did you have to bring that shit up? That fuckin’ game made me furious!

i like the value of that trade, even if money doesnt change hands.

and even then, I think it’s unlikely. The thing that will hold him back is that he bats left-handed and plays a position that is already filled. Unless they are planning on trading Votto…

We’re going to pick up a nobody player, overpriced reliever, or a has been starter, claim it’s improvement, and then we’re going to go out and win another 74 games

I guarantee Walt Jockety wasn’t brought in to pick through the trash heap. Guar-un-tee. He’s going to make a splash; whether it’s a big splash (Holliday, Sabathia), just look like a big splash (Ordonez, Burrell), or be too big of a splash (Manny), we’ll see.

a 10-cent head "old school" manager who is deluded enough to think that Corey Patterson is worth 366 at bats

In Dusty’s defense, the bulk of those ABs were before Bruce’s call-up (when CoPat was taking ABs from Freel; I don’t see that as a terrible trade-off) and after Dunn’s trade (when, because of trades and injuries, there weren’t any better options). In between, he had 97 PAs – compare that to 269 PA for Dunn over that timespan. No, the complaint people had was with him hitting CoPat leadoff.

You don’t win through free agency with Cincinnati’s payroll

When, during Castellini’s tenure as owner, has payroll ever been mentioned by the Reds? The media and fans seem to "know’ there’s a limit, but there’s not been one move made/not made as a purely salary move. I would also submit that it’s always tough to win primarily through free agency; just ask the ’00s Yankees (as opposed to the ’90s Yankees, who were primarily a home-grown team), or ’08 Tigers.

You win with prospects and youth

No doubt, that’s where Cinci should focus. However, you can’t rely on the draft exclusively – even those amazin’ Rays only feature a small handful of homegrown talent.

while this team does possess some young talent the sad truth is we do not have enough, particularly on the pitching end

Volquez will be 25; Cueto 23; Ramirez 26. Harang’s in the heart of the good years of his career, and under contract for 2 more years (3, if Cinci picks up his option). In the bullpen, Bray, Burton, Masset, and Roenike are all on the right side of 30. Plus, Thompson and Bailey are still very young.

who yet again surrendered over 200 HR’s this year (for the fifth time in the last six years)

In a pretty homer-heavy home ballpark in a homer-heavy division – the Central is home to 4 of the top 6, and 5 of the top 9, teams in the league in HRs. In fact, over the past 6 years the Central has had at least 5 of the top 9 teams in HRs 4 times, and ‘07 was the only year they didn’t have at least 4 of the top 7.

While there are still holes, signing a big RH bat, getting better production from SS, and signing a decent C (along with a dose of better luck – remember, 3 guys logged over 200 innings at SS and none were named Alex Gonzalez ) could transform this team.

It adjusts a hitter’s OPS for league and ballpark.

Over the past 3 seasons, Beltre’s has been 105, 112, and 109; EdE’s has been 108, 101, and 106. So except for ‘07, if you put Beltre in GAP he’d hit almost exactly the same as EdE. Also, remember that EdE is 4 years younger than Beltre – in Beltre’s age 23-25 seasons his OPS+ was 97, 88, 163 (which of these is not like the other?). Oh, and did you miss the part where he’s $9M more expensive for the same offensive value? And a FA at the end of ’09?

$12M/yr is not “bargain priced”, when Scott Rolen makes $11M (who, when healthy, is a better fielder and hitter).

This gives Stubbs time in AAA to push Dickerson/Hairston. And I think Stubbs still has something to show in the minors.

I’m fairly meh on Crede and his career .306 OBP. His defense would be an upgrade, but you are essentially signing Crede to play left field offensively. That would also mean that you have 4 guys in the lineup with a career OBP below .315 (Bruce, Phillips, Crede, and Gonzalez). That’s no way to score runs.

but Arizona got Dunn for Micah Oweings and a pitcher recovering from tommy john surgery. Holliday will only be here for a year wouldn’t somebody like Bailey, and a low minor league prospect who projects but is many years away seem fair?

I like Bailey and think he is going to be a good pitcher, but with the pitching this team has and the holes in the outfield, I would like to see an upgrade like Holliday made. Bailey is the oddman out at this point. I am not advocating trading Bailey just to trade Bailey like Hal wants, but if the right offer is made….