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Where will these prospects wind up? LOG-JAM

As many of you know, we currently have a bit of a log-jam with our top prospects.  Yonder 1b, Frazier SS, Valaika SS, Francisco 3B, Soto 3B.  

 

 

Star-divide

Alonso - Yonder has Votto blocking his path at first. Some say they will move Votto to LF once Yonder is ready.

Frazier- He's currently a SS but most people project him to play LF.  However, that is a problem because Votto is supposedly moving out there.  Todd is blocked in RF by bruce, and doesn't have the ability to play center.  He could play third, but we have Edwin, Francisco, and Soto there.  Phillips blocks his path at second. I think there is actually a chance that either he, or Valaika sticks at short.

Valaika - He's a shortstop but lacks the major league range. He has improved his decent in the past year, but people say he is more of a 2b. Phillips has that spot locked down in the short-term, so who knows Chris will play.

Francisco - People are saying that he will move from 3b because he can't field. That's actually not true. He is the best defensive 3b in the system.  My guess is that he will come up as 3b.  Although he is huge, I've read that he has great quickness in his feet, and is quite agile.  A move to first makes sense, but once again he is blocked by Yonder/Votto. Edwin isn't going to be able to move to left because of Votto/Frazier who they want to play there. It's difficult.

Soto - He is a ways down the road from the bigs, but in 1-2 years from now, he will be knocking on our door.  I think he will wind up playing whatever position we need at the time he is called up, whether it be third or an outfield spot.  Only time will tell.

Of course this is a good problem to have. I love that we have all this talent coming up, and it makes me excited.  I think there has to be a trade in the near future so we can make room for some of these guys, and improve our ballclub in other areas of need.

What do you guys think will happen with this log-jam.  Will we wind up trading one of these young prospects? Or is it Edwin that is on his way out?  Let us know your ideas.

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Anyone else think Phillips might be moved?

He’s fresh off a 30-30 campaign, and then winning a Gold Glove. He’s obviously an asset, but he’s also the most valuable piece that we’ve got. More so than Edwin, I would think, who hasn’t really established himself yet. But Phillips might be able to net us something in a trade, and clear some room for someone like Valaika. It might be more likely that they build around Phillips though and make him one of the faces of the franchise.

I don’t really see Edwin being long for this team.

by Brendanukkah on Jan 13, 2009 4:33 PM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

agreed on BP

he would my #1 prime trade chip this coming July, but unfortunately he is exactly the kind of guy that i think Walt and Dusty want to build around. BP is great, but i think his perceived value is much much higher than his actual value. i would not be surprised if some team was more than willing to give up a few top prospects for him.

by Charlie Scrabbles on Jan 13, 2009 4:39 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I'm not sure if he'd fetch that much

I think teams want a super-star if they’re giving up a few top prospects. And while his extension doesn’t put him near Michael Young territory, it’s still a lot of money ($24 m) that teams usually don’t want to commit to a 2B.

by ken on Jan 13, 2009 4:57 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

i dont know about that

he isnt paid like a superstar until the last year of the deal (and the extension, if its picked up), and even then he’s not really overpaid. the rest of his contract looks like this: 09:$4.75M, 10:$6.75M, 11:$11M, 12:$12M club option ($1M buyout). he’s been worth 19.6 and 14.4 mil the past two seasons according to FanGraphs, so he would have to fall off a bit in his peak years to be overpaid. of course, youre right that most teams dont like to commit that kinda cash (11 mil) to 2B, but as his contract stands right now its a three year deal at 7.5 per year. i can see a team (Mets?) jumping all over that.

by Charlie Scrabbles on Jan 13, 2009 6:38 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

19.6? really?

I’m not saying you’re lying whatsoever, that number just blows me away.

"I AM ARABIC FOR SUGAR!!!!!!!!!!!!!" -- by sukr on Jan 12, 2009 4:55 PM EST

by jch24 on Jan 13, 2009 9:07 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

that's retarded

you don’t trade a player when he’s the best person at his position in the league, esp. one that’s young but just enough older to lead the young studs you have coming up.

by Daedalus on Jan 13, 2009 4:54 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I don't think trading Phillips is a bad idea

but I would want a nice package of prospects for him. I wouldn’t take him off the table. I hope EdE can settle down at third next year, and we can then trade him mid-season to a contender who is willing to pay a price. I like EdE but with all the talent in the minors somethings gotta give.

"Oedipus ruined a great sex life by asking too many questions!"- Dr. Stephen T. Colbert DFA.

by justin007000 on Jan 13, 2009 4:57 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

only because of the brash attitude

would I consider trading BP (with a nice haul), if not for that I would consider him untouchable

by jacob brumfield on Jan 14, 2009 3:42 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

BP is not the best 2B in the league

but I wouldn’t trade him and I don’t think there is any way Walt does either.

We’’re in process of trying to a guy with a trade record of working with pitches

by Slyde on Jan 13, 2009 5:00 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Eh

I would argue Phillips may be in the top 5 in the NL at the position, but he isn’t close to being #1 or #2.

by dougdirt on Jan 13, 2009 5:18 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

who's better?

Luis Castillo? no
Dan Uggla? no
Mark DeRosa? no
Kelly Johnson? no
Freddy Sanchez? no
Kaz Matsui? no
Adam Kennedy? no
Felipe Lopez? no
Ronnie Belliard? no
Aaron Miles? no
Ronny Cedeno? no
Ricky Weeks? no
Jeff Baker? no
Eric Young? no
Kevin Frandsen? no
Mark Loretta? no
Eugenio Velez? no
Edgar Gonzalez? no
Augie Ojeda? no
Who’d I miss? no

The only competition with BP is Orlando Hudson, and I think BP is better than he is.

by Daedalus on Jan 13, 2009 6:02 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

dan uggla did have that stellar all star game

Also, I'm given to understand that your mother is overweight.

by chandrathan on Jan 13, 2009 6:35 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

that's a coincidence and irrelevant

Also, I'm given to understand that your mother is overweight.

by chandrathan on Jan 13, 2009 8:19 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   2 recs

I('ve missed that

"I AM ARABIC FOR SUGAR!!!!!!!!!!!!!" -- by sukr on Jan 12, 2009 4:55 PM EST

by jch24 on Jan 13, 2009 9:08 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

that all depends

If you are talking about defensively, Phillips is the #1 2b in all the majors in my opinion. The only guy that can compete with him is O-Dog, maybe Utley If you are talking about offensively, I would have to put Phillips either 3-4 Utley, Pedroia, Kinsler, are all very good with the stick, although Phillips runs a little more then them. Overall, I would put Phillips anywhere from 2-4. Utley is the best all around, then its a dog fight between the other three. All are very good.

by BruzFan on Jan 13, 2009 5:36 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Lets calm down

Utley has one more year of 500 PA`s than B-Phil at two years older. Fielding % wise they are about dead even career wise, the advantage to BP. B-Phil is a 30-30 guy and a 20-20 guy, two things Utley hasnt done….he also doesnt have a gold glove.

Utley does however have a world series ring, and is a better hitter, but overall I dont really think he is in a “league of his own” actually, Id probably put him in the same league as Phillips, this is when comparing 2B around the league

by Reynard on Jan 13, 2009 10:02 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

It's pretty remarkable

how differently we evaluate ballplayers.

by Red Menace on Jan 15, 2009 10:11 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

is this Siyde

or Slydie?

"Oedipus ruined a great sex life by asking too many questions!"- Dr. Stephen T. Colbert DFA.

by justin007000 on Jan 13, 2009 5:29 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Brandon is a fine

player. But, he is no where near the best player at his position in the league. Most best players in their league have to top an 800 OPS and get on base more than 31% of the time. Brandon does what a second baseman should do (play outstanding defense) and he gives you a little extra. but, he is an out machine , who should bat in the top half rarely. “Building around him” is different than “marketing around him.” The Red should do the latter and not the former.

By the way, Chase Utley is heads and shoulders above most infielders in the NL, let alone second basemen. As much as I like BP, he can’t carry Utley jock.

by timb116 on Jan 14, 2009 10:00 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

from FanGraphs

top 2B the past 2 seasons, in Value Wins

Chase Utley – 16
Dustin Pedroia – 10.3
Brian Roberts – 9.1
Brandon Phillips – 8
Placido Polanco – 7.4
Mark DeRosa – 7.4
Mark Ellis – 7

so yeah, Utley is basically twice the ballplayer BP is according to these numbers. but 4th best is still damn good. i’ll take it every day of the week.

by Charlie Scrabbles on Jan 14, 2009 12:18 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

wasn't the original discussion about the NL only?

Here’s Doug’s original comment

Eh

I would argue Phillips may be in the top 5 in the NL at the position, but he isn’t close to being #1 or #2.

All Mickey Mouse films are founded on the motif of leaving home in order to learn what fear is.

by Man Mountain on Jan 14, 2009 12:35 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

ah, yes youre right

then i whole-heartedly agree. BP is the second-best second-sacker in the NL.

by Charlie Scrabbles on Jan 14, 2009 12:43 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Yeah

and when you look at the list of NL second baseman, I don’t think we’re doing too badly. He isn’t going to compare to Utley, but I don’t think there are any other 2B in the NL that you can say are absolutely, without a doubt better than BP.

"You are not my ass." - Reynard

by BK on Jan 14, 2009 12:43 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Love BP's enthusiasm

…but I think he’s most likely to move— and should probably go before 30-30 is a faded memory. His righty-lefty splits are atrocious and he doesn’t have enough power to justify that many strikeouts.

EdE is a Red for life in my book after his “He’s Just Not Clutch” homer— move him to LF, move him to 1B, bring him off the bench, just keep him around to antagonize sMarty and Cowboy.

Whether you like it or not, history is on our side. We will bury you.

by "Red" Moskau on Jan 13, 2009 7:24 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I wouldn't want to move him

I think he is our best player, personally. His defense is unbelievable, and he has good pop. His average should come around if they get him out of the 4 hole also. I like him for his hustle the most though. He is always tryin to out-hustle the other team, and its fun to watch, like the numerous times he’s tried to steal two bases at once when the shift was on. Me, as a fan, thats what I live for.

by BruzFan on Jan 13, 2009 4:49 PM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Phillips aggressiveness on the base paths

while exciting, I would bet is a net negative for the Reds offense. He gets himself thrown out way too much. And he isn’t on base nearly enough to waste outs while there IMO.

What Phillips really needs to work on is his OBP. That’s what keeps him from being as valuable as he’s perceived.

His defense, of course, is nails.

All Mickey Mouse films are founded on the motif of leaving home in order to learn what fear is.

by Man Mountain on Jan 13, 2009 6:29 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I dont agree with this SB argument at all

BP scored 80 runs last year and 107 the year before. That isnt from having a high OBP….and the only other recent red that has hit that mark was Dunn, who had 107 exactly as his high, thats about 30 more than Edwin has had in his best season….when Dunn did it he had 100+ walks and 40 HR, so he matched BP, but obviously BP doesnt have the ability to hit like Dunn so how did he score?

I just refuse to believe that a whole dimension of the game is “negative” for the team. I really doubt it, and before Ruth was throwing down dogs and crushing baseballs stolen bases was the excitement in baseball.

In 7 seasons Ty Cobb scored 107 or more runs…in a 24 year career. It just so happens the year that he had the highest amount of runs (144) he had 96 stolen bases….oh and three home runs. Here is some algebra……………………………. If SB=runs and runs=good than stolen bases must=good!

by Reynard on Jan 13, 2009 10:19 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I think you've misplaced your math

The year Ty Cobb had 96 SB, his OBP was .486. I would bet that has as much to do with as the SB (as you’ve acknowledged while I type this).

Also, the game was totally different back then. SB meant more because it was harder to score on home runs. The ball didn’t travel as far because of how it was made and the parks were larger. That environment requires a totally different strategy and getting thrown out 38 times trying to steal didn’t hurt as much because you weren’t risking taking a run off of the base in front of a HR hitter.

We’’re in process of trying to a guy with a trade record of working with pitches

by Slyde on Jan 13, 2009 10:24 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Plus to get to the ballpark

you had to walk uphill both ways in snow while barefoot. That must have been hard to hit the ball far when you had to do all that. That’s why some of the home runs Babe Ruth hit bounced and went out and they let those count. And they didn’t have those fandangled books that make the kids robots these days, by god, when they played, they had to learn a pitcher for themselves. They were men back then. Today’s kids are all Gucci.

by Daedalus on Jan 13, 2009 10:44 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I know Slyde

It was called the deadball era, its stars were Wagner and Cobb, this era lasted until 1920, where at that point it become the Ruth era…the deadball era was characterized by large stadiums, and bigger fields than we have now, and the ball was different than the modern one.

Yes, these were times when it wasnt uncommon to have more than one twenty win pitcher on your team, or a player batting over .400, Cobb of course was the hero of the deadball era, but his ruthless competitive nature may have been the reason why he never won a world series, though he holds an amazing .366 lifetime BA.

During this time player managers were common such as Napoleon Lajoie or “Nap” as he was called.

The deadball also saw the fiery John McGraw and the polar opposite in manager Connie Mack. My, they had very different temperments did they not?

by Reynard on Jan 13, 2009 11:52 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Of course

Before Ruth and the end of the “Deadball Era” there is the case of Frank “Home Run” Baker, who was known as a slugger, hitting 11 home runs in a season….and suddenly that name left quickly, because there is no point being called “Home Run” Baker when your teamate hit 54 home runs the first year you were on the team together…

I think the nickname probably fell off Baker name like the 3rd week of the season in 1920?

by Reynard on Jan 13, 2009 11:57 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

More math

First, the simple stuff. Cobb scored >107 8 times, not 7.

154 games < 162; so BP scoring 107 is like Cobb scoring 102, which Cobb accomplished 11 times. More importantly, that 80, once you adjust for schedule and era, is more like 74. So BP’s 2nd best season in scoring is worse than 18 seasons by Cobb. Finally,

when Dunn did it he had 100+ walks and 40 HR, so he matched BP, but obviously BP doesnt have the ability to hit like Dunn so how did he score?

When BP scored those 107 runs he always hit in front of Dunn and often hit in front of Jr (in one of Jr’s better years as a Red); when Dunn scored 107 runs he hit in front of Joe Randa and Sean Casey.

But it’s much, much more simple than that. Scoring runs is about capitalizing on opportunities. If a runner is getting caught too often (removing himself from the base paths), he’s hurting his team. Luckily, for his career BP is a 75% basestealer – that is a little above the break even point. But last year, he hurt the team; at 69%, he cost the team runs.

So, in sum, you’re mixing or ignoring too many different factors. BP hit in front of a couple of good sluggers in a relatively high-scoring era; he should be expected to score some runs. Put him in a different era, or a different place in the lineup, and his run total doesn’t look so impressive.

Often wrong, never uncertain.

by sidnancy on Jan 13, 2009 11:16 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Im just saying compared to other players on the Reds

Phillips scoring over 100 is impressive, and he just so happens to have more stolen bases that many in the past years on the team

by Reynard on Jan 14, 2009 12:00 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

FWIW

BP was +0.8 runs on the bases last year, and +1.9 runs on the bases in 2007, according to BPro. He’s one of the few people I don’t mind being aggressive because I think he’s both fast, and a smart base runner. Unlike Freel or CoPat.

We’’re in process of trying to a guy with a trade record of working with pitches

by Slyde on Jan 13, 2009 10:27 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Interesting

I have very bad memories of his base running last season. Particularly in trying to take extra bases.

Good to know it isn’t a huge problem.

All Mickey Mouse films are founded on the motif of leaving home in order to learn what fear is.

by Man Mountain on Jan 13, 2009 11:18 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I mean

he has stolen third base from first base twice

by Reynard on Jan 14, 2009 12:00 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Yes, but he's also been thrown out a number of times attempting this

It’s not a bad move, because he was on ahead of Dunn and defenses would employ the shift. At that point, the third baseman was playing where the shortstop should be and no one was covering the bag at third. It’s a gamble for sure, but not a stupid one to take. Unfortunately, it seemed like BP would attempt this far too often. It almost became expected that if he got on ahead of Dunn, he was going to try for third.

But let’s also consider what good being on third is with Dunn at the plate. He’s a masher. He very infamously does not hit sacrifice flies, and a person of BP’s speed could well score from second on one of Dunn’s non-homer hits as well as from third. The biggest positive to be gained would be minimizing double play options, because Dunn walked so much. If BP is on third and Dunn walks, then there’s no force at third for the next batter. But if he’s on second and Dunn walks, then each of the bags is a force out. Now, is that scenario worth attempting a two base steal so often? I don’t think so.

BP’s an exciting runner, and for the most part, a good one. But much like his power stroke, he’d be better served by playing within himself a bit more and not trying for the home run or flashy steal every time.

by Brendanukkah on Jan 14, 2009 10:09 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

it became expected of him?

he only did it twice. I wish he had done it more. Teams wouldn’t have been able to use the shift on Dunn in those times.

by Daedalus on Jan 14, 2009 12:00 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

He got caught one of those times, didn't he?

Doesn’t seem like much of a deterrent if even with the shift on, he can be thrown out half of the time.

We want to build long period of time. I didn’t come here for the shot run.

by Gray on Jan 14, 2009 12:10 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Are you sure?

I seem to remember him being thrown out at least once when he tried this. I’m hoping you have some evidence, because I don’t, and I really don’t want the two of us to just be relying on our memories.

by Brendanukkah on Jan 14, 2009 1:01 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

are we sure he's done it twice?

He did it in the game ’nukkah was at. This game, 4th inning.

And then he tried it again in this game, but was thrown out going to third with Wakefield covering. (2nd inning, just before Dunn homered)

And then he tried it again in this game (6th inning), and would have been out except for an error.

We’’re in process of trying to a guy with a trade record of working with pitches

by Slyde on Jan 14, 2009 1:05 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I've looked at every other game where he's had 2 SB in the game

and the first link above was the time he was successful stealing both 2nd and 3rd.

We’’re in process of trying to a guy with a trade record of working with pitches

by Slyde on Jan 14, 2009 1:06 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I was at the Wakefield game. He was out pretty handily.

Thanks again, OD, for the tickets… 7 mos later.

"Yes, and it's so important in this sport that the athletes be able to train in the same location." -Cynthia Potter, NBC Synchronized Diving Analyst

by 3 Fast 3 Furious on Jan 14, 2009 1:12 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

The error in the Padres game

that was a crazy play.

Here’s the game thread:
http://www.redreporter.com/2008/7/23/577486/game-103-thread-2

All Mickey Mouse films are founded on the motif of leaving home in order to learn what fear is.

by Man Mountain on Jan 14, 2009 1:22 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Okay

That wasn’t a 2-base steal attempt. That was two separate plays. First BP stole 2nd. Then Maddux tried to pick him off. The BBRef description was deceptive, but I looked at the Retrosheet logs and there were 2 pickoff attempts at 2B before the next pitch, that’s why BP moved to 3B.

We’’re in process of trying to a guy with a trade record of working with pitches

by Slyde on Jan 14, 2009 1:38 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

i was at that first game, too, sitting next to 'nukkah

i did forget about the red sox game, but i know there was another one in 2007. i watched one on television and one in person. it couldn’t have been a dream. i didn’t see that padres game because i was in a place without a television at that time.

by Daedalus on Jan 14, 2009 1:36 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

You may be thinking of a case where he stole 2B and advanced on a wild pitch or throw

but he’s only had 8 games where he’s been credited with multiple stolen bases and only one of those cases did the steals happen in the same at bat.

We’’re in process of trying to a guy with a trade record of working with pitches

by Slyde on Jan 14, 2009 1:44 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

After going back and reading the thread that Man Mountain linked to

I realized that what I thought BP did regularly was just steal one base when he was ahead of Dunn. It was a lot rarer that he tried to go to third.

by Brendanukkah on Jan 14, 2009 2:03 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Don't they have TV's at the convent?

When my mother was still a nun back in the ‘60s, they didn’t have TV there then. She said she could, however, get close to the window and listen to the Reds broadcasts when the neighbors had it on.

I have discovered in 20 years of moving around a ballpark, that the knowledge of the game is usually in inverse proportion to the price of the seats. - Bill Veeck

by PeteyHendrix on Jan 17, 2009 2:13 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

your mother was a nun?

youve led quite a life, havent you pete?

by Charlie Scrabbles on Jan 17, 2009 9:43 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

And she voted for Jerry Springer when she was a nun

I didn’t even know nuns voted. Apparently they brought a voting booth and set it up for the sisters.

Decades later at a season-wrap party (for some soap opera that neither of us had much to do with) I saw Jerry and wanted to share the story with him. But instead I got caught up trying to pay the two ladies I was dancing with to go over and sandwich Jerry on the dance floor. Apparently $20 doesn’t go as far as it used to. Later Jerry came up to me to complement my over-the-top faux-albino-tiger-fur lounge jacket, and I was so pleased (drunk) to suddenly be chatting with him that I completely flaked on the story. I hope I run into him again…the “my mom voted for you when she was a nun” anecdote seems like the kind of story he would get a kick out of.

I have discovered in 20 years of moving around a ballpark, that the knowledge of the game is usually in inverse proportion to the price of the seats. - Bill Veeck

by PeteyHendrix on Jan 17, 2009 1:41 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

He tried stealing 3rd and Home in Philadelphia last year

Slyde pointed out in the next day’s thread that the 2B umpire called time right before the play. It was beautiful to watch and well executed, just bad luck that time had been called. Irregardless, it intimated the hell out of the Phillies and the Reds won 2-0.

by ken on Jan 14, 2009 3:10 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

"Intimated the hell out of"

Uh, hrm.

We want to build long period of time. I didn’t come here for the shot run.

by Gray on Jan 14, 2009 4:52 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

right after irregardless

ken, that was downright justin-esque.

"I AM ARABIC FOR SUGAR!!!!!!!!!!!!!" -- by sukr on Jan 12, 2009 4:55 PM EST

by jch24 on Jan 14, 2009 5:34 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Bweep! Bweep!

I have discovered in 20 years of moving around a ballpark, that the knowledge of the game is usually in inverse proportion to the price of the seats. - Bill Veeck

by PeteyHendrix on Jan 17, 2009 2:15 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Perhaps I'm thinking of more than just last year

The first time I remember seeing it was at a Nationals game at RFK, so that was probably in 2007.

by Brendanukkah on Jan 14, 2009 12:21 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I think Edwin will get dealt at the deadline

We should probably pursue a SS. Hopefully we can grab a stud SS prospect in AAA that will be ready for the bigs in the next year or two. I think that is our biggest problem, not LF. We have a two OF’s waiting in the wings in Votto and Frazier. If we can get that SS, then we would be looking good. I would also deal Dickerson and Arroyo in a package to a contendor for a young STUD SP.

2010 ?

C-Hernandez
1B-Alonso
2B-Phillips
SS-Valaika (weakspot, but he’s only a stopgap until the SS we acquire for EdE is ready)
3B-Frazier
LF-Votto
CF-Stubbs
RF-Bruce

Bench-Taveras
Bench-Hairston
Bench-Keppigner
Bench-Francisco
Bench-Hanigan

by BruzFan on Jan 13, 2009 5:15 PM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

that is actually an exciting lineup

and to go with a rotation or Harang, Volquez, Cueto, and Arroyo that team might not suck.

"Oedipus ruined a great sex life by asking too many questions!"- Dr. Stephen T. Colbert DFA.

by justin007000 on Jan 13, 2009 5:30 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

how about this...

I would like to see J.J. Hardy come over to cincy in a trade for EdE + w/e it would take. Hardy was a 19 shorstop this season and a wizard going up the middle (18) while being close to average on balls hit at him and to his right. The Brewers have Alicdes Escobar waiting to take over at SS, and they are in need of a 3b. Mat Gamel commits enough errors to make EdE look like a gold glove 3b, and will be converted to an OF. Also, Hardy’s contract would only cost us 4.65 mil this year, and we could hopefully re-sign him to a reasonable deal in the offseason.

We would then have…
C-Hernandez,1B-Votto, 2B-Phillips, SS-Hardy, 3B-Keppinger, LF-Dickerson, CF-Taveras, RF-Bruce in 09’
and
C-Hernandez, 1B-Alonso, 2B-Phillips, SS-Hardy, 3B-Frazier, LF-Votto, CF-Stubbs, RF-Bruce for 10’
with Hairston, Valaika, Taveras, Hanigan, Dickerson on the bench

by BruzFan on Jan 13, 2009 6:50 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Inter-division trades are the longest of long-shots

Or is it intra-division?

Whether you like it or not, history is on our side. We will bury you.

by "Red" Moskau on Jan 13, 2009 7:29 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Should be intra-division I think

"I AM ARABIC FOR SUGAR!!!!!!!!!!!!!" -- by sukr on Jan 12, 2009 4:55 PM EST

by jch24 on Jan 13, 2009 9:09 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

if the Reds don't want EdE

what makes you think the Brewers will. They could just leave Hall there. Is the whatever a blank check?

by ol Pete on Jan 13, 2009 9:11 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I'd love to have Hardy

But it ain’t gonna happen.

I’m curious what it would take to get Donald from Philly or Brignac from TB.

Donald is blocked by Rollins in Phi and they are currently starting Pedro Feliz at 3b. Maybe come July they will be behind the Mets and be looking for a RH upgrade at 3b, considering they already have Utley, Howard, and Ibanez from the left side. Maybe we could land Donald + for EdE. I however, do not know a whole hell of a lot about the guy and how he fields. Maybe the feeling is he sucks but we do need some upgrade at SS, desperately.

With the Rays just landing Pat the Bat I do not see many holes in their lineup. I’m not sure what itd take to get Brignac but I recall him being very well thought of by many organizations.

If I were Walt, I think I would be circling the possible prospects that I felt could balance and fill this team out come July for the ’10 season. We have some trade bait in EdE, our minor league depth at the CI, LF, and RP, and maybe even Phillips (though I really doubt it), Bronson, Hairston, Taveras (if a contender needs speed, i.e. Dave Roberts for the ’04 RedSox) and Ramon Hernandez (if a contender needs a C).

by kennythered on Jan 14, 2009 2:09 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I guess a few others at SS I'd look at would be...

Joaquin Arias – would have to come pretty cheap

Hu from the Dodgers – I doubt the bat will ever be ML capable but the glove is great and the bat is probably not far behind what Hairston and Kepp will be for us this year.

Izturis from the Angels – He is older but he has a very good glove, very good speed but does make too much contact. For the right price, and if he’s healthy, he could help us.

These three would have to be cheap but I would much rather give them a chance since they can play the gloves, than a lite fielding, okay hitting player like Kepp or Hairston.

by kennythered on Jan 14, 2009 2:16 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

kennythered

The Donald idea is great. Love it. It makes a lot of sense for the Phils because as u said they do have 3 big lefty bats and are going to need someone to wedge in between them. Hope they make something work. As for Brignac I am not sure about him. He was once a cant miss prospect, but he has struggled if im not mistaken. I wouldn’t be opposed to give him a shot tho.

Do you mind if i use your Donald idea on my cincinnati.com blog?

by BruzFan on Jan 14, 2009 8:45 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Go for it boss

Feel free to shout me out… kidding of course.

by kennythered on Jan 14, 2009 10:21 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

huh?

that one went right over my head… lol

by BruzFan on Jan 13, 2009 5:40 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

and he hates the fuckin' Eagles

All Mickey Mouse films are founded on the motif of leaving home in order to learn what fear is.

by Man Mountain on Jan 13, 2009 6:30 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   1 recs

Do you like sex, BruzFan?

We want to build long period of time. I didn’t come here for the shot run.

by Gray on Jan 13, 2009 6:29 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

yea

what kidn of question is that

by BruzFan on Jan 13, 2009 6:43 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

It can be a natural, zesty enterprise.

But unfortunately there are some people—it is called satyriasis in men, nymphomania in women—who engage in it compulsively and without joy.

We want to build long period of time. I didn’t come here for the shot run.

by Gray on Jan 13, 2009 6:57 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

oh, no

All Mickey Mouse films are founded on the motif of leaving home in order to learn what fear is.

by Man Mountain on Jan 13, 2009 7:04 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   1 recs

These unfortunate souls cannot love in the true sense of the word.

Our mutual acquaintance BruzFan is one of these.

We want to build long period of time. I didn’t come here for the shot run.

by Gray on Jan 13, 2009 9:52 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

interuptus?

"Oedipus ruined a great sex life by asking too many questions!"- Dr. Stephen T. Colbert DFA.

by justin007000 on Jan 13, 2009 9:26 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Relax man

No one’s making fun of you. This is just all dialogue from The Big Lebowski. You should watch it. It’s really funny. Of course, that’s just, like, my opinion, man.

by Brendanukkah on Jan 13, 2009 9:59 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   1 recs

you guys fucked with the jesus

Also, I'm given to understand that your mother is overweight.

by chandrathan on Jan 13, 2009 10:01 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   1 recs

Deos mio, man.

Seamus and me, we’re gonna fuck you up.

We want to build long period of time. I didn’t come here for the shot run.

by Gray on Jan 13, 2009 10:16 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Eight-year-olds, dude.

We want to build long period of time. I didn’t come here for the shot run.

by Gray on Jan 13, 2009 10:59 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

we are rough on new guys aren't we?

Bruzfan you might want to check out the Wiki. That will not help you in this case but it will show you that we aren’t that serious about things, we aren’t that malicious, and it will show you were some of our jokes and terminology comes from.

"Oedipus ruined a great sex life by asking too many questions!"- Dr. Stephen T. Colbert DFA.

by justin007000 on Jan 13, 2009 10:02 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Do I need to link to the script in the wiki?

Here it is.

We want to build long period of time. I didn’t come here for the shot run.

by Gray on Jan 13, 2009 10:17 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I sometimes wonder how our older Red Reporters manage

I remember a few instances where Madville responded earnestly to some MySpace era pop culture foolishness. I can’t imagine trying to have a conversation about baseball in 40 years and having to be up whatever the kids those days have been watching.

For Columbus area Red Reporters Studio 35 is having a Dude-a-thon all this weekend.

by Red Menace on Jan 14, 2009 1:32 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I always rely in earnest...that's the job of an elder RR.

Interestingly in 40 years I’ll be (with luck) celebrating my 100th B-Day. which reminds me only 5 shopping days left to get my present(s) kids.

Mads, he is a crazy old man. Plus we have kinda had the same sabrametric evolution togeather.

Justin

by Madville on Jan 15, 2009 2:10 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

do you mean

only 5 days left to get my present(s), kids.

"Oedipus ruined a great sex life by asking too many questions!"- Dr. Stephen T. Colbert DFA.

by justin007000 on Jan 15, 2009 8:24 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

No

Only 5 days left to get my present(s) – kids.

by Brendanukkah on Jan 15, 2009 9:51 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

i thought he wanted kids for his birthday

"Oedipus ruined a great sex life by asking too many questions!"- Dr. Stephen T. Colbert DFA.

by justin007000 on Jan 15, 2009 10:30 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

No wonder everything, as usual, is zinging over my head. And I even saw the movie.

by ol Pete on Jan 13, 2009 10:29 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

It really tied the thread together, did it not?

All Mickey Mouse films are founded on the motif of leaving home in order to learn what fear is.

by Man Mountain on Jan 13, 2009 11:21 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   1 recs

This was a valued rug.

We want to build long period of time. I didn’t come here for the shot run.

by Gray on Jan 13, 2009 11:27 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

wtf are you saying

shut the hell up u moron

wait, aren’t these lines from the wheelchair lebowski?

by sharks on Jan 14, 2009 6:29 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

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