I've Never Been To This Site Before...

by San Diego Smooth Jazz Man @ Red Reporter on Aug 10, 2005 10:48 PM EDT

....and as a Cubs fan, I don't understand "JD's" hatred of a team that hurts nobody...but their own fans....constantly. I don't understand the venom, perhaps I've missed something. I have no reason to hate the Reds. It seems that other Central Division teams should despise the Cards, not the Cubs. This doesn't make any sense to me. is it because we travel well? Is it because we care, even when we are always thrown under the bus by the team we follow as if they were the Grateful Dead, from city to city?

Can JD clue me in?

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Whoa, take it easy

I think we've had this conversation on this site before. The Cubs are harmless, and nobody hates them as much as JD proclaims. I think he means that he hates losing to the measly Cubs, but he can probably clue you in himself. And I think it does have a lot to do with the fans popping up everywhere. My wife is a Cubs fan, and we get along. Although she gets really annoyed when I laugh after the Cubs have one of their patented meltdowns.

I, for one, hate the Cardinals more than any other team. I hate Tony LaRussa. I hate Jim Edmonds. And I hate Cardinal fans - the dumbest fans in sports.

Brian B

by Brian B on Aug 10, 2005 11:05 PM EDT reply actions

Cubs

I'm not sure why a lot of Reds fans dislike the lovable losers from the Windy City.

Hate is a strong word, used by a lot of us toward the Cubs. I'm not sure why I don't like them. They have never done anything to me and have pretty much been harmless as a team my entire lifetime. They have had some great ballplayers over the years (as well as some vastly over rated ones) that have been fun to watch. The people from Chicago and the fans of the Cubs that I have met and know personally are all, without exception great folks, But... I just don't like the Cubs. I don't care about their cult following, ala The Grateful Dead, or their perceived "caring".

I'm not sure why a lot of Reds fans dislike the lovable losers from the Windy City.

"Baseball is a simple game. You throw the ball, you hit the ball, you catch the ball." ~Manager Joe "Skip" Riggins, Durham Bulls

by Caleb on Aug 11, 2005 8:38 AM EDT reply actions

Don't hate any team

I don't understand it either. I don't hate any particular team. There are only 2 or 3 players that I really don't like, and don't want to see play, but otherwise I know that most of the players love the game and love the fans no matter where they're playing. I hate it when the Reds lose to any team, not just the Cubs, but I don't hate the Cubs for winning. What are they supposed to do, lose on purpose so that I'll like them?

I "hate" the Yankees like every non-New Yorker should, but only because they have such a great dynasty, and keep winning, and have such a huge fan/money base. But if the Reds were in a similar situation, I wouldn't mind one bit, so I can't blame the Yankees for doing what they do.

I don't hate the Cubs or the Cards, but it does annoy me when a large group of Cubs (or any team) fans come to GABP for a game and cheer like they are the home team (especially when the Reds are losing).

I actually like Dusty Baker and the Cubs franchise alot. If I weren't such a die-hard Reds fan for life, I would consider the Cubs as my next choice.

However, if "hate" is used simply as a tool to make a rivalry more interesting, then I have no problem with it, so long as it doesn't go too far.

"Players have two things to do. Play and keep their mouths shut." -Sparky Anderson

by boohiss on Aug 11, 2005 10:43 AM EDT reply actions

Cubs

There are many, many obnoxious Cubs fans to be found online. Combine that with the many, many obnoxious Cubs fans that you find in stadiums across the country and you'll start to have an idea of why I dislike the Cubs so much.

I also have a problem with the casual Cub fan who seems to care more about the glory of Wrigley Field than they do the success of their favorite team.

I know that all Cubs fans aren't like this, so don't feel like you have to point that out SDSJM. There are just enough to make me dislike the team quite a bit.

It's all in good fun though. As long as the Cubs suck at least.

We are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars. --Oscar Wilde

by JD Arney on Aug 11, 2005 1:27 PM EDT reply actions

Wrigley

You're right about the Wrigley Field bit. I think I'd robably do the same thing if I were them, but I wouldn't then turn around and act like my team is great BEACAUSE of the great ball park.

I walked out my door about 30 minutes ago to go get some Dunkin Donuts coffee and a bagel, and the neighborhood is crawling with Cardinals fans. They're all wearing their Red shirts, red hats, and red shorts. I swear everyone in St. Louis has someone in the family who owns a corner fan shop. But none of these fans have any kind of baseball knowledge that comes from anywhere outside the city of St. Louis.

It's days like these that make me appreciate Cubs fans.

Brian B

by Brian B on Aug 11, 2005 1:36 PM EDT up reply actions

I forgot to mention . . .

I live a few blocks from Wrigley.and the Cubs are playing the Cards this afternoon. So that should explain why there are Cardinals fans everywhere.

Brian B

by Brian B on Aug 11, 2005 1:37 PM EDT up reply actions

Home Field Disadvatage.

I'd have to agree with JD. I have quit attending Reds games when the Cubs come to town. It just annoys me when the "Let Go Cubbies" chant starts up in "our" ballpark. I've gone to a few Reds games abroad and I never go crazy and start chanting for the Reds and heckling their players on their field.

by snohio on Aug 14, 2005 10:39 AM EDT up reply actions

Well...

I'd rather play in a concrete hell-hole ala Oakland if that's what it takes to win something -- anything!
Hey, I like Wrigley Field. There is a purity, and simplicity to the place because after all -- it along with Fenway Park and Yankee Stadium are filled with history. (With Wrigley, it all hasn't been WONDERFUL history for the home team)
But the stadium does NOT come before the team for me, so, JD -- I'm not at all in agreement with the line of thought you say you have heard. In fact, I've never heard that expressed. I do wonder, however what the situation would be if Wrigley had met with the wrecking ball in the 1970's and the team moved to a concrete bowl in the suburbs -- would losing teams have been tolerated? Would the fan base have eroded? (Probably not, given the rise of Superstation WGN) Hm, I'll bet it would have been demolished by now...and a 'retro' park would have been constructed.

However -- what's the feeling with the Red Sox? After all, their history (until now) has been laden with futility. Do Reds fans...hate the Red Sox?

It's the same situation, you just don't have to play the Red Sox, except in a WS every 30 years or so.

Again, I see no reason for ANY opposition fans to hate the Cubs. (With the exception of White Sox fans, for they have an unbelieveable inferiority complex) I hear your reasons, but it still doesn't make sense. I bet I'll find some drunken, stupid Reds fans at the next Reds/Padres game I attend here in San Diego. Hate the Yankees -- their fans are about as smug as they come. And don't get me started on the Inbreds that follow the Cards.

Perhaps some readers here might want to surf Bleed Cubbie Blue to see our mind-set...

by San Diego Smooth Jazz Man @ Red Reporter on Aug 12, 2005 12:33 AM EDT reply actions

Jazz Man

Red Sox fans. I don't think it has ever come up on this site. I can't stand them. I went to college up there, and those boneheads know every little freaking detail about their own team and history, a lot about the Yankees, and absolutely nothing about anything else. They've gotten themselves so obsessed over the years that they've lost all sense of reality.

I don't see how you think it's the same situation as the Cubs. Read my post here ("Kyle and Day Ball"):

http://www.redreporter.com/story/2005/8/11/131743/073#commenttop

The Red Sox are a part of everyone's lives up there for a different reason. Baseball itself is not a daily part of their lives like it is in Chicago - being inferior to New Yorkers is. They can't just appreciate the fact that they have a storied ballpark or a baseball tradition, or that they can get Red Sox home coverage on national television every night from Peter Gammons. No, they use baseball as a way to feel sorry for themselves year after year.

I'd feel bad for you and for all Cubs fans if they tore Wrigley down, built a stadium in the suburbs, and finally won their WS. Yay, good for you for selling out your identity and winning like you are the '97 Marlins.

Brian B

by Brian B on Aug 12, 2005 1:34 AM EDT up reply actions

On the Cubs

I don't hate any team (except the Yankees). One of the results of realignment is that the Reds have no natural rival. The Dodgers were a heated rivalry in the 70s but that was before my time. Because the Reds have been pretty bad since the switch no rivalry has sprung up (I do get annoyed when the Brewers are ahead of us. In fact, the Brewers in general piss me off because they seem out of place in the NL).

That said I understand some slight animosity toward the Cubs. They have a national TV contract which might give some competitive advantage (and it's really annoying when you can't see your team but you can see the Cubs or Braves), they travel well (which is respectable but can annoy), and the party atmosphere/frat boy environment that overtakes some parts of Wrigley is very different than the baseball environment anywhere else.

I went to school in Chicago and enjoyed many games at Wrigley. I didn't even take much flak for sporting Reds gear (I wasn't in the bleachers). In 2003 I thought the bandwagon was a little ridiculous, but it probably would have been anywhere under similar situations. I just felt like the team was portayed as some juggernaut of destiny that was only derailed by cruel fate (I wanted to shout, "You only won 89 games!")

So no, I don't hate the Cubs. Maybe I enjoy beating them a little more than, say, the Pirates to whom I'm incredibly indifferent.

by Red Menace on Aug 12, 2005 1:56 AM EDT reply actions

Hatred overestimated

I, too, hate only the Yankees. I'm a transplanted Hoosier living in New York. From the perspective of a kid growing up in Indianapolis in the 70's, you rooted either for the Cubs or the Reds, and the Reds were closer geographically. Plus it was the mid-70's; which team would you root for? So I became a Reds fan. But I never hated the Cubs. For one thing, the Cubs and Reds have only been in the same division since the mid-90's realignment. So rooting against the Cubs was nowhere near as satisfying when I was growing up as rooting against the Dodgers or Astros or Giants (yes, there was a time when the Reds/Dodgers rivalry nearly matched the Giants/Dodgers).
When you factor in the rest of the Cubs' charm, including the legendary ballpark, the legendary lack of winning, the history (from Tinkers to Evers to Chance to present) and characters from Mordecai Brown to Hack Wilson to Gabby Hartnett to Ernie Banks to Harry Caray etc., you can see why it might be hard to really hate the organization. The Cubs have all the PR advantages of an historical franchise that has always been interesting, yet never really threatening. Even their name unwillingly follows this pattern: they are fierce, but also cuddly. And how can you hate that?

by ctnyc on Aug 14, 2005 2:30 AM EDT reply actions