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Who's the NL MVP?

Since the powers that be have decided to fill the playoffs with off days I thought we could start debating awards. Despite the capriciousness of the official voters I'm always interested in these. I have little inclination to try to predict the horserace or to engage in semantical arguments about value (although if that's your cup of tea, have at it).

This year there will be no Morneau-over-Jeter/Mauer for statheads to rally behind. The pool of candidates in the NL is very even and any could make a good choice. Whichever player you favor, another bests him some way.

I'm looking at what I consider to be the 10 leading candidates (with apologies to Jake Peavey). I've included their slash stats (AVG/OBP/SLG), OPS+ to give some indication of park factors, Runs Created and Value Over Replacement Player to account for playing time and positional adjustment, Win Shares (THT) and Wins Above Replacement Player (level 1) to tie it all together and Jinaz's +/- runs translations of the Hardball Times fielding data (that's DEF below. I wanted to included mgl's UZR, but I couldn't find the numbers for a couple players). I'll also mention stolen bases when relevant. The candidates in alphabetical order:

Miguel Cabrera
320/401/565 OPS+ 152 RC 135 VORP 71.4 DEF -10.8 WS 30 WARP 9.1

Cabrera turned in an awesome season. If he were a strong defender he would be poised to take this, but he's a first baseman in waiting. He's near the top of the advanced metrics, but there's no compelling reason to favor him over other candidates. Also his team sucked and the player to his immediate left on the infield steals some of his thunder.

Prince Fielder
288/395/618 OPS+ 157 RC 126 VORP 69.1 DEF -11.0 WS 28 WARP 6.9

Prince took a huge step forward this year, but he looks a little outclassed among this year's top seasons. His offensive production is below some on this list and he plays a bad first base. He's the Brewer candidate and a few weeks ago it looked like he might win. Given that Milwaukee missed the playoffs he'll probably get little love now.

Matt Holliday
340/405/607 OPS+ 151 RC 125 VORP 75.0 DEF +8.3 WS 30 WARP 10.1

By powering the Rockies run to the playoffs Holliday fits a nifty story angle, but he's a solid pick even without that. He's a good defender (that brutal play in the play-in game notwithstanding) and he was worth 7-10 wins for a team that needed them all. If you like batting average that .340 is mighty tasty.

Ryan Howard
268/392/584 OPS+ 145 RC 117 VORP 53.6 DEF -7.8 WS 26 WARP 6.4

The defending champ won't likely repeat. Howard missed some time this year and saw his rate stats drop. Like Fielder he's a statue at first. He still put up a very solid season, but there's probably two teammates ahead of him.

Chipper Jones
337/425/604 OPS+ 166 RC 117 VORP 76.0 DEF +13.3 WS 26 WARP 8.7
This one surprised me. I wouldn't have included Chipper until I saw him second on David Gassko's ballot. Turns out he led the league in OPS. He's still a good defender which might make him a better choice than fellow third baseman Cabrera. The Braves' continued fall from relevance likely hurts him.

Albert Pujols
327/429/568 OPS+ 158 RC 123 VORP 72.1 DEF +30.3 WS 32 WARP 11.3

How's this for a surprise? All we heard all year is that this is a down year for Pujols, but really look at him. He saves a ton of runs with his glove, even playing first. He leads the league in WARP. His slugging is down (hurting all the fantasy players who took him first) but that could be because of New Busch Field. The Cardinals fell from their lofty 83 wins of last year which likely removes him from the discussion. But take your favorite pick for NL MVP and really compare him to down-year Albert and your guy probably comes up short.

Hanley Ramirez
332/386/562 OPS+ 147 RC 127 VORP 89.5 DEF -22.0 WS 29 WARP 8.7 (51 SB 14 CS)

Hanley put up first baseman level offense as a shortstop, which is why he kills everyone in VORP. That's balanced out by his atrocious defense--he's the Derek Jeter of the NL. However unlike Jeter Hanley isn't on a winning team. If you don't mind his D he's a solid choice.

Jimmy Rollins
296/345/531 OPS+ 122 RC 122 VORP 66.1 DEF -3.0 WS 28 WARP 9.4 (41 SB 6 CS)

Rollins seems to be the choice for people who want to celebrate the Phillies overtaking the Mets. His offense isn't close to Hanley's, but his defense is better. Even with Chase Utley's missed time it's debatable who was more valuable to their team.

Chase Utley
332/410/566 OPS+ 147 RC 108 VORP 68.8 DEF +20.2 WS 28 WARP 9.6

If Utley hadn't broken his hand in July he wouldn't probably be tops. Despite only playing 132 games he might have outproduced Rollins. He puts up great offensive numbers while playing the best second base in the league (ok, maybe it's Brandon Phillips).

David Wright
325/416/546 OPS+ 152 RC 136 VORP 81.1 DEF +28.8 WS 34 WARP 11.2 (34 SB 5 CS)

Wright leads the league in Win Shares and Runs Created. He trails only the defensively challenged Hanley Ramirez in VORP. Pujols edges him in WARP by 0.1. He plays great defense. He steals bases at a fantastic rate. But the Mets collapse will likely cost him the award, even though Wright OPSed over 1000 during the September swoon. He's my choice.

 

Poll
Who's your NL MVP
Chase Utley
0 votes
David Wright
12 votes
Other
2 votes
Miguel Cabrera
0 votes
Prince Fielder
3 votes
Matt Holliday
24 votes
Ryan Howard
0 votes
Chipper Jones
0 votes
Albert Pujols
6 votes
Hanley Ramirez
0 votes
Jimmy Rollins
3 votes

50 votes | Poll has closed

Comment 44 comments  |  0 recs  | 

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Comments

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Co-MVP's
NorJeff Hoppinger.

ha.

Find me on MySpace- http://www.myspace.com/mixfmkyle

by MixFMKyle on Oct 11, 2007 2:06 PM EDT reply actions  

boobs
If Krivsky doesn't exercise Adam Dunn's 2008 option, I'm a Mets fan until they fire him.

by Paul Householder on Oct 11, 2007 2:17 PM EDT reply actions  

Pujols
DEF +30.3

Call me any derisive name you want, but a defensive metric that shows any 1B saves 30 runs/season (more than 1/wk) is wrong.

just....wow.

by sidnancy on Oct 11, 2007 2:18 PM EDT reply actions  

Wright
Pretty hard to beat him when you look at the bat, glove and baserunning.  He's also a marketable NY player, but I'm sure part of the collateral damage of the Mets' collapse will be him losing the MVP.  Not his fault though - he hit 352/432/602/1.034 in September.

by ken on Oct 11, 2007 2:38 PM EDT reply actions  

i would ok with anyone of them here
but rollins.  and he will probably get it.  he's in the mid-lower quadrant of the field in just about every category.  my ballot:
  1. Holliday
  2. Wright
  3. Harang
  4. Dick Pole
at least this isnt pittsburgh

by Charlie Scrabbles on Oct 11, 2007 3:00 PM EDT reply actions  

Helton
I know he's not MVP, but he was fairly instrumental in leading the Rockies to one of the more ridiculous comebacks I've seen.

worth giving him props, but that's about it.

by bobestes on Oct 11, 2007 3:09 PM EDT reply actions  

Massive props to you Todd Helton
I'm not superstitious...but I am a little stitious.

by Slyde on Oct 11, 2007 3:31 PM EDT up reply actions  

So far Helton is not clutch in the NLCS
But he has probably done as much as any Colorado player to catapult the Rockies to the play-offs. If they win the WS and if he gets going again then he woul be really be a MVP. I've always thought the MVP doesn't mean best player in the league but rather the most valuable asset to a team. Especially if he makes the difference in how the team fares re. winning and going to post season. You can have the best stats but if you don't influence the outcome of your team's final standing then you aren't that valuable.
How long 'til Spring Training?

by Madville on Oct 12, 2007 1:25 AM EDT up reply actions  

post season
I don't think post season success should have any bearing. That's what the World Series MVP award is for.

by Red Menace on Oct 12, 2007 2:02 AM EDT up reply actions  

I agree, but I'm not sure that
Post season play isn't influential in the voting.
How long 'til Spring Training?

by Madville on Oct 12, 2007 9:12 AM EDT up reply actions  

BBWA votes before the playoffs start
Not that it won't affect our own voting, but the baseball writers all had their votes in before the LDS started.
I'm not superstitious...but I am a little stitious.

by Slyde on Oct 12, 2007 9:18 AM EDT up reply actions  

Alas, it's true.
The award is meant for the regular season, when regular things happen.

It's too bad we can't cast our votes a little bit later, after the big shit starts to go down.

"Hey hey! I just hit the meat jackpot!"

by Fat Vegas Alan on Oct 12, 2007 9:45 AM EDT up reply actions  

::cough:: 2004 ::cough::
And a big retroactive "Fuck you, America!" to start my day off.  Thanks, Alan!

by Brendanukkah on Oct 12, 2007 9:55 AM EDT up reply actions  

You're right.
I guess we did kinda make our bed and now we've gotta get bent over the kitchen table and then thrown down on the linoleum.
"Hey hey! I just hit the meat jackpot!"

by Fat Vegas Alan on Oct 12, 2007 11:22 AM EDT up reply actions  

I was going to make a joke about Bush's VORP
but then I remembered that his current value over the replacement President is still positive.  And then I thought, aren't most Presidents VORPs positive?  I mean, until Kucinich is elected VP, the  President is always going to have a higher value than his replacement, right?  Even Nixon had a positive VORP because of Agnew.  Though, I guess his VORP dropped after Watergate.
I'm not superstitious...but I am a little stitious.

by Slyde on Oct 12, 2007 3:24 PM EDT up reply actions  

Maybe not William McKinley
His replacement ended up on Mt. Rushmore.  Dee-lighted!

Although McKinley is responsible for the scarlet carnation being named the state flower of Ohio (it was a favorite of his - he was wearing one when he was shot - and it was named the state flower in 1904 to honor him).  So, the best thing McKinley did was help dictate Ohio State's colors, and have America's tallest mountain named after him.  Eh, maybe it's a push.

by Brendanukkah on Oct 12, 2007 3:41 PM EDT up reply actions  

It doesn't work if you have a specific replacement
in mind...
Lex Luthor?!? That man's my sworn enemy! I mean...uh...Who's That Dude?

by chandrathan on Oct 12, 2007 4:10 PM EDT up reply actions  

kucinich is awesome.
screw you.

:P

Everybody's a jerk. You. Me. This jerk.

by andromache on Oct 12, 2007 4:18 PM EDT up reply actions  

I'm fairly certain
Slyde's post was complimentary of Kucinich.

by Red Menace on Oct 13, 2007 2:36 AM EDT up reply actions  

haha, oh crap
i read good.
Everybody's a jerk. You. Me. This jerk.

by andromache on Oct 13, 2007 3:27 AM EDT up reply actions  

Speaking of 2nd Bannas How about that Gore Guy?
Makes a movie, Gets an Oscar, Wins the Nobel Prize...next thing you HE'LL be running for president.
How long 'til Spring Training?

by Madville on Oct 12, 2007 11:59 PM EDT up reply actions  

Don't think so
I'm pretty sure that MVP and the other award ballots are due before the playoffs begin.  Can't find a reputable link, though.

by ken on Oct 12, 2007 9:21 AM EDT up reply actions  

For those of us who like some clutchiness...
Here are these guys' WPAs...


Fielder    5.24
Holliday   5.06
Pujols     4.65
Cabrera    4.61
Chipper    4.23
Wright     4.09
Utley      3.78
Howard     3.48
Rollins    3.20
Hanley     2.45

All in all, prince pimped his style at the best moments, for whatever that's worth to you.

its so hard for me not to pick holliday this year, but he does have some pretty severe home/road splits. wright's gotta get the edge.

Marty may have a shirt on, but Billy Beane just ripped his off and is squeezing his nipples. - Brendan's ukkah

by boobs on Oct 11, 2007 4:18 PM EDT reply actions  

Matt Holiday is the NL MVP!
Although I think Howard had a better season than Rollins because when he came off the DL is when the Philles really started to roll!
Killer Tucans all the way!!!

by Zach K on Oct 11, 2007 5:10 PM EDT reply actions  

Zach,
you're wrong.  Howard came off the DL in late May.  The Phillies were 15-13 in May.  Same record in June, even with Howard back and playing well.  Then they played about .600 ball the rest of the way.  Why the improvement?  No Lieber or Garcia in the rotation + Romero acquired + Myers and Gordon getting healthy --> second half ERA dropped by half a run.

by ken on Oct 11, 2007 5:29 PM EDT up reply actions  

Wright or wrong
I really think Fielder gets it, if voting in Ryan Howard last year was any guide. Large, left handed black first basemen with lots of homeruns seem to impress voters.

It is pretty hard to see an MVP voted in from a non-contender, so I think that Hanley and Cabrera are out. Plus, they both "sleep with the fishes".

Rollins, maybe, because he is known as a "hustle" player and had a career year in 2007.

Utley: maybe, but the Philly vote may be split between Rollins and Utley.

Pujols: no, because he's won it before with a contender.

Chipper: no, because he's a Brave and doesn't like New York City, so that faction is against him

Wright: Sure he had a great year, but the Mets just left a bad taste in the million mouths of the Metroplis Met fans.  MMMMMno.

Holliday: not enough hair, plus he plays in flyover country, Colorado.  If he had announced he was gay, he might have won it.  Next year, better marketing.

My karma just ran over your dogma

by Lonesome George on Oct 11, 2007 5:14 PM EDT reply actions  

If we don't do AL MVP
Mine would be Curtis Granderson!!! jk I have to go with A-Rod but I hate the guy so much that my serious choice is Carlos Pena because he came up big when the D-Rays needed him...instead of a really shitty team, they finished a shitty team. So Congrats Mr.Pena you get the Zach AL MVP award!
Killer Tucans all the way!!!

by Zach K on Oct 11, 2007 5:21 PM EDT reply actions  

I'll post AL maybe tomorrow
I wanted to bring this up to you though. Did you know Granderson was the least clutch player in baseball by just about any measure? Spin that round the ol' noggin.

by Red Menace on Oct 11, 2007 8:21 PM EDT up reply actions  

also
he apparently is a HUGE fan of the new ABC comedy "Cavemen".  

lose respect much?

at least this isnt pittsburgh

by Charlie Scrabbles on Oct 11, 2007 8:26 PM EDT up reply actions  

I kind of liked the pilot
Haven't seen the second episode. I better hurray because it probably won't last long.

by Red Menace on Oct 11, 2007 8:29 PM EDT up reply actions  

Really?
I thought the pilot was bad.  Really bad.  Monumentally bad.

I read a good review that said that the show would be a lot better if it just lost the Cavemen.  Keep the same characters, but give up the useless caveman schtick.  It really provides nothing necessary to the story and it make some parts awkward because they work with a lot of assumptions that they haven't established.  I agree.

Plus, I don't remember anything about it that I thought was funny.  And I like the Geico commercials.

I'm not superstitious...but I am a little stitious.

by Slyde on Oct 11, 2007 8:46 PM EDT up reply actions  

I'm open to the idea
that I could be way wrong on this. Everyone seems to hate it (I haven't seen a positive review). I just really like the joke (admittedly it's the only joke) that the cavemen have adopted a hipster aesthetic. One review I read complained that the show made only mild attempts at racial satire, but to me the main satire is aimed at our boho arugula-belt consumer culture. The cavemen could be characters in a Wes Anderson movie, or the guys from Entourage (or me).

A thing I thought was funny:
"This place is really cool."
"Yeah, if you like hanging out with pretentious posers. Can I have a tall soy machiatto and a cranberry biscotti?"

by Red Menace on Oct 11, 2007 9:11 PM EDT up reply actions  

I guess
but it seemed to me the jokes were predictable.  I felt like I could have written the pilot, and I don't think that says much for the writers.

And your description still shows that the show could be done without cavemen and probably would be a better show.  I think the cavemen thing is too much of a gimmick that it overshadows what could be a mediocre idea.

I'm not superstitious...but I am a little stitious.

by Slyde on Oct 11, 2007 10:16 PM EDT up reply actions  

I haven't seen the show..
..but the Geiko commercials remind me of American Psycho.

"Hey hey! I just hit the meat jackpot!"

by Fat Vegas Alan on Oct 11, 2007 10:34 PM EDT up reply actions  

mmmm
(...)
Everybody's a jerk. You. Me. This jerk.

by andromache on Oct 12, 2007 12:57 AM EDT up reply actions  

ive seen both episodes that have aired
and im kind of on the fence, leaning toward liking it.  the sight gag of having cavemen work at ikea and write dissertations is already a bit tired, but they are making some mild attempts at racial satire.  the way they spear the boho shit is really the crux of the show, and i think if they take it in that direction it could really take off.  but i agree with slyde about the caveman thing; if it doesnt start pulling its weight the show would be better off without it.  its interesting enough that im going to watch the next few episodes.

the biggest problem is the way ABC is marketing it.  the "make a man date" song does nothing to sell the show and is stupidly lame.  in Zach's "good to very very great" scale, it would be a "very not so good".

at least this isnt pittsburgh

by Charlie Scrabbles on Oct 12, 2007 10:13 AM EDT up reply actions  

That is why he is a good player but not great
He is not a player you build a line up around, he needs to work on that part of his game.

Didn't he hit a walkoff off stormy last season though?

Killer Tucans all the way!!!

by Zach K on Oct 11, 2007 9:52 PM EDT up reply actions  

nah
He tied the game in the ninth.  Monroe won it in the tenth on a throwing error by Felipe Lopez.  And I left the park with my head held in shame as Tigers fans taunted me.
I'm not superstitious...but I am a little stitious.

by Slyde on Oct 11, 2007 10:11 PM EDT up reply actions  

Oh that right
That sucks for you man, Weathers seemed to give up lots of tying and walk off HRs last year

I'm still pissed about the Pujols Walk Off from last year! I saw it coming a mile away as well but damn...

Killer Tucans all the way!!!

by Zach K on Oct 12, 2007 6:52 PM EDT up reply actions  

He really needs to work on
the "hitting lefthanders" part of the game, but whatever.

by Red Menace on Oct 11, 2007 10:55 PM EDT up reply actions  

The Great Wright Hope
I new his RC was high, but I had no idea his WARP was that good. If the Mets win 2 more games, he's probably a slam dunk.

He's my choice.

"Two Dunn's enter, but only one Dunn will leave...unless neither do because they decide to play cards, drink beer, golf, and fish."--SlydeFrog

by Man Mountain on Oct 11, 2007 5:42 PM EDT reply actions  

this is one instance where
being on a winning team matters.  holliday won, rollins lost, and they were pretty even.  so edge goes to holliday, who busted his face up to get into the playoffs.

by Daedalus on Oct 13, 2007 4:35 PM EDT reply actions  

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