Trading Griffey
by nighthawk32
on May 1, 2008 2:49 PM EDT
It is very conceivable that the Reds would look to trade Griffey after he reaches 600 HR's, especially if the Reds are still playing inconsistently. The speculation is that he would be traded back to Seattle. My question is this: Would you trade Griffey and a prospect (like a Brandon Waring, Maloney, or something like a top 30 prospect) for Jeff Clement? The Mariners just signed their main catcher to an extension and I read that they have a catching prospect in AA that they're high on. Clement is said to be average defensively, across the board. But, he has excellent power, plate discipline, and is said to call a good game.......and has outstanding leadership skills.
Should the Reds make such a move?
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I doubt the Mariners would do it
I think they are planning on using Clement at first base once Sexson is gone next year.
It gets crazy on the road, and awful lonely. That's why I love pornography. This next song is all about my love of hardcore, barely legal pornography.
by Slyde on May 1, 2008 2:51 PM EDT 0 recs
how about Grif, Hatte and a prospect
for clement?
"I never should have given up the animation rights."
by BobbyO on
May 1, 2008 5:48 PM EDT
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I just don't know why the Mariners would trade Clement
What is the advantage on their part to getting 2 old players?
It gets crazy on the road, and awful lonely. That's why I love pornography. This next song is all about my love of hardcore, barely legal pornography.
by Slyde on
May 1, 2008 5:49 PM EDT
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i would trade griffey for any prospect with a pulse...
so yes, i would do that deal
In the end, life and business are about human connections. And computers are about trying to murder you in a lake. And to me the choice is easy.
by chandrathan on May 1, 2008 2:52 PM EDT 0 recs
a sudden twist:
Okay, would you trade Griffey AND Homer Bailey for Jeff Clement? I mean, how big a prospect would you be willing to add to sweeten that deal for the Mariners?
by nighthawk32 on May 1, 2008 2:57 PM EDT 0 recs
Hell no
to answer that.
HELL NO! That is too much. Bailey is a top notch pitching prospect you will see.
I would imagine they wouldn’t want a prospect anyway. The question should be what other veteran to add to sweeten the deal because the Mariners wanna win now. Maybe Weathers if they want to strengthen their ‘pen, once hes healthy. Maybe Hatteberg if Sexson is still sucking. etc.
I like you thinking though because I feel like Clement is a little underrated defensively and he could easily be a 25+ HR guy behind the plate.
by kennythered on
May 1, 2008 3:34 PM EDT
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Also
I think the Braves would make a play for Griff. Same with the Yankees, Mets, ChiSox, LADodgers, depending on whether or not they stay in the race and how AJones and their youth is doing, and probably a few others teams.
by kennythered on
May 1, 2008 3:37 PM EDT
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No way, Jose
The LAST thing the Yankees need is a left-handed DH-type. They have more of those than they know what to do with.
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by BubbaFan on
May 1, 2008 5:44 PM EDT
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Why would the Braves want Griffey?
I’m not seeing it.
Definitely an antisocial type. Woof, woof, woof! That's my other dog imitation.
by Man Mountain on
May 1, 2008 6:21 PM EDT
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Might also be a case of Griffey being willing to accept a trade there
It’s close® to his home in Orlando.
by Brendanukkah on
May 2, 2008 3:30 AM EDT
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Not a catcher...
too risky. Most of the ‘prospects’ fizzle out. Even if you found a good hitting one, they take too long to learn to handle a MLB staff. Stock up on pitching.
by jambolyajones on May 1, 2008 3:33 PM EDT 0 recs
Well
Clement is very close to the majors and he is a college guy so he has plenty of experience. If we were to trade for a C, he would be it.
by kennythered on
May 1, 2008 3:35 PM EDT
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Clement was called up yesterday
I guess he and Johjima are going to share catching and DH duties. I really don’t think the Mariners are in the market for trading him.
Plus, Griffey has a no-trade clause and while I expect that he might take a trade to Seattle, I’m pretty sure the options for where he would go are very limited.
It gets crazy on the road, and awful lonely. That's why I love pornography. This next song is all about my love of hardcore, barely legal pornography.
by Slyde on
May 1, 2008 3:51 PM EDT
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I think a fair deal for Griffey would be
Jeremy Reed and another (younger) prospect. That would improve the outfield defense a lot and give the Reds a lefty bat which they will need when both Griffey and Dunn are gone. Reed has struggled in his 600+ MLB ABs, but he’s also had some injuries that have hurt his development. I think he may now be ready to contribute.
by Blue on May 1, 2008 6:28 PM EDT 0 recs
Blech.
I think Reed is much more likely to be a AAAA player and okay back-up OF than anything of actual use. Outside of that 60 AB sample in 2004, he’s been an absolutely abysmal hitter in the majors. He’s injury prone, he doesn’t bring much to the table speed-wise, and he’s a good but not great defender. The Mariners are just leaving him in AAA now, and I suspect his pricetag is far, far lower than Junior. A middling low level prospect would probably get it done.
by Geki on
May 1, 2008 8:29 PM EDT
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I think it will be hard to get anything of value for Griffey
mostly because other teams know that the Reds hands are tied if they want to unload him and get prospects out of it. So I am guessing either the Reds don’t get a fair market value or Griffey stays in Cincinnati this year.
I don’t know if this is in reaction to that article on MLB.com, but I hope they don’t trade Dunn. I want to see him hit his 500th homerun in a Reds uniform. Depending on where Stubbs or Dorn or a surprise sleeper prospect is at in his development I would even consider exercising Griffey’s option for 2009. But I guess there is always Correy Patterson
The Dusty Path to the World Series!*
*Note this is not an endorsment of Dusty Baker.
by justin007000 on May 1, 2008 8:34 PM EDT 0 recs
I don't think there is any way the Reds pay $16.5 million to Griffey next season
Dorn hasn’t started so hot this year, but it’s only been 9 games (is he hurt?). If Stubbs is going to play in the Majors next year he needs to be in Chattanooga now. In fact, he should probably be in Chattanooga either way.
It gets crazy on the road, and awful lonely. That's why I love pornography. This next song is all about my love of hardcore, barely legal pornography.
by Slyde on
May 1, 2008 8:37 PM EDT
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We could be looking at an outfield of Dunn, Patterson, and Bruce
But that is assuming the Reds resign Dunn which at this point is a big if. Which means we could be looking at an outfield of Frooperson, Patterson, and Bruce, or stop gap free agent, Patterson, and Bruce. I think, unless Dunn just refuses to stay in Cincinnati, Castillini really needs to put his money where his mouth is and resign him. He seems like a Jock kinda guy, marquee vetaren.
The Dusty Path to the World Series!*
*Note this is not an endorsment of Dusty Baker.
by justin007000 on
May 1, 2008 8:51 PM EDT
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I think
Dunn will get resigned because the way Big Bob likes him. If Dunn doesn’t get resigned Edwin will move to left, unless his D picks up this year.
I also think Patterson is signed to just a 1 year deal and will want more money next year because d-bag boras is his agent. So I imagine him being gone. Also I get the feeling Jock is going to start moving some of the minor league pieces around and hopefully that includes moving Frazier and Stubbs up a level and if they compete, letting them get some AB’s in AAA near the end of the year so we can have them both midway through ‘09.
by kennythered on
May 1, 2008 9:22 PM EDT
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Don't Jump down my throat
but what if encarnacion moved to the outfield like those goofs suggest, how close is frazier and those other badasses at short
Are there any more dinner rolls? -President Ted Kennedy
by The Crushinator on May 1, 2008 9:20 PM EDT 0 recs
I like
I like edwin in left!
Frazier won’t stay at short. I think that since they got Cozart back in Dayton they have started to let him play a little 3rd, but thats tough to find a spot for him there at that level b/c we already have Waring who is really showing some power. Thtas just one more reason to move Frazier up a level, we have no real 3b prospect in Chatt and I don’t know what else Todd has to prove in Dayton.
by kennythered on
May 1, 2008 9:27 PM EDT
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Encarnacion has too good of an arm for left
and moving to the outfield may not be the best for him. I think he will be fine and 3B, he has excellent range, and a good arm, he just doesn’t always know where the ball is going.
The Dusty Path to the World Series!*
*Note this is not an endorsment of Dusty Baker.
by justin007000 on
May 1, 2008 9:37 PM EDT
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Yes and No
He will be fine at 3rd if he can ever field. If he constantly has the results he does out there now then they need to move him. I hope he gets better, I even think he will get better, but he will have to put some results out there.
He does have a good arm but that could also be an asset in LF if he can’t field a grounder, its not a waste. Bruce is a RF, I don’t ever want him in CF, so unless Edwin can field in Center, Left is the only way to go. Votto is fine at first so theres no need to move them both.
by kennythered on
May 1, 2008 10:12 PM EDT
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I want Dunn in leftfield for years to come
The Dusty Path to the World Series!*
*Note this is not an endorsment of Dusty Baker.
by justin007000 on
May 1, 2008 10:46 PM EDT
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I agree
I would rather have Edwin and Dunn than Edwin and Kepp at 3b.
by kennythered on
May 1, 2008 10:56 PM EDT
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agreed
Dunn, Bruce, and ? sounds like a pretty good outfield to me
Hope Springs Eternal! Go Reds
by Caleb on
May 2, 2008 9:50 AM EDT
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too good an arm for left?
Bonds did ok out there with a pretty good arm
Hope Springs Eternal! Go Reds
by Caleb on
May 2, 2008 9:49 AM EDT
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but not always good enough
And I think EdE’s arm is a lot stronger than Bonds’s arm. But then I’m guessing Bruce’s arm is even strong still.
It gets crazy on the road, and awful lonely. That's why I love pornography. This next song is all about my love of hardcore, barely legal pornography.
by Slyde on
May 2, 2008 10:28 AM EDT
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i wish my fellow students from Pittsburgh were old enough to understand that reference
because if they did that could be a huge ba-ZING. At least with Cleveland I can say well atleast the Reds have won a world Series in the last half century.
The Dusty Path to the World Series!*
*Note this is not an endorsment of Dusty Baker.
by justin007000 on
May 2, 2008 11:06 AM EDT
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what, 15-straight losing seasons isn't a "ba-ZING" enough?
It gets crazy on the road, and awful lonely. That's why I love pornography. This next song is all about my love of hardcore, barely legal pornography.
by Slyde on
May 2, 2008 11:16 AM EDT
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Reds being off sucks
Law and Order SVU with the girlfriend blows! But Stabler and Benson are hardcore.
by kennythered on May 1, 2008 10:22 PM EDT 0 recs
Yup
A real slugfest for Louisville tonight, though. They just won, 11-8.
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
by BubbaFan on
May 1, 2008 10:27 PM EDT
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Trade offer
I would think Seattle would take Jr, Arroyo, Hatty for Clement plus a low ceiling AA player or high ceiling A player. If I was Jock I would pick up the phone and try to make that deal now. Then bring up Bruce, Bailey, Phillips and get ready for next year.
by CamIam on May 2, 2008 9:52 AM EDT 0 recs
Arroyo is a solid pitcher
he makes a fair market contract considering other inning eater average pitchers. It isn’t as if he is close to the end of the contract.
The Dusty Path to the World Series!*
*Note this is not an endorsment of Dusty Baker.
by justin007000 on
May 2, 2008 10:08 AM EDT
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I agree
Its not that I dont like Bronson but we have other option who are cheaper and will provide the same results. Bailey and Thompson both close to being ready and Fogg could hold down the fort until they were. Getting Jr and Arroyo off the books next year really opens up funds to go after a CF and resign Dunn. PLus Bruce is going to produce at least as much as Jr this year and more next.
by CamIam on
May 2, 2008 10:20 AM EDT
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but Griffey will be off the books sorta but not really
he will “be on the books” for years because much of his contract is deferred. I am not sure if we can say Thompson is “close”. He has an injury history and he was pretty excellent last year, but lets see if he can keep it up, it is only the second of May.
The Dusty Path to the World Series!*
*Note this is not an endorsment of Dusty Baker.
by justin007000 on
May 2, 2008 11:10 AM EDT
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Well
I think youre selling Arroyo short there. I would want more back in that deal.
by kennythered on
May 2, 2008 12:23 PM EDT
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I'm unclear why Seattle would want griffey
other than as a drawing card at the gate. Looks like they have a pretty solid outfield to me
Hope Springs Eternal! Go Reds
by Caleb on May 2, 2008 10:03 AM EDT 0 recs
Yeah
They released Bronson Sardinha from the Tacoma Rainiers. They have too many OFers even in at the Triple-A level.
All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?
by BubbaFan on
May 2, 2008 5:25 PM EDT
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why griffey?
Reports say they are looking for an outfielder, for whatever reason. Plus, bringing Griffey back would be a huge draw, as you say. And, Griffey could play OF and DH so he might even be more productive as they could rest his legs a little more often while still getting his bat in the lineup.
by nighthawk32 on May 2, 2008 10:26 AM EDT 0 recs
I think Griffey would have to prove that he can still hit
before teams will be willing to trade for him. He’s to that point in his career that he has to prove that he’s still got it. So far this year, he hasn’t really proved that yet.
It gets crazy on the road, and awful lonely. That's why I love pornography. This next song is all about my love of hardcore, barely legal pornography.
by Slyde on
May 2, 2008 10:30 AM EDT
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yes and no
I agree that he is not hitting well but he has shown he has power. I think teams know that he is now more of a .260-.280 hitter who will still hit 30 HR. That, combined with the nostalgia of bringing him back, might be enough. We’ll see. I certainly don’t hate Griffey but it might be time to trade him and his value might be higher BEFORE he reaches 600.
by nighthawk32 on May 2, 2008 10:34 AM EDT 0 recs
i think he could be a nice pick up to a contender in the midseason
if they have a whole in their outfield. But the Reds are hand cuffed in trading him because he is a 5 and 10 player.
The Dusty Path to the World Series!*
*Note this is not an endorsment of Dusty Baker.
by justin007000 on
May 2, 2008 11:12 AM EDT
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As I said in another thread
I don’t think Jr has any trade value. He isn’t that good of a player anymore, he’s being paid $12M this year, and has that crazy $4M buyout for next year. Unless the Reds include alot of money in the deal, I just don’t think anyone will have any interest.
Often wrong, never uncertain.
by sidnancy on May 2, 2008 10:37 AM EDT 0 recs
Yeah
It really depends on what the deal would be and how much money we would have to send. We will probably be better off just keeping Griffey’s production and letting him walk and getting our draft compensation.
by kennythered on
May 2, 2008 12:26 PM EDT
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Can you buy out an option and still offer arbitration?
I know we’ve had this discussion on the site in the past, but I don’t remember if we ever figured it out. The Reds got compensation on Rich Aurilia, I believe, but his was a mutual option. I can’t remember if they’ve ever had a case of buying out an option and then getting compensation.
And FWIW, as of last year, Griffey was a Type-A free agent. That system is whack.
It gets crazy on the road, and awful lonely. That's why I love pornography. This next song is all about my love of hardcore, barely legal pornography.
by Slyde on
May 2, 2008 12:32 PM EDT
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My gut says "no"
because he would then be a free agent. Since it’s my gut, that’s alot of no.
Then I read the CBA looking for an answer, and I’m reminded that arbitration can be offered to a club’s free agents until Dec. 1. So my gut then says “yes” (and I have to listen, because the CBA doesn’t address the situation).
Then I think about it, and it seems like a huge risk. Knowing that there’s likely to be little interest in him, what if Jr. says “yes”? You’ve already paid him $4M, which is much more than he’s likely worth to the team next year. You could low-ball him, I guess, but the way the arbitration process is supposed to work, you wouldn’t be likely to win. So even if it could work, it’s likely to bite you in the ass.
Often wrong, never uncertain.
by sidnancy on
May 2, 2008 2:09 PM EDT
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Oops
That ended poorly expressed.
So even if it could work is allowed, it’s likely to bite you in the ass.
Often wrong, never uncertain.
by sidnancy on
May 2, 2008 2:11 PM EDT
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Sounds right
Pretty sure you could offer arb after buying out the option (no reason why you shouldn’t be able to), though I can’t think of any examples off the top of my head. But I don’t think a draft pick is worth the risk that he’d actually accept arbitration.
by ken on
May 2, 2008 2:46 PM EDT
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you may be right
We’ll have to wait and see. I think he has more value to the AL, and especially to Seattle. BUT…...time will tell
by nighthawk32 on May 2, 2008 10:48 AM EDT 0 recs
The Mariners are just the kind of FO that makes these type of trades
The M’s and the Giants. They don’t have room for him in the outfield and for some unfathomable reason are committed to Jose Vidro at DH; HOWEVER, the ownership loves a sure draw at the box office and Griffey’s swan song in Seattle is good for at least a season’s worth of attraction.
If the Reds don’t try and trade Jr. there this season the M’s will definately make a strong push for him in ‘09.
Also, I’d like to say that there is no chance that Jeff Clement gets traded for the aging superstar, but Bill Bavasi is not a good GM.
Someone say something witty.
by Omerta on May 2, 2008 3:16 PM EDT 0 recs
Griffey won't retire. his Dad won't let him.
I wouldn’t be surprised to see EdE in RF, Bruce in CF and Dunn in Left,
Grif, Bailey maybe BP some prospects traded for a 3B RH bat or and RH batting catcher would be real helpful.
"There's more to being in the big leagues than just stats. Everyone is so stat-conscious." Dusty Baker
by Madville on May 3, 2008 11:24 AM EDT 0 recs
huh
you want to trade, grif, Bailey, phillips, and propsects, for a catcher or a third baseman? That seems rather drastic, considering this team is stocked with young talent about to really start producing, in Votto, Bruce, Bailey, Cueto, and EV, plus they are complenting a nice core of EdE, Phillips, Harang, Dunn (if they can keep him).
The Dusty Path to the World Series!*
*Note this is not an endorsment of Dusty Baker.
by justin007000 on
May 3, 2008 4:32 PM EDT
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I agree
Bruce is not a CF, he is a RF, so trading Griffey is fine, but come on.
Do you really think you will get better value out of Phillips in a trade? He is a Gold Glove defender and the only above average defender on the team. We just can’t bat him 1-4
Bailey will be fine. Why would we trade him while his value is so low? When he gets to the majors and shows that potential that made him the top prospect in baseball just send me an email about you getting back on the bandwagon.
I think whether or not Edwin stays at third hinges on Stubbs and Frazier’s progess. If Frazier gets to the majors first he will be at 3rd and Edwin can be moved to the OF and I guess we would have to force Bruce to CF. If Stubbs is ready first he will man CF with Bruce in RF and Edwin staying at 3rd.
by kennythered on
May 3, 2008 6:23 PM EDT
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