Who would you trade to get Holliday or Ordonez?
by Slyde on Oct 30, 2008 8:00 AM EDT
in Trade Ideas
72 comments
These are two players who have gotten some mention in the local press as potential acquisitions. I'm not so convinced, but I thought I'd bring them up to the RR intelligentsia. A couple of notes on both players:
Some have said that they don't want Holliday because of the Coors effect, but I'm not buying that as a reason. His power drops a bit away from Coors, but that should be less of an issue coming to GABP. Even with the dip in power, he's still posted lines of .301/.374/.485 and .308/.405/.486 on the road the last two years. He'd still be the Reds best hitter with those numbers.
I honestly don't have a whole lot of interest in Magglio Ordonez, but I thought he was a good juxtaposition to Holliday. As you can see, he'd probably be a defensive liability in LF and his contract is only attractive if he's not healthy - if that makes sense. The good news is that his availability is primarily because the Tigers want to dump some salary, so hopefully it wouldn't cost too much to acquire him. Still though, I'm not sure he's worth it.
What do you think? Do either of these guys interest you for LF next season? Who would you be willing to trade to get them?
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1. I thought Ordonez was better than that offensively. No way I touch a no-field 35 year old owed that much money if he isn’t one of the top hitters around.
2. If given a chance to negotiate a LTC, I’d offer (1) any two of Bailey/Thompson/Ramirez/Maloney (or any other pitching prospect), (2) any one of Lotzkar or Stewart, and (3) Todd Frasier; if I had to, add Dorn. But to make it as enticing as possible, I’d let them pick.
The more I think about it (and I think about Holliday in the middle of our lineup alot), I’m afraid Boras will never let that happen – he’ll want Holliday to hit free agency. If so, I’d grudgingly pass and start talking to Pat the Bat.
Often wrong, never uncertain.
by sidnancy on Oct 30, 2008 8:40 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Say what
Pat the bat, you have to be joking.
Boras is open to extentions. I say we need to explore that.
by Dave from Louisville on Oct 30, 2008 9:47 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Scott Boras = No Deal
At least not one that the Reds can afford. Having said that, I believe that the Bob and Walt show really want to make a splashy acquisition for ‘09. Don’t put it past Walt to offer Bailey,Thompson and Dickerson for Holliday and a decent AA player. I’d tade of the following 2 or 3 players for MH:
Bailey
Thompson
Frasier
Stubbs
Dickerson
Maloney
I really like Ramirez, I don’t think I’d want to give him up.
I could also see Walt giving up Cueto w/ a prospect or Edwin w/a prospect.
The Reds are not going to get Holliday unless they’re willing to give til it hurts.
I think that in the spirit of giving til it hurts we (RR) could throw in obc in the deal.
He’s big, can hit the curve a mile and he understands how the ‘money’ side the biz works….well maybe not obc he’s too valuable here at the site….how about neckbeard…whats that? ’He’s already been traded’ Oh………I’d love to see Holliday in a red’s uniform in 09…
(but he needs to get a license!)
We will bankrupt ourselves in the vain search for absolute security.
~Dwight D. Eisenhower
by Madville on Oct 30, 2008 10:01 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Mags & Holliday
Nah!!!!
Let’s be patient and build from our farm system. Take the extra cash and sign our young core players (Volquez, Cueto, Bruce, Votto, to long term contracts now. Look at Hairston and Burton for short term, say 1-3 years with options. Let the rest play another year and see how they do. I’m talking Hannigan, Rosales, Roenicke, Owings, Ramirez, Castillo, Richar, and Dickerson. Sign Casey Blake to play 3rd. Trade Ed E to anyone who wants him for a bucket of balls. If you can’t sign Blake we have enough infield guys to fill the hole. If Stubbs does well in Spring Training, let him play right with Dickerson/ Hopper/ Freel in center. Use Owings in the 5 spot in the rotation if he looks good in spring training. Move Phillips to short and let Kep/Hairston/Richar play 2nd. May not win a pennant, but I would hope to see at least an 81-81 season out of these guys. So, waddayathink, oneeyedjack for GM?
by oneeyedjack on Oct 30, 2008 10:46 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
not if you want to trade EdE for a bucket of balls
"You never want to give up a 7-0 lead, in your rival's ballpark, that would put them in first place. Never want to do that." - Ron Darling
by Slyde on Oct 30, 2008 10:52 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Or if you're looking for an 81-81 season
"My wife ain't never ran and got me no pheasant." - Fistbands
by BK on Oct 30, 2008 10:59 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
OOOOOOOOHHHHHHH!
I am. I am. I relish mediodrity.
Vote Pops in '08. I promise nothing and I'll do it!
by Pops Daniels on Oct 30, 2008 11:10 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
...explains all the recs you've given me.
by Brendanukkah on Oct 30, 2008 11:20 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
It also explains
why I had to break things off with your mom. Even I have standards.
Vote Pops in '08. I promise nothing and I'll do it!
by Pops Daniels on Oct 30, 2008 11:50 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
is that why you put it on a hot dog?
Think of me what you will...I gotta little space to fill
by chandrathan on Oct 30, 2008 11:31 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
My hotdog
is mediocrity incarnate.
Vote Pops in '08. I promise nothing and I'll do it!
by Pops Daniels on Oct 30, 2008 11:51 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
?
If the Reds trade EdE to get something of value and then sign Casey Blake as a stopgap, I guess I can see the logic in that.
But trading EdE for nothing and replacing him with Casey Blake makes no sense. In overall terms Edwin is better than Casey Blake, a decade younger and already under contract. Assuming EdE is as good as he’s going to be and Casey Blake doesn’t continue to decline, then you’re essentially replacing like for like. Only you’re doing it at a net cost.
Bavasi is already in the front office; no need for myopic jack.
Then 'twas the Roman, now 'tis I.
by Man Mountain on Oct 30, 2008 12:38 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Neither
The Rockies have flat out told the Reds they want Cueto, Juan Francisco and a major league bullpen arm. No way am I giving that up for 1 year of Holliday, who won’t sign an extension and has told people he is testing free agency.
As for Mags, too much money is owed to him given his age.
Go Beltre, move EE to LF and be done with that and then get a shortstop and here we come playoffs.
by dougdirt on Oct 30, 2008 11:11 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
The Rockies have flat out told the Reds they want Cueto, Juan Francisco and a major league bullpen arm
They don’t want Keppinger too?
I agree on all points, except that I’d rather have Roberts than Beltre. He might cost more prospects, but I like the idea of trying to sign him more than signing Beltre to a long-term deal. And I’d really prefer for the Reds to sign either one of them if they trade for them.
"You never want to give up a 7-0 lead, in your rival's ballpark, that would put them in first place. Never want to do that." - Ron Darling
by Slyde on Oct 30, 2008 11:15 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
i agree with Doug
i think Beltre > Roberts for us.
EdE – LF
Beltre – 3B
BP – SS
Kepp – 2B
i think is better than
EdE – 3B
BP – SS
Roberts – 2B
? – LF
though i think the offense would be better off with Roberts, the defense would be much better off with Beltre. of course, this is not to say we cant have both. i can envision a scenario where Walt can swing both of these without completely ripping up the farm. its not likely, and it may not be for the best, but its a possibility.
"If you don't get the President of the United States on that phone, you know what's gonna happen to you? You're gonna have to answer to the Coca-Cola company."
by Charlie Scrabbles on Oct 30, 2008 11:42 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
why would you put Kepp at 2B but not 3B?
EdE – LF
Kepp – 3B
BP – SS
Roberts – 2B
"You never want to give up a 7-0 lead, in your rival's ballpark, that would put them in first place. Never want to do that." - Ron Darling
by Slyde on Oct 30, 2008 11:44 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
...
because. thats why.
good point. i dont know why i wasnt think about that. i withdraw my objection.
"If you don't get the President of the United States on that phone, you know what's gonna happen to you? You're gonna have to answer to the Coca-Cola company."
by Charlie Scrabbles on Oct 30, 2008 11:57 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
because of his arm?
Then 'twas the Roman, now 'tis I.
by Man Mountain on Oct 30, 2008 12:43 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
maybe
but wouldn’t that balance out by the fact that he doesn’t make many throwing errors? He’s made 5 throwing errors in just over 1900 defensive innings in the Majors.
It’s moot though, because I’ve recently had a conversation that has turned me on to the idea of Sea Bass and Kepp splitting time at 3B. If he’s healthy, Gonzalez could be a very good defensive 3B, but since Keppinger kills left-handed pitching, it would make sense to put him in there against lefties. Both guys suck against righties though – so there’s that.
"You never want to give up a 7-0 lead, in your rival's ballpark, that would put them in first place. Never want to do that." - Ron Darling
by Slyde on Oct 30, 2008 12:57 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
can we put a crash dummy out there when righties pitch?
"It will put a smile on your face to see a Chevy with a Soviet transmission"
by justin007000 on Oct 30, 2008 1:44 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Kep at 2b but not 3B
After Keppinger’s 2008 OPS of .656, I would not give him the 3B job. The standard MLB starting 2Bman this decade has an average OPS of .770. For starting third basemen, it’s .803.
We could do better at 3B. If you have a no-hit guy, you don’t want to stick him at a position where skill sets traditionally dictate that there are much better-hitting replacement players available, on average. This is why Juan Castro should have never even tried on a first baseman’s mitt.
by PeteyHendrix on Oct 30, 2008 6:35 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
again
I’ll refer you to this comment, so that I don’t have to retype it. I know the Reds could do better at 3B, but they can’t do it without spending some money or sending out some prospects. My point is that I’d much rather have a guy like Roberts than a guy like Beltre, but of course I’d rather have both of those guys over having Keppinger at 3B. If the Reds can only afford to acquire one guy, then I’d hope that guy was Roberts instead of Beltre because I think the collection of Roberts (2B), Phillips (SS), Kepp/Gonzo (3B), and EdE (LF) is better overall (offense and defense) than Kepp (2B), Phillips (SS), Beltre (3B), EdE (LF).
"You never want to give up a 7-0 lead, in your rival's ballpark, that would put them in first place. Never want to do that." - Ron Darling
by Slyde on Oct 30, 2008 7:14 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
While I agree with most of your comment...
my sole disagreement is that Kep at 3B is NEVER a good option for ANY team based on his recent offensive performance. You paint a possible scenario that has Gonzo and Kep splitting time at a position neither of them have demonstrated they can play at the major league level, while neither of them hit well enough to warrant them consideration offensively at 3B. I believe that a replacement-level 3Bman (cheap FA, Rule V pick, 6-yr minor league FA, waiver claim, rushed prospect) might be better than this proposed platoon, and that is my issue.
Beyond that, I think I agree with just about everything you’ve typed since August. :P
by PeteyHendrix on Oct 31, 2008 12:55 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
than why not keep EdE at 3B?
"It will put a smile on your face to see a Chevy with a Soviet transmission"
by justin007000 on Oct 31, 2008 1:28 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
can you put this in a graph form please?
We will bankrupt ourselves in the vain search for absolute security.
~Dwight D. Eisenhower
by Madville on Oct 30, 2008 3:21 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
You brought this up before
And I finally found what I don’t like about it.
EdE had an OPS of .806 last year. Only 4 of the 17 “full time” LFs in the majors had a lower OPS, and EdE played in a hitter’s park. Plus, you have to assume he wouldn’t be a negative defensively.
EdE isn’t the answer, either long or short term, in LF. Whether Betre is acquired or not, there will still be 2 holes – RH power, and LF.
Often wrong, never uncertain.
by sidnancy on Oct 30, 2008 1:15 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I've also pointed out before
that it only matters in terms of who you replace him with. If you’ve got somebody better to play LF, then by all means play him there. Position only matters in terms of replacement players. The goal is to put the best bats in the lineup in positions where they can provide the best defense. We know that position is not 3B for Edwin. Maybe it’s left field.
I’d say Edwin is one of the top 100 hitters in baseball. That doesn’t make him a star, but if the talent is evenly spread, that makes him one of the 4 best hitters on any team (obviously the talent is not evenly spread). That type of offense is not easily replaced.
When you are comparing players to others that play that position, what you are really talking about is what is that players value compared to others his player pool. That’s the kind of stuff you talk about when discussing contracts. What we’re looking at is how to put the best team on the field for the Reds. Would we like to have a huge bat in LF? Sure, but if you’ve got big bats in RF and 1B, with very good bats at 3B and 2B, you don’t need to have a top 5 hitter in LF. All I’m saying is first look at the offensive talent across the team and then find a way to best utilize that talent defensively.
I don’t buy the needing RH power even if they acquire Beltre. Acquiring Beltre gives them 3 different right-handed hitters with 25+ HR power. How is that a need?
"You never want to give up a 7-0 lead, in your rival's ballpark, that would put them in first place. Never want to do that." - Ron Darling
by Slyde on Oct 30, 2008 1:34 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Slyde, you ignorant slut
If you worried half as much about fielding a winning team as you did about who you’re going to lure into your mom’s basement for various ilicid acts your comments might make a modicum of sense. (I would use a smiley or emoticon here, but I refuse to admit they exist).
Acquiring Beltre gives them 3 different right-handed hitters with 25+ HR power.
Beltre has slugged over .482 once in his career, and reached base more than 33% of the time once since ‘01. Phillips set career highs in ’07 in OBP (.331) and SLG (.485). EdE reaches base more than either, but still had a “very good” year this year while slugging .466. That ain’t Murderer’s Row.
Sure, but if you’ve got big bats in RF and 1B, with very good bats at 3B and 2B, you don’t need to have a top 5 hitter in LF
If the Bill James projections are accurate, Votto would be one of the top 15 hitters in the league, and Bruce one of the top 20 – as a 22 year old. Forgive me if i’m skeptical.
Meanwile, Phillips’s bat (.754 OPS) isn’t “very good”; teams averaged a .747 OPS at 2B this year. Beltre would be slightly above average at 3B (.784 vs. .771 league average), but not “very good”.
So while you see two “big bats” and 2 “very good”, I see 2 very good and 2 (3, counting EdE in LF) average hitters, with serious question marks elsewhere. While replacing CoPat with any animal, vegetable, or mineral will help the offense, remember that this team was only 12th in the league in RS last year with Dunn in the middle of the offense 2/3 of the time.
Often wrong, never uncertain.
by sidnancy on Oct 30, 2008 2:17 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
a Beltre team would pick up tons of runs defensively and don’t discount what Great American Ballpark would do to Beltre’s production. It’s a huge change to go from SAFECO to here, I bet Beltre could hit 30 dingers and put up .280/.330/.490 here with his sterling defense
by NeifiChicken on Oct 30, 2008 2:24 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I find it more useful
to compare starting position players’ OPS numbers to other starting position players’ OPS, rather than the average of every player who put on a glove there…including Manos de Oro and every other scrub who got a spot start.
This decade, here are the MLB starting position players average OPS by position:
DH .911
1B .865
RF/LF .826
3B .803
CF .780
2B .770
C .758
SS .739
by PeteyHendrix on Oct 30, 2008 6:43 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I want Holliday
If it’s true we can’t sign him to an extension, then nevermind, but I could dig this as the heart of our lineup for the next 3 or 4 years.
(BIll James Projections)
Hitter R RBI Avg OBP Slg OPS
Bruce 94 90 0.296 0.351 0.540 0.891
Holliday 111 108 0.317 0.392 0.545 0.937
Votto 87 102 0.307 0.386 0.536 0.922
Bruce Bonser? Boone Bonser? Boot Bonser? BOOSE BONZER?
by Lakeman on Oct 30, 2008 11:30 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I'd Love Holliday
but like everyone else, it would be a lot to give up for one year.
Anyone else think Walt is gonna make a run at Edgar Renteria? He is now a FA, Detroit declined his option, he was pretty solid in 2007 for Atlanta, but if my memory serves he isn’t the best fielder.
Find me on MySpace- http://www.myspace.com/mixfmkyle
by MixFMKyle on Oct 30, 2008 12:46 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
He may be a decent buy-low candidate
but his defensive trend scares me.
Offensively his batted ball data looks very similar to the rest of his career, but his final numbers don’t fall in line. I’d say he’s a decent bet to bounce back. But that defense doesn’t excite me:
RAR FRAR TtlVal
2006 26.9 2.0 34.2
2007 36.0 -1.7 38.6
2008 3.0 -8.5 -0.6
"You never want to give up a 7-0 lead, in your rival's ballpark, that would put them in first place. Never want to do that." - Ron Darling
by Slyde on Oct 30, 2008 2:01 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
One thing that I forgot to mention...
He did start swinging at a lot more at pitches out of the strike zone, by about 6% more. This led to a drop in walk-rate, which definitely concerns me. If he can correct that, he’d definitely be worth a flier – if his defense isn’t going to continue to suck.
"You never want to give up a 7-0 lead, in your rival's ballpark, that would put them in first place. Never want to do that." - Ron Darling
by Slyde on Oct 30, 2008 2:04 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Some news
Ken Macha to be named the Brewers manager.
Brandon Phillips Wins the 2008 Fielding Bible Award for Best-Fielding Second Baseman in Major League Baseball. (No link, it came through email). Adrian Beltre wins at 3B.
"You never want to give up a 7-0 lead, in your rival's ballpark, that would put them in first place. Never want to do that." - Ron Darling
by Slyde on Oct 30, 2008 1:00 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Link for BP
If the link does take you directly to winners, then click on the link that button that says “Winners.”
Here’s the graph on BP:
This one surprised me, but it shouldn’t have. Brandon Phillips finished third in our voting last year and now has won his first Fielding Bible Award with 86 points. I voted for Chase Utley, who had the highest Plus/Minus figure at any position this year (+47 – see the Kenny Rogers discussion below for more information about the Plus/Minus System). But the panelists who watched Phillips play more regularly have seen what he can do on the field and rewarded him accordingly.
Then 'twas the Roman, now 'tis I.
by Man Mountain on Oct 30, 2008 1:26 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Don't you guys want to move EdE to left instead?
Holiday would definitely be a huge bat, but he would cost much more than Beltre to acquire. You could also argue that when defense is factored in, the team is just as good with Beltre at 3B and EdE in LF than a team with EdE at 3B and Holliday at LF.
That might not be true, but it’s not as big a gap as most would think and it wouldn’t cost a ton out of the farm system.
That’s the move I think would work well for the Reds, but I’d also see if the Reds could add great pieces in a Beltre deal to try and pick up Jeff Clement OR Wladamir Balentien. It’s unlikely since SEA probably has no interest in getting rid of young players, but who knows.
If not, take Beltre and try and shop around for a decent catcher like Bengie Molina, Jarrod Saltalamacchia, Gerald Laird, Kelly Shoppach, etc.
by NeifiChicken on Oct 30, 2008 1:29 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Hanigan
I don’t see why the Reds shouldn’t go into the season with Ryan Hanigan as the projected starter. He played pretty well at the end of the season, and he’s already here under contract.
He’s not a power hitter, but I was impressed with his approach at the plate and he seemed to be an above average defender.
Bill James’ Projections seems to foresee a durability issue with him; either that or he thinks the Reds will pick up another catcher to vie with him. But it looks to me Hanigan could be a league average starter in the NL.
Then 'twas the Roman, now 'tis I.
by Man Mountain on Oct 30, 2008 1:39 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Bill James Projection
I’m guessing that 28 year old rookies don’t project to get a lot of playing time.
"You never want to give up a 7-0 lead, in your rival's ballpark, that would put them in first place. Never want to do that." - Ron Darling
by Slyde on Oct 30, 2008 1:41 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Devoid of context, I can understand that
but having watched Hanigan play, do you think catcher is a glaring need for the Reds? Jocketty hasn’t been banging the drum about looking for a catcher and has even suggested that Hanigan impressed everyone.
Let me make try to flesh out my argument a little…
I realize that part of Hanigan’s allure is that he’s an unknown quantity who’s hit better than we expected in very limited time: 274/.367/.368 in 36 games and 95 ABs. That batting average is higher than we can expect in the majors, but he’s been able to put up an OBP in and around .350 each season in professional ball.
He had a good defensive reputation in the minors coming in, and he’s lived up to that so far. 1 E, 1 PB in 250 major league innings, and he’s thrown out roughly a third of runners stealing against him.
He had a reputation for being patient at the plate in the minors, and he’s lived up to that so far. He also showed the stamina to play 100 games a year in the minors. I don’t see why he couldn’t play 110 games with the Reds in a major league season.
The list of catchers the Chicken gave us is basically the list I’ve seen most often associated with the Reds potential targets except I’ll add free agents Josh Bard and Michael Barrett and Greg Zaun.
Of those, only Shoppach would be a definite upgrade offensively, and I’m not sure if he’d be worth what Cleveland would want to part with him.
Salty will probably be better eventually, but he’ll be expensive to pry away from Texas as well.
Molina is a wash with a lower OBP and over 1,000 games more wear and tear on those joints.
I’ll go out on a limb and say Laird would probably end up being a downgrade. In fact, I think Laird sucks.
With Josh Bard, who knows what you’re getting. The Bard of ‘06 and ’07 or the oft-injured Pattersonian Bard of ’08? He might be worth a flyer. But he’s a definite risk.
Barrett has sucked out loud since leaving Chicago. He’s not a solid defensive catcher and pitchers are critical of the games he calls. Might be worth a look, but I’d pass.
Greg Zaun is an interesting idea, but he’s also 38 and his numbers would probably end up being a wash with Hanigan’s.
So if the Reds think that Hanigan can go 105-110 games with good defense and a .340-350 OBP, then I don’t think they’ll waste much time looking to bring in a new catcher.
Then 'twas the Roman, now 'tis I.
by Man Mountain on Oct 30, 2008 2:45 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Hanigan
I think there’s some definite intrigue with him, but I don’t know if he’s really a guy you’d want as a starter. To me, he seems like a guy who could be a decent backup, but would probably be exposed with too many at bats. As productive as some of his minor league years have been, he’s also had some terrible ones and he’s always been a bit too old for his levels.
I could see having him share the load with a low cost veteran like Bard or Zaun, but I think ideally the Reds can aim higher. I’d check into the price of Saltamacchia as TEX is hard up for pitching (as they should be) and have such depth at the position. I think Salty could have a great year this year with Cinci and would obviously help the team over the next 4 years.
by NeifiChicken on Oct 30, 2008 3:29 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Salty is a good option
I like a platoon of a 23-year-old switch-hitting catcher with good minor league (and almost-average MLB) numbers and Hanigan, a solid-appearing backstop whom pitchers like to throw to.
How cheap is Salty?
by PeteyHendrix on Oct 30, 2008 6:55 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don't have any problem with Hanigan splitting the catching position
even being the primary, with a sufficient back up like the Bard or Z-game. My point was only that projections are mostly void of specific context – that’s the whole point – and that’s why the projections have him at so few plate appearances.
I think Hanigan is typical replacement level player. A guy who will have one or two decent seasons, but will mostly be a backup and will likely only put in a 5-year stint in the Majors.
"You never want to give up a 7-0 lead, in your rival's ballpark, that would put them in first place. Never want to do that." - Ron Darling
by Slyde on Oct 30, 2008 4:32 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
i feel like he may put in more than 5 years in the Majors
simply because he is a catcher, and a good defensive catcher can stick around for a long time even if he can’t hit a wiffle ball. See Paul Bako, Chad Moeller, Jason LaRue…..
"It will put a smile on your face to see a Chevy with a Soviet transmission"
by justin007000 on Oct 30, 2008 4:35 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
i am for leaving EdE at 3B
with Fransico and Varikia due to be in Cincinnati by 2010 or 2011, I think we can handle one or two more years of EdE. I would much rather look for middle relief help which includes somebody who isn’t Dave Weathers, and replacing Affedlt, and a left fielder. Dickerson as we ahve discussed probably won’t hurt anythign playing regurarly in center next year, and hopefully Stubbs or Dorn are ready by 2010.
"It will put a smile on your face to see a Chevy with a Soviet transmission"
by justin007000 on Oct 30, 2008 1:48 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Island Update
Juan Francisco’s first week in la liga invernal with Los Gigentes del Cibao:
.270 BA through 8 games and 37ABs- 9 hits, 10 runs, 2 doubles, 3 HR, and 6 RBI.
Not so hot is his .289 OBP and 0 walks.
Tanzen!
by Verka Serduchka on Oct 30, 2008 2:16 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
source:
Gigantes (not gigentes) website.
Tanzen!
by Verka Serduchka on Oct 30, 2008 2:18 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
i think if we are going to talk Magglio Ordonez (not that we seriously are)
you have to look at Pat Burrell first. he is more or less the same LF that Ordonez would be, only he would cost less money (this assumes that Burrell could be had for a 3 year deal at ~45-50 mil) and, being a free agent, zero prospects. it wouldnt be the worst thing this team ever did, but that doesnt make it ok. i think we should pass on any major LF acquisition.
"If you don't get the President of the United States on that phone, you know what's gonna happen to you? You're gonna have to answer to the Coca-Cola company."
by Charlie Scrabbles on Oct 30, 2008 3:41 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, did you see Pat loaf on that double last night?!!
Only sign Burrell if we need to feed the Brennamonster.
Seriously, I wouldn’t sign him. He’ll probably command at least 4 years and I don’t see him aging well, which is supported by his comps.
by ken on Oct 30, 2008 4:24 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
agreed
i believe MM’s quip about Burrell’s double was that “he looked like he was running in heels”. Dunn runs better than Burrell and is 4 years younger. really my only point was that Burrell > Mags, and we dont want Burrell.
"If you don't get the President of the United States on that phone, you know what's gonna happen to you? You're gonna have to answer to the Coca-Cola company."
by Charlie Scrabbles on Oct 30, 2008 5:15 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Sign & Trade
I wish MLB had the NBA’s sign and trade..so do the Rockies, I imagine, as it would drive up Holliday’s price. He’d be my pick between the two, but only if you can get him through age 34 or 35. He’s worth little to this team for one year.
by jamesp50014 on Oct 30, 2008 6:28 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
MLB teams can allow trade partners to negotiate with a player they are acquiring
the Mets did it with Johann Santana last season before they traded for him. After the principles were agreed upon, the Mets had 72 hours to sign an extension with Santana.
"You never want to give up a 7-0 lead, in your rival's ballpark, that would put them in first place. Never want to do that." - Ron Darling
by Slyde on Oct 30, 2008 7:07 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I wonder...
how normal this practice is in MLB. I’m a bit out of date, but sign and trades seem(ed) much more common in the NBA than in MLB. Willing to stand corrected. I’d be willing to part with some talent, Bailey, EdE, Dickerson, Stubbs, for Holliday.
by jamesp50014 on Oct 30, 2008 7:30 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
the Reds did a "sign and trade" with Rheal Cormier
it isn’t uncommon with young players in the last year of their contract, with the reciving club not wanting to trade the farm for a one year rental, or for older players who have a no trade clause, and nearing the end of the contract, they could use their no trade clause as a bargining chip to get an extenion with their new team, thus insuring a contract that probably pays more than their production would warrent, see Cormier, Rheal.
"It will put a smile on your face to see a Chevy with a Soviet transmission"
by justin007000 on Oct 30, 2008 8:52 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
we did it with griffey didn't we?
Think of me what you will...I gotta little space to fill
by chandrathan on Oct 31, 2008 8:51 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I believe they did
"You never want to give up a 7-0 lead, in your rival's ballpark, that would put them in first place. Never want to do that." - Ron Darling
by Slyde on Oct 31, 2008 9:00 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Where's the office thread?
This place is like a sexy preschool.
by Gray on Oct 30, 2008 9:06 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
btw
I’m rooting for Pam or Jim to cheat on the other. I’m tired of kneeling at the altar or their perfect love.
by Red Menace on Oct 31, 2008 2:28 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
you soulless bastard
Think of me what you will...I gotta little space to fill
by chandrathan on Oct 31, 2008 8:51 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
His heart is pure black
"You never want to give up a 7-0 lead, in your rival's ballpark, that would put them in first place. Never want to do that." - Ron Darling
by Slyde on Oct 31, 2008 9:00 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I rec'd this
I’m not sure why I just cackle after reading this, but yeah. The whole “omg even Jim’s brothers love her.” was a bit much. Except that it showed that Jim is far better at pranking than his brothers, no?
...because there's already someone posing as Jacob Brumfield
by Cy Schourek on Oct 31, 2008 1:55 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
pam is going to fuck some guy from art school
"It will put a smile on your face to see a Chevy with a Soviet transmission"
by justin007000 on Oct 31, 2008 2:30 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
at first I thought that was a possibility
but they moved away from that direction. That episode were Jim was freaked out and jealous driving to New York, then turns around when he remembers they have the most perfect relationship put me over the top.
I want more Creed and Kelly.
by Red Menace on Nov 2, 2008 5:27 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
i hope creed fucks pam
"It is a damn poor mind indeed which can’t think of at least two ways to spell any word."-Andy Jack
by justin007000 on Nov 2, 2008 5:55 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I hope Creed fucks Jim
Everybody's a jerk. You. Me. This jerk.
by andromache on Nov 3, 2008 8:53 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I was about to ask about the new tagline
until I saw the “Be Equipped To Root For The Red Sox!” ad. Fuckin’ Christ, guys.
"My wife ain't never ran and got me no pheasant." - Fistbands
by BK on Oct 30, 2008 11:35 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
What are these 'ads' you speak of?
"Aio, quantitas magna frumentorum est."
by jch24 on Oct 31, 2008 9:55 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Not there anymore. Figures.
"My wife ain't never ran and got me no pheasant." - Fistbands
by BK on Oct 31, 2008 10:26 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The tagline may not be helping the advertisements though
if the page title has “Red Sox” in it, it really makes the site look like a Red Sox site to other computers.
And nobody consulted me on it. They just took away my Supreme Ruler title and cut off my nutsack.
"You never want to give up a 7-0 lead, in your rival's ballpark, that would put them in first place. Never want to do that." - Ron Darling
by Slyde on Oct 31, 2008 12:37 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Oooohhhh, nutsack!
Can I have it? I lost mine about a year ago, along with my dignity, dream, and self-respect. But not the way I wear my hat. they can never take that from me.
"Aio, quantitas magna frumentorum est."
by jch24 on Oct 31, 2008 2:21 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Whoa, how did that happen?
"My wife ain't never ran and got me no pheasant." - Fistbands
by BK on Oct 31, 2008 4:29 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
some primary blogger around here decided to finally show and stake his territory
"You never want to give up a 7-0 lead, in your rival's ballpark, that would put them in first place. Never want to do that." - Ron Darling
by Slyde on Oct 31, 2008 8:16 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
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