Because they're a baseball team? / Exactly. You know who's the worst football team? The Philadelphia Flyers. - Best Show
by RijoSaboCaseyWKRP on Nov 25, 2009 1:07 PM EST reply actions
You know Adam...
Adam from Milwaukee. The southside of Milwaukee no less. So watch the jokes because he’ll cut you.
Don't pick a fight with an old man. If he is too old to fight, he'll just kill you.
Was that the guy who got drunk with his pregnant wife, only to have deformed child that resembles his mom/sister?
Yea I’m glad hes not in Cincinnati anymore
Start SEEing motorcycles
I'ma bet there's no marriage there
Hell, I’d take 5-1 odds that if it’s his girlfriend, he’s not the father.
"Santa Claus doesn't use Craigslist." -- 'tHan
bottom line
ya gotta trade a top 25 alltime Red to nab Micah Owings.
ya only have to trade Wily Mo to nab Bronson Arroyo.
go Micah!
"Nate Silver is a genius" .... BK
You're kidding right...
Only thing Owings is going to excel at at the MLB level is PH.
1. He’s not starter material
2. He’s too expensive as a long reliever
3. He apparently isn’t interested in learning to play LF
4. His facial hair is weird
5. He’s a bit more valuable than Rosales..a bit..
I may be drunk, Miss, but in the morning I will be sober and you will still be ugly.
Winston Churchill
he isn't very good
and he doesn’t get on base much, so while his power is nice for a pitcher/pinch hitter, he would be a below average offensesive position player.
"There is no harder thing than to have Glenn Beck outlive your child."-The Onion
by justin007000 on Nov 28, 2009 1:18 AM EST up reply actions

by 























