Evan Almighty vs. Bruce Almighty

by Slyde on Oct 22, 2008 10:19 AM EDT in Features Comment 68 comments

Mike Carlson/AP

Reuters

Evan Longoria has gotten a lot of pub lately with his performance in the playoffs, as well he should. He's had one of the best post-seasons by a rookie in recent memory, and he's still got at least 4 more games to go. It's been a fine topper to a very good rookie season.

And yet, I'm still left wondering who I would take between Longoria and our own Jay Bruce over the long term. Longoria has clearly had a better start to his Major League career, but that is only one piece to the puzzle for two players who have incredibly bright futures laying before them.

In his Baseball Prospect Book last season, John Sickels rated Bruce #1 for hitters with Longoria a close 2nd. They both destroyed the minors, with Bruce showing a little more power (.308/.366/.555) and Longoria a little more plate discipline (.301/.386/.534). The both came up with strong defensive reputations, but I think it's safe to say that only Longoria has shown that to be true at this point. That's not to say Bruce won't improve, but some are already talking about Longoria for the Gold Glove.

Longoria definitely has the head start in the majors, but I wouldn't discount the year-and-a-half age difference between the two. If we were talking about a 31-year old-and a 30-year old, it wouldn't be that big of a deal, but young players at this age can make huge strides from one season to the next. It wouldn't be shocking for Bruce to have a better offensive year than Longoria next year. So while this past season was important, it shouldn't be the end of the discussion.

Which leads me to this...who would take, if given the choice of having one or the other? I honestly don't think there is wrong choice. I think both of these guys are going to be MVP caliber players for most of the next 10 years. If I had the choice between the two, I'd probably take Longoria because of the defense, but truthfully I'm just happy that we have one of them on the Reds.

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I'd have to take Longoria as well

Just because it’s “easier” to find a great all-around player in the OF than it is at 3B.

"Aio, quantitas magna frumentorum est."

by jch24 on Oct 22, 2008 10:33 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Agreed for the same reasons.

Not to say i’m not happy with Hova, though.

"Yes, and it's so important in this sport that the athletes be able to train in the same location." -Cynthia Potter, NBC Synchronized Diving Analyst

by 3 Fast 3 Furious on Oct 22, 2008 10:46 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I wanted to tear you apart on this one

but you put easier in quotation marks. Nice CYA.

"You never want to give up a 7-0 lead, in your rival's ballpark, that would put them in first place. Never want to do that." - Ron Darling

by Slyde on Oct 22, 2008 3:59 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Well, the thing is

It’s never easy to find a player like Longoria or Bruce. It’s like choosing between sex and sex.

"Aio, quantitas magna frumentorum est."

by jch24 on Oct 22, 2008 4:08 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

you're married

so it is difficult for you to find sex

"It will put a smile on your face to see a Chevy with a Soviet transmission"

by justin007000 on Oct 22, 2008 4:22 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

are you sure about that?

"You never want to give up a 7-0 lead, in your rival's ballpark, that would put them in first place. Never want to do that." - Ron Darling

by Slyde on Oct 22, 2008 4:26 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

are you stalking me?

"It will put a smile on your face to see a Chevy with a Soviet transmission"

by justin007000 on Oct 22, 2008 4:40 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

was married

WAS married.

"Aio, quantitas magna frumentorum est."

by jch24 on Oct 22, 2008 4:48 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

oh sorry about that

"It will put a smile on your face to see a Chevy with a Soviet transmission"

by justin007000 on Oct 22, 2008 5:03 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Me, too

Not to mention the fun of seeing other teams put up Eva Longoria’s picture on the Jumbotron when he’s at the plate. ;-)

All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?

by BubbaFan on Oct 22, 2008 4:35 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Besides

There’s only one outfielder for you.

by Brendanukkah on Oct 22, 2008 4:37 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Bobby Crosby

Then 'twas the Roman, now 'tis I.

by Man Mountain on Oct 22, 2008 4:44 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs

Bubba's brother

The shortstop. At least according to Michael Kay. :-D

As if that’s not confusing enough, there’s a minor leaguer named Bryan Crosby, who is already being confused with Bobby and Bubba by the memorabilia dealers.

All Things Bubba: Because how can you not love a baseball player named Bubba?

by BubbaFan on Oct 22, 2008 6:01 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Nice

you get me to chuckle quite often. Rec’d.

Vote Pops in '08. I promise nothing and I'll do it!

by Pops Daniels on Oct 22, 2008 6:37 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Larry Walker vs. Mike Schmidt

both are winners

by SadbutTrue on Oct 22, 2008 10:49 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

I'd rather have Walker, personally

but then again, I wasn’t around for Schmidt.

...because there's already someone posing as Jacob Brumfield

by Cy Schourek on Oct 22, 2008 12:38 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Trust me

No you wouldn’t.

Schmidt hit like ARod or Lance Berkman (career OPS+ 147) and won 10 Gold Gloves at 3B (mostly deserved). He also played 145+ games in 13 consecutive non-strike seasons (and 101/107 in ’81).

Walker hit like Brian Giles or Gary Sheffield (career OPS+ 140), winning 7 GGs. But, he only played 145+ games once in his career and only 10 over 130 games. In fact, Schmidt spent about a month longer in the bigs (Walker’s 1st year started in August instead of September; his last lasted the whole season vs. May 28), but played 416 more games than Walker.

He hit better, fielded a tougher position at least as well (most would argue better), and played much more often. Schmidt>>>>Walker.

Often wrong, never uncertain.

by sidnancy on Oct 22, 2008 1:19 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

...but...but...

the fans didn’t like him? He looked ridiculous in powder blue? He never ran straight from 3rd back to first when he was caught in a rundown? Something, right?

...because there's already someone posing as Jacob Brumfield

by Cy Schourek on Oct 22, 2008 1:38 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

No way

It’s at best Schmidt >>>Walker. I’d say it’s more like Schmidt >>Walker.

"You never want to give up a 7-0 lead, in your rival's ballpark, that would put them in first place. Never want to do that." - Ron Darling

by Slyde on Oct 22, 2008 3:57 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

i dont know

i dont think you can lose in choosing here. but just for kicks i’ll take The Next Big Thing. i think he could lead the league in homers for a good stretch of his career. extrapolating his numbers from this season over a full season, he would have hit 31 home runs. as a 21 year old. with some pretty big holes in his swing too.

and Bruce Almighty was a much better picture than Evan Almighty.

"If you don't get the President of the United States on that phone, you know what's gonna happen to you? You're gonna have to answer to the Coca-Cola company."

by Charlie Scrabbles on Oct 22, 2008 11:35 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

"Jay Hova" is a much better nickname than "The Housewife"

Advantage: Bruce.

by Brendanukkah on Oct 22, 2008 11:44 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

can we call him "The Housewifen"

it would be sort of like ’tHan in being a grammar joke that only absolute dorks would get.

...because there's already someone posing as Jacob Brumfield

by Cy Schourek on Oct 22, 2008 2:15 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Best reasoning I've heard all day

"You never want to give up a 7-0 lead, in your rival's ballpark, that would put them in first place. Never want to do that." - Ron Darling

by Slyde on Oct 22, 2008 3:57 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Oof.

I mean really, that’s tough.

The biggest reason it’s tough is you’re talking about a very limited view of both players. Based on what we’ve seen so far, I’d take Longoria. He hit significantly better this year in every way – better average, better power (ISO .259 vs. .199), better walk rate (every 11.04 PA vs. 13.7), better k/bb ratio. He also was 7/7 in SB while Bruce was 4/10 (two of those coming on the back end of double steals). Finally, as you said, he was better defensively.

But when talking about both, you’re also talking about potential. Bruce has the tools to be a better hitter than Longoria; while RF isn’t as defensively tough nor as important, he also has the ability to be very good there.

I dunno. Like you said, it’s nice to even be able to make the comparison, because Bruce can easily be the cornerstone of a very good team for many years.

Often wrong, never uncertain.

by sidnancy on Oct 22, 2008 1:02 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

contract

The other nice thing about Longoria, as a “property,” is his contract. He signed an extension about a week into his first season, and unless he gets injured it looks like it will result in an incredibly good value for the Rays. I’d like to see the Reds do a similar extension with Bruce this offseason. By giving him guaranteed financial security for life (i.e. millions) this early in his career, teams can usually get players to sign at a massive discount below what you can reasonably (or even conservatively) project them to be worth during their arbitration and early free agent years.

Other examples of this kind of thing include the Tigers’ extension of Granderson and the Rockies’ extension of Tulowitzki last offseason. I know Tulo had a bad season, but he missed much of it with injury and finished up strong. He looks, along with Granderson, to be a very nice value over the length of his contract.
-j

On Baseball and the Reds

by JinAZ on Oct 22, 2008 1:38 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

I'm too lazy to look

But I read an article in the past day or 2 that the Jays tried to sign Upton to a LTC before he hit the majors, one that would cover like 8 or 9 years.

Often wrong, never uncertain.

by sidnancy on Oct 22, 2008 3:48 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I believe back then they were known as the Devil Jays

"You never want to give up a 7-0 lead, in your rival's ballpark, that would put them in first place. Never want to do that." - Ron Darling

by Slyde on Oct 22, 2008 3:55 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs

Jays, Rays

You know what I meant.

Often wrong, never uncertain.

by sidnancy on Oct 23, 2008 4:36 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

You can call them Rays. And you can call them Jays.

by Brendanukkah on Oct 23, 2008 4:43 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs

and betty when you call me

you can call me al

Think of me what you will...I gotta little space to fill

by chandrathan on Oct 24, 2008 11:31 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

but my name

is veronica

by bbjones on Oct 25, 2008 7:14 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

diversity is an old old wooden ship

"It will put a smile on your face to see a Chevy with a Soviet transmission"

by justin007000 on Oct 22, 2008 3:25 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

what the hell?

"If you don't get the President of the United States on that phone, you know what's gonna happen to you? You're gonna have to answer to the Coca-Cola company."

by Charlie Scrabbles on Oct 22, 2008 3:42 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

i like the dr. strangelove reference

"It will put a smile on your face to see a Chevy with a Soviet transmission"

by justin007000 on Oct 22, 2008 3:47 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

are you sure about that?

"You never want to give up a 7-0 lead, in your rival's ballpark, that would put them in first place. Never want to do that." - Ron Darling

by Slyde on Oct 22, 2008 3:52 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

the dr. strangelove reference is his sig

"It will put a smile on your face to see a Chevy with a Soviet transmission"

by justin007000 on Oct 22, 2008 4:22 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

ah, I tend to miss sigs anymore

they blend in with the scenery

"You never want to give up a 7-0 lead, in your rival's ballpark, that would put them in first place. Never want to do that." - Ron Darling

by Slyde on Oct 22, 2008 4:27 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

thanks

but you didnt answer my question.

"If you don't get the President of the United States on that phone, you know what's gonna happen to you? You're gonna have to answer to the Coca-Cola company."

by Charlie Scrabbles on Oct 22, 2008 4:37 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

i'm practicing for when i run for public office

you ask an excellent question, and i’m glad that you asked it. Americans like you are what makes this country great. I know you are hurting so in my adaministration I will do everything I can to help you, give you the change you need. You will know each and everyday when you wake up you will have a President who is on your side.

Actually i just felt like an anchorman quote was in order.

"It will put a smile on your face to see a Chevy with a Soviet transmission"

by justin007000 on Oct 22, 2008 4:42 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

adaministration

Out and out punny.

Vote Pops in '08. I promise nothing and I'll do it!

by Pops Daniels on Oct 22, 2008 6:39 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Wasn't that what makes up Wolverine's skeleton and claws?

"Yes, and it's so important in this sport that the athletes be able to train in the same location." -Cynthia Potter, NBC Synchronized Diving Analyst

by 3 Fast 3 Furious on Oct 23, 2008 8:28 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

chinese democracy:

http://www.imeem.com/gunsnroses/music/ZDPzX2B2/guns_n_roses_chinese_democracy/

Then 'twas the Roman, now 'tis I.

by Man Mountain on Oct 22, 2008 4:04 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

hmmm

I’m not sure what I think. The first comment says, “i dont know what yall are talking about, this song is fucking awesome” The second comment says, “This fucking sucks…”

I can see both sides of their well thought out arguments. I’m undecided.

"You never want to give up a 7-0 lead, in your rival's ballpark, that would put them in first place. Never want to do that." - Ron Darling

by Slyde on Oct 22, 2008 4:07 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

There's a Falun Gong reference

And the Falun Gong activists in DC piss me off. Ergo, I hate it.

by Brendanukkah on Oct 22, 2008 4:40 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

BA's Jim Callis did an ESPN chat and was asked

if he would rather have Longoria or Bruce. He picked Longoria.

Callis also was asked by someone I assume is a Yankees fan if the Reds would take Austin Jackson, Ian Kennedy and Mark Melancon for Bruce. You could almost hear Callis laughing as he typed that the Reds wouldn’t touch such an offer.

We Are ... Marshall!

by Thundering Turtle on Oct 22, 2008 4:57 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Everybody up there pumped

for the gimmick-out on Saturday?

Then 'twas the Roman, now 'tis I.

by Man Mountain on Oct 22, 2008 5:17 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Just another Saturday in Happy Valley

Wait, they’re pulling this shit in the ’Shoe? And John Cooper will be there?! Fuck me.

by Brendanukkah on Oct 22, 2008 5:21 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

John Cooper will be there?

well i’ll be. last i heard of him he was selling fruit on the side of the road outside Pataskala.

"If you don't get the President of the United States on that phone, you know what's gonna happen to you? You're gonna have to answer to the Coca-Cola company."

by Charlie Scrabbles on Oct 22, 2008 5:33 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

he actually sells fruit smoothies

i’ll see if i can find a picture of Lloyd Carr drinking one up

Then 'twas the Roman, now 'tis I.

by Man Mountain on Oct 22, 2008 5:46 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

heh, that was pretty awesome

but why on Earth would you bring Cooper into the shoe for a big game? WHY?

...because there's already someone posing as Jacob Brumfield

by Cy Schourek on Oct 22, 2008 9:39 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

right

because the current coach is so much more successful in big games.

"If you don't get the President of the United States on that phone, you know what's gonna happen to you? You're gonna have to answer to the Coca-Cola company."

by Charlie Scrabbles on Oct 22, 2008 10:03 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

That is off-topic and irrelevant

but seriously…Tressel’s lost once vs. Michigan and has gotten to three national championships…and I’d only really blame the Florida game on him, I don’t think anyone would have taken OSU over LSU at the beginning of ’07.

And, uh, USC. Yeesh.

But still, better than Cooper. And I really liked Cooper. But he had Reggie Germany on his team. 0.0 GPA Germany.

...because there's already someone posing as Jacob Brumfield

by Cy Schourek on Oct 23, 2008 12:20 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I hope that was a dig at Cooper

vs. Michigan: Cooper 2-10-1
Tressel 6-1

Bowl Games: Cooper 3-8
Tressel 4-3

vs. Top 25: Cooper 25-28-3
Tressel 29-9

vs. Top 10: Cooper 8-12-1
Tressel 8-4

Often wrong, never uncertain.

by sidnancy on Oct 23, 2008 5:08 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Oops

All of those numbers are through last season; adjust accordingly.

Often wrong, never uncertain.

by sidnancy on Oct 23, 2008 5:09 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

sure

but what have you done for me lately?

"If you don't get the President of the United States on that phone, you know what's gonna happen to you? You're gonna have to answer to the Coca-Cola company."

by Charlie Scrabbles on Oct 23, 2008 5:13 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

oh snap!

Sweater vest apologists will point to his success in the big ten and against michigan…

but michigan sucks…everyone beats them.

also, the big 10 sucks. If OSU were in the Big 12 or the SEC, they would not have played for those three national titles.

Think of me what you will...I gotta little space to fill

by chandrathan on Oct 24, 2008 11:34 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Also if West Virginia could beat Pitt at home

OSU wouldn’t have played for the title. It’s coincidence and irrelevant.

by Brendanukkah on Oct 24, 2008 11:52 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

im calling BS

this conference strength crap is pissing me off. when OSU beats up on teams like Minnesota and Iowa and Michigan its because the league is weak. but when Florida loses to Ole Miss and USC loses to Oregon State and LSU loses to UK and Arkansas its because their conferences are so deep. what gives?

we cant judge conference strength based on what happens in conference play. it just doesnt work like that. the only way to judge to look at what happens in bowl games and non-conference games. and the Big Ten has stacked up pretty well against the powers of the SEC and the PAC 10 and the Big 12. sure, OSU has been destroyed in its last 3 big non-conference games and Michigan and Illinois have been embarrassed in the Rose Bowl the past few years, but when any of the 2nd tier teams match up the Big Ten has a favorable record. i dont have those numbers on me right now as this is more of a rant than an argument, but you can look it up if you dont believe me.

"If you don't get the President of the United States on that phone, you know what's gonna happen to you? You're gonna have to answer to the Coca-Cola company."

by Charlie Scrabbles on Oct 24, 2008 11:53 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

well i guess conference stregth arguments should piss you off

if you are a fan of a team in the weak big 10

Think of me what you will...I gotta little space to fill

by chandrathan on Oct 24, 2008 12:05 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs

ZING!

And a rec for not capitalizing the b.

"Aio, quantitas magna frumentorum est."

by jch24 on Oct 24, 2008 1:04 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

The Mariners have hired Brewers special assistant

Jack Zduriencik as their new GM. That’s good news for the rest of the NL Central. Zduriencik has masterminded some terrific drafting with Milwaukee.

We Are ... Marshall!

by Thundering Turtle on Oct 22, 2008 5:56 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Everyone see

that Jim Bowden has skin cancer? I wonder if they’ll be anything left of him after it’s removed.

Vote Pops in '08. I promise nothing and I'll do it!

by Pops Daniels on Oct 22, 2008 6:40 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Bruce

I think you take Bruce. He’s going to be very good just like Longoria. No regrets.

by jamesp50014 on Oct 22, 2008 7:17 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

some deep thinking there james

But I need to know…..why Egypt?

by jacob brumfield on Oct 23, 2008 9:17 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Egypt

Came here for many reasons. A good job (I teach writing at a university), always wanted to live abroad in a place truly foreign, and, you know, since 2001 we’ve been told a lot about Arabs and Muslims, and I wanted to have a look for myself.

Also? Ballfields down the street.

by jamesp50014 on Oct 23, 2008 5:23 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

nice

sounds like you’re enjoying it…..any plans on moving back? how are the ladies? is the food really as bad as everyone says? and how are these Arabs and Muslims treating you?

Pencils down in ten minutes.

by jacob brumfield on Oct 24, 2008 12:29 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Well,

to reply:

1. We definitely plan to move back eventually. We’re on our third year here and I’m beginning to get curious to live at home again.
2. The ladies are just fine, thank you. Very pretty.
3. The Egyptian cuisine is lacking, although it has its bright spots. Fortunately I have enough money that I can eat like a Westerner. Top-notch cappuccino just down the street.
4. The Arabs and Muslims are treating me okay. Egyptians are known for their friendliness and petty scams. Sometimes these things are happening simultaneously, which is pretty funny. But I don’t worry about my safety, unless I’m in a taxi.

by jamesp50014 on Oct 24, 2008 5:54 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs