What happened to that Dunn guy we used to talk about…
The always lovely Mrs. M and I attended last night’s Red’s baseball game vs. the Brewers. Although Milwaukee is in collapse mode, the Red’s young guns were exhilarating to say the least. J. Votto and J. Bruce is as exciting a pair of young players in my memory. I remember great former Red’s #3 and #4 hitters like: Vada Pinson and Frank Robinson, Joe Morgan and George Foster, Johnny Bench and Tony Perez …Bruce and Votto, (barring injury) are poised to contend with these greats amd can potentially exceed them. Joey Votto looks like a 30 – 35 HRs/ 90 RBI a year hitter and Jay Bruce – The sky is the limit, when he’s really gets going he will one great player. I remember seeing and FEELING Josh Hamilton at GABP last year. At the plate he emanated a visceral personal power and confidence. Tonight I ‘felt’ the same kind of special qualities almost radiate from both Bruce and Votto.
I am aware that it easy to play better when there is little on the line.
The Reds have been playing against teams who have/had a lot on the line: St Louis, Arizona and the Brewers and beating them with young but highly talented and intense players. Ryan Hannigan is fun to watch..he’s really into every pitch and he has taken control on the field. What a killer group of young players we have!
Votto–1b, B Phillips 2b, Edwin Encarnacion 3b, Jay Bruce–RF, Ryan Hannigan–C
Chris Dickerson – CF, Johnny Cueto P, Edinson Valquez P, Ramon Ramirez P, Micah Owings P, Jared Burton RP
Combine these guys with veteran players – Aaron Harang, Bronson Arroyo, Jeremy affeldt, Fracisco Cordero and David Weathers and you’ve got a very strong nucleus for 2009. Jerry Hairston Jr. continues to contribute and the Reds win a lot more games with him the lineup that without him playing. Can Alex Gonzalez make a comeback? What role will Jeff Keppinger play- will he and Hairston provide the core for a long awaited and much needed stronger bench? And will Yonder Alonso surprise us and fight his way up to the big club sometime next year.
I can’t believe that I’m writing this but last night I saw it..the Reds are only 2 or 3 players away from being a competitor. We could use a Mike Cameron kind of center fielder, a right handed batter who can still play great defense, hit 25 home runs, knock in 75 RBIs and bring established veteran leadership. The Reds need a decent hitting slick fielding shortstop – maybe that will be Gonzo, or it could even be Jerry Jr. for a year, he looked very comfortable there tonight. We need a strong back up catcher, maybe its Bako but he doesn’t inspire confidence offensively although he’d be a left handed hitter off the bench. I could see a team with a line up like this:
Chris Dickerson LF
FA (Mike Cameron style) CF
Bruce RF
Votto 1B
EdE 3B
BP 2B
Gonzo SS
Hannigan C.
SP Rotation
Harang
Volquez
Ramirez
Arroyo
Cueto
BullPen
Weathers
Burton
Affeldt – I think they can sign him
Gary Majewski
Josh Roenicke
Bill Bray
Micah Owings P/PH
Bench
Kepp
Cherry
Bako/FA
Drew Stubbs
Jolbert Cabrera. – he makes sense as a veteran back up.
No Freel, no Noho, No LLM, No Corey, no Belizzle, No Merker.
Although it won’t happen, if Yonder came of age overnight…then with Joey in leftfield…well things get even more interesting.
So what do you do with Micah Owings – Pitcher or convert him to CF?
My comments as usual not sabremetrically supported. I’ve watched some good red’s teams come together over the last 50 years and I do believe that the energy and intensity and talent that is emerging is cause for optimism for a significantly strong 2009.. This is especially in the case of the starting rotation. With continued quality starts, a decent BP and young talented hitters…well you get the picture.
Dusty appears much more comfortable with this group of players than when Griff and Donkey were here. This may be ‘his’ team. Hopefully he won’t fuck it up.
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Dickerson for me
At least to start things off. He brings defense that only Drew Stubbs can match and the other options aren’t likely close and his offensive game doesn’t suggest he won’t be able to hold his own at least a little bit. Until he shows he can’t or Drew Stubbs shows he has earned it, Dickerson has my full blessing as the starting CF next year against right handed pitching.
http://www.redsminorleagues.com and http://www.RedsPitchFX.com
by dougdirt on Sep 20, 2008 4:25 PM EDT 0 recs
And what about LF pitching? A platoon with whom...
Ibn Khaldoun and Hilrich Zwingli - now that's real reform, Mr. McCain.
by Madville on
Sep 20, 2008 4:54 PM EDT
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With the right moves, the Reds can contend in 2009.
I’m concerned, though, that the farm will be dealt in an overhaul that is part of a mad dash to win it all in 2009 without regard to what could be a very bright future.
That said, I like the idea of Cameron in CF. Would Mark Kotsay be a viable option there? How about Raul Ibanez or Juan Rivera in LF? I’ve always liked both players and would like to see Rivera get the chance to show what he can do. I momentarily considered Milton Bradley, but I can’t see him staying healthy while playing the field every day. Even though he would add some fire to the clubhouse — heck, he might set fire to the clubhouse — I can’t see giving him the multi-year deal he seeks. He’s a DH, now.
I like Hanigan, too, but another catcher is needed to go with him. Miguel Olivo hits LHP, is sound defensively and is excellent against the running game, but he’s terrible against RHP, has a terrible OBP and is said to be “difficult.” Gregg Zaun could be a decent pickup.
I still want to see another SP in the mix to cement this rotation. My main FA target— Derek Lowe. I’d love to see Sabathia or Oliver Perez, but I don’t see it happening.
As far as trades, who knows? Aubrey Huff is said to be available, but his 3B defense is below average, he’s not well liked in the clubhouse and it would mean moving EE to LF or trading him. Interesting bat, though. I could see a deal with teh Twins for one of their young pitchers, but the bloom is kind of off Boof Bonser, whom Minnesota would like to deal for a 3B.
We Are ... Marshall!
by Thundering Turtle on Sep 20, 2008 6:28 PM EDT 0 recs
I say hell no to Zaun
if for no other reason than this abomination of a website.
Overserved and underwhelmed.
by Pops Daniels on
Sep 21, 2008 12:35 PM EDT
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But
he’ll bring his Z-game!
I think we overmeet as a society.
by Gray on
Sep 21, 2008 4:44 PM EDT
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Whoa Dude - I didn't know Jeff the Z was gay.
Is that him in the Zorro suit ?
Ibn Khaldoun and Hulrich Zwingli - now that's real reform, Mr. McCain.
by Madville on
Sep 21, 2008 11:52 PM EDT
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+1
I like Juan Rivera too and given our friendly confines I could see him hitting 25+ HRs and being a good compliment as a RH.
Diamond in the rough type players would be nice, i.e. Cust, Ludwick, CQuentin, etc. also. Walt seems like he can find a few of these. Do you have any names in mind? Your normally pretty privy to these things.
by kennythered on
Sep 21, 2008 7:14 PM EDT
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I really like Juan Rivera.
I could see a Juan Cruz signing for the bullpen, maybe. If Texas cuts loose Hank Blalock, I could see him landing in Cincinnati if Walt is so inclined to include Encarnacion in a deal. I don’t particularly like the idea of Blalock playing third at GABP. I’m not sure he has the arm for it anymore.
A Gerald Laird acquisition from Texas is a distinct possibility. I know Texas showed interested in reaquiring Masset before the White Sox dealt him to the Reds. It would take more than that to land Laird, but could be a solid starting point.
I could see any of Garrett Atkins, Matt Holliday or Brad Hawpe coming over from Colorado. It likely would cost someone such as Arroyo and more, depending on which player was dealt. The Rockies are seeking starting pitching in the form of a No. 3 starter or better. If the Reds were to sign Derek Lowe, that might make Arroyo expendable. Colorado’s director of Latin American scouting is a friend of mine. He, I’m sure, would love to have Cueto but I’d hate to see that happen.
Rumors float around about the Tigers dumping salary in the form of Magglio Ordonez or Dontrelle Willis. Maggs is owed $48 million over three years, so if the Reds acquire him they likely wouldn’t want to give up much in return just for the sake of helping Detroit’s salary dump. Willis might be done.
It should be a fun offseason. The Reds have some depth to package in the right deal. I just hope they make the RIGHT deal(s).
We Are ... Marshall!
by Thundering Turtle on
Sep 22, 2008 2:30 PM EDT
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Wow
It should be interesting. But you are right, the right deals should not include Cueto at any cost.
Overserved and underwhelmed.
by Pops Daniels on
Sep 23, 2008 8:26 AM EDT
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After giving it a little more thought,
San Diego’s Josh Bard is likely to become available. I like him a little as an option at catcher. Tampa Bay has somedepth there, too. John Jaso could be an option.
We Are ... Marshall!
by Thundering Turtle on
Sep 23, 2008 9:30 AM EDT
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Shoot, I hit post before I meant to.
As for CF, I could see David DeJesus coming from Kansas City. The Reds have expressed interest in Ryan Spilborghs, a player I’ve always liked, from Colorado. Willy Taveras probably will be available, too, and even if he goes through arbitration could be reasonably priced for a CF with plenty of flaws but top-notch SB ability and sound defense.
We Are ... Marshall!
by Thundering Turtle on
Sep 23, 2008 9:35 AM EDT
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"CF with plenty of flaws but top-notch SB ability and sound defense"
/flagged
"for integrity of races and the game" - Dusty Baker
by Charlie Scrabbles on
Sep 23, 2008 9:51 AM EDT
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Flag?
C’mon. It was incidental contact!
We Are ... Marshall!
by Thundering Turtle on
Sep 23, 2008 11:05 AM EDT
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well...alright
but youve been warned buster.
"for integrity of races and the game" - Dusty Baker
by Charlie Scrabbles on
Sep 23, 2008 11:09 AM EDT
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Has Bard been hurt this season?
Because when he’s played, he’s been worse than Bako. His career numbers aren’t bad, but a catcher moving past 30 and coming off of a terrible year? I think I’ll pass unless he’s basically free.
I like Dejesus, but I don’t know if his defense is strong enough to cover CF. He’d be pretty good in LF next to my Dickerson/Stubbs ‘09 platoon. And he’s signed to a decent deal (owed $8.3M over the next two seasons with a $6M option for 2011). If they could work a good deal out, I’d take him.
My concern with Spilborghs is that he’s never played a full season and his minor league numbers are in the PCL.
I wouldn’t go after Taveras with Stubbs being on the brink. I think Stubbs will get on base more and probably play as good if not better defense. And he’ll be a lot cheaper. Taveras is so batting average dependent and I hate having guys like that in the lead-off spot.
"You never want to give up a 7-0 lead, in your rival's ballpark, that would put them in first place. Never want to do that." - Ron Darling
by Slyde on
Sep 23, 2008 10:04 AM EDT
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Yeah, Bard has been hurt this year.
I think he’s a bounce back candidate in part because of his decent career numbers. I don’t see him as a long term solution. I don’t know if there is a long term solution available this offseason.
Most of the guys I’m mentioning are with an eye toward winning in 2009, rather than in the long haul. Some of them I’d advocate (Jaso, DeJesus, Lowe, Bard, Holliday) and some I can simply see the Reds possibly having interest.
Just for fun and to stir the pot, how about David Eckstein?
We Are ... Marshall!
by Thundering Turtle on
Sep 23, 2008 10:31 AM EDT
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if the Reds commit to moving BP to SS
i think i might be able to tolerate a year of Eckstein at 2B. it would suck to constantly hearing the fawning and prattling over him, but if he is still effective it might be a decent idea. i dont think it will happen though, because BP isnt going anywhere and neither are A-Gon or Kepp.
"for integrity of races and the game" - Dusty Baker
by Charlie Scrabbles on
Sep 23, 2008 10:34 AM EDT
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Eckstein
would make Marty (more) insufferable.
Overserved and underwhelmed.
by Pops Daniels on
Sep 23, 2008 10:37 AM EDT
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agreed
but i havent listened to Marty but maybe a dozen times this year. ive already moved on man.
"for integrity of races and the game" - Dusty Baker
by Charlie Scrabbles on
Sep 23, 2008 10:45 AM EDT
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Isn't Hanigan adequate
compared to what some of the other options are? I really see no advantage to adding Josh Bard at the expense of funds for other, more pressing outfield needs. Not that he’s expensive, just not the highest priority.
Overserved and underwhelmed.
by Pops Daniels on
Sep 23, 2008 10:04 AM EDT
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Sorry
I just read what you wrote earlier. Please disregard.
Overserved and underwhelmed.
by Pops Daniels on
Sep 23, 2008 10:05 AM EDT
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Hannigan has looked good to me, as I said he's a take charge guy
He’s intense, he get’s emotional but stays in control. If he could hit .250, knock in a few RBIs and have a .300+ OBP I’d be pretty happy. What the Reds need is a strong backup catcher to spell Hannigan and help teach him the MLB ropes.
Ibn Khaldoun and Hulrich Zwingli - now that's real reform, Mr. McCain.
by Madville on
Sep 23, 2008 4:21 PM EDT
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I could go for that.
That’s where Bard might be valuable. Maybe a Shawn Riggans or Gregg Zaun. Olivo wouldn’t take well to sitting the bench. Jaso is a younger guy, so he’s lacking the “ropes” factor.
I suppose it could wind up Hannigan and Craig Tatum, but I don’t think that will happen.
We Are ... Marshall!
by Thundering Turtle on
Sep 23, 2008 6:52 PM EDT
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I hope it doesn't end up Hannigan and Bako
Mostly because of Disty’s need for knifey- spooney
Ibn Khaldoun and Hulrich Zwingli - now that's real reform, Mr. McCain.
by Madville on
Sep 23, 2008 8:49 PM EDT
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Turtle your analysis is interesting
esp at Catcher -“I like Hanigan, too, but another catcher is needed to go with him” Would split catching duties, use Hannigan as the starter or backup,,,that is if the REd’s coud pick up a second more experienced catcher. I don’t like Olivo, he’s too limited. How old is Zaun,,I remember him as a pretty good hitter.
I don’t think that Bob and Walt will screw around much with the roster. Maybe look for a SS or a veteran RH hitter at 3B (I always get the feeling that ownership doesn’t like EdE).If they were to get CC then I’d see having to trade some prospects. But with the addition of Rameriz and Owings, I think the starting 5 is really good. The BP is strong, we have the makings of a good bench, just need Dickerson to improve and buy another hitting OF.
Ibn Khaldoun and Hulrich Zwingli - now that's real reform, Mr. McCain.
by Madville on Sep 20, 2008 11:09 PM EDT 0 recs
BTW This guy is ready, willing and able...
The Cuns just cut him…what do you say Walt
Ibn Khaldoun and Hulrich Zwingli - now that's real reform, Mr. McCain.
by Madville on
Sep 20, 2008 11:13 PM EDT
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Zaun will be 38 on April 14.
Wow, I’m getting old. I remember covering him when he was in rookie ball with the Bluefield Orioles.
We Are ... Marshall!
by Thundering Turtle on
Sep 22, 2008 2:16 PM EDT
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i think cherry is a walking band-aid ... ala freel
furthermore, i think votto never leaves 1B and yonder plays 3b
"I never use a big word when a diminutive one will work." — Pete Mackanin.
by joshuar9476 on Sep 21, 2008 12:10 PM EDT 0 recs
So J9476 you think - i think votto never leaves 1B and yonder plays 3b
Has Yonder played 3b or any other positions. If he does play 3rd base do you see EdE in left or gone?
Ibn Khaldoun and Hulrich Zwingli - now that's real reform, Mr. McCain.
by Madville on
Sep 21, 2008 11:50 PM EDT
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Alonso cannot play 3B
no matter what the Reds tell you. he’s ok at 1B, but he cant play anywhere else.
"for integrity of races and the game" - Dusty Baker
by Charlie Scrabbles on
Sep 22, 2008 10:16 AM EDT
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Then its Votto in LF 2010
I’d love to get a rent-a-player FA for LF or CF (Mike Cameron Style)
C-Dick is leading the voting here at RR for CF next season.
Ibn Khaldoun and Hulrich Zwingli - now that's real reform, Mr. McCain.
by Madville on Sep 22, 2008 12:57 PM EDT 0 recs













